FREE fiat x1/9 carcass with title - Detriot

"Plenty of rust repair is turning up. No surprise really."

The true cost of Free  But you will know what you got when you remove it all and worth it in the end. Much better than what appears to be solid but has the tin worm eating away at it. These cars are so good looking and with an engine swap can be amazing so your hard work will be rewarded.

Today, I took the Daily Driver to a local shop to replace the AC compressor that has been rattling. 

This was outside:

I also stopped at a place that has 3 rusty X1/9s and a couple of second gen MR2s outside, and left a note asking if the person wanted to sell any parts. We'll see. That's 5 X1/9s I saw today.

Not a lot of real progress today, but I did things essential to moving the project forward.

First, I left work early, and got welding gas, wire, and a new grinding shield.

Once home, I did another trial fit of the engine.

Above, from behind the car:

Above from in the car:

And finally, from the cockpit:

Still have to come up some 10"

Much beard scratching ensued. It looks like I have quite a bit of surgery ahead. Both frame rails need to move out, and the one above the transmission needs to come up 6-1/2". Yowza.

This all brought me to a screeching halt. 

Time to spend some quality time with the grinder and let this thing tell me what it needs.

A question: Why can't I get the drivers side axle out of the transmission? I'm afraid to go full caveman on it, though I know that given much more fight, I will.

Bear with me here folks. Big update with little progress, but lots of pictures.

I had yet to see this car at anywhere near ride height, and I thought some glamour mock up shots were in order on this sunny, 70 degree afternoon.

This is not intentionally stanced. Not much room under there.

Those furniture dollies are right at 5". Looks like a reasonable ride height to me.

In reply to wheelsmithy :

Dang, X1/9s local....  Between that or an 850, that's the current DM "fantasy" build- similar to what you are already doing with your car.

In reply to wheelsmithy :

Motivating pics.

The stance and wheels are perfect. 

Those wheels are sick!

Also, ten more inches up? That's crazy. How did you arrive at that figure? To me it looks like you're almost home (assuming you can let the trans hang under the frame rail).

Maybe there is a skinnier trans option? I looked hard at a Honda jswap for a little bit and iirc the distance between x frame rails is about 33 inches and the Honda j35 with auto trans is about 36 inches wide. So that was a no go. It almost looks like your engine and trans is longer! 

(Which would sort of make sense since a 4cyl is theoretically longer than a v6, but I would have thought the auto trans was a lot larger - maybe not?)

Robbie said:

Those wheels are sick!

Also, ten more inches up? That's crazy. How did you arrive at that figure? To me it looks like you're almost home (assuming you can let the trans hang under the frame rail).

Maybe there is a skinnier trans option? I looked hard at a Honda jswap for a little bit and iirc the distance between x frame rails is about 33 inches and the Honda j35 with auto trans is about 36 inches wide. So that was a no go. It almost looks like your engine and trans is longer! 

(Which would sort of make sense since a 4cyl is theoretically longer than a v6, but I would have thought the auto trans was a lot larger - maybe not?)

He needs to change the intake to the Neon one.  All of the fittings and bits will transfer over if they aren't already included on the other intake.

The drivers frame rail needs to move up. It's essentially the same transaxle as used since the 90's in nearly every FWD Chrysler product.  When I was working on mine, I had the same issue and the frame rail had to move about 4-6 inches and the passenger side was tight but could work.

unfortunately,  there's no other transaxle options for that drivetrain as the Auto is even larger in some dimensions.

Move/rebuild the driver's side frame rail, change the intake to a Neon or Stratus unit and you'll be in better shape.

The driver's side control arm will be interesting and I vote for using the PT uprights to make it easier to mate it all together in the rear.  Front can be Neon pieces with the CV joint cut off for just a stub axle.  Neon dampers and adjustable coil spring perches might get you where you need to be for height.

That thing is looking goood!

The color, height, wheels and tires are spot on!

And we're working on an intake swap.....

Dusterbd13-michael said:

The color, height, wheels and tires are spot on!

And we're working on an intake swap.....

Yes we are. I just have to get down to pick the intake up from Duster/Michael, up to get Springs, sleeves and inserts from Nonack, and keep working on the plan. When I go visit Michael, I'll look at Neon transmissions, but I feel this one can be made to work. The rust repair I mentioned earlier keeps expanding, and I haven't even started thinking about the cosmetic.

In answer to Robbie, I came up with 10" assuming the oil pan and pinch welds hit the ground at the same time. You are right in stating that the oil pan could hang lower. Honestly, I hadn't even checked  vertical wheel/axle centers. I'm just roughing it all in at the moment. Good call, though. Needs another look. 

All kind words and suggestions appreciated folks. This is a fairly intense section of the build.

Today, two inner rocker patch plates got made via percussive shaping.

And the rough cuts made. These two pieces were 7 lbs. total. I'm porking the thing up pretty quickly. I'll have to find some thinner sheet metal for later projects.

The weight added in stiffness and safety is not porking up. Its ounces well spent. 

Over the last couple of days, I've been doing stuff.

Like welding in a new driver's central rocker,

which pulled my door gap out of whack.

After cursing myself a bit, I cut two relief slots,

and ratchet strapped things back into shape before welding in the bracing I should've done before.

After welding up the two relief cuts, I did this:

The thing is, being a Fiat, the rust went into the outer rocker as well.

Which I patched like so:

The sharp eyed among you may notice the vertical relief cut I made because the heat from the cutting wheel, along with all that wrenching left the outer panel bowed rather badly. 

Don't judge me.

So, since you're already looking at getting the inserts and coilover stuff from me- how much other MR2 suspension stuff do you need?  I don't have any spare strut housings, but looking through my spares it looks like I have hubs, some suspension links, brakes, maybe some other bits.  Anything in particular you might want to pick up at the same time?

I also have a mysterious tiny manual steering rack that's probably from something British or Italian.

In reply to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ :

Thanks for thinking of me. I have 4 complete corners off an '86 AW11. Axles, struts, brakes, springs, the whole enchilada, minus rack, so with the sleeves and inserts from you, should be set.

I got a call back from my local X1/9 guy, and it turns out he owns 5 or more, including this car:

(ninja edit: the interwebs didn't like me pilfering an image of this book)

It has been wrecked and rebuilt, but he says he owns the very car from THE BOOK.

Anyway, he is familiar with the challenge and has agreed to sell me some taillights, and maybe an X1/9 rack. I also have the PTGT rack that I'd really like to de-power, shorten, and use in the X. I haven't really gotten a firm grasp on rack lengths vs strut type suspension yet. I'm not sure if front suspension pick up points should move yet- I kind of hope not. K.I.S.S.

That was a long winded way of saying I'm set on MR2 suspension, but a firm maybe? on the rack.

Today, more tacking in the driver's rocker, and trying not to berkeley up.

Also, cleaning up the passenger's rocker. It will come as a surprise to no one that this one has rot through all 3 layers as well. Much smaller area, though.

Good times...

I apologize for the post tease- there are no pictures of my car here. I am still working on getting my rockers solid. In the course of picking at the the X, I am being forced to get real with some upcoming styling decisions. The long and short of it is, in addition to the obvious Fiat rust, I'm finding 1/2" thick bondo in places. Anyway, I followed a wormhole and wanted to keep some images handy for further reference. Enjoy.

In reply to wheelsmithy :

drool. This thread always makes me want to go drive my Fiat  

Here's the driver's rocker today:

Passenger's outer:

Passenger's inner:

And I've been moving forward in the tub. It was kind of a mixed bag. The front corners were surprisingly OK, but the center under the battery needed some expected cutting.

I'm slowing up on that bit. I may raise the pick up points in the chassis to correct roll centers from the planned lowering. Also, this car has had a bit of a shunt. There's some deformed metal in the passenger's floorboard. That explains the bondo on that fender,

Here's a shot of my near future:

That's a lot of tin work on a short amount of time. You're a machine, keep it coming.

Dude! So much solid metal now! 

Stefan said:

He needs to change the intake to the Neon one.  All of the fittings and bits will transfer over if they aren't already included on the other intake.

The drivers frame rail needs to move up. It's essentially the same transaxle as used since the 90's in nearly every FWD Chrysler product.  When I was working on mine, I had the same issue and the frame rail had to move about 4-6 inches and the passenger side was tight but could work.

unfortunately,  there's no other transaxle options for that drivetrain as the Auto is even larger in some dimensions.

Move/rebuild the driver's side frame rail, change the intake to a Neon or Stratus unit and you'll be in better shape.

The driver's side control arm will be interesting and I vote for using the PT uprights to make it easier to mate it all together in the rear.  Front can be Neon pieces with the CV joint cut off for just a stub axle.  Neon dampers and adjustable coil spring perches might get you where you need to be for height.

Turbo mtx PTs used the Getrag G288 trans, which means dual mass flywheel and unique clutch.  Much tougher to get parts in US from what I hear, but these are plentiful in Europe.  There are at least a couple guys who swapped to single mass flywheel and sprung clutch.

I swapped a T350 trans into mine (started as an automatic turbo PT) and am using the stock auto axles; this is the neon trans everyone is familiar with.  I don't know for sure if the Getrag axles would be compatible with a T350 - just an FYI to wheelsmithy if you want to switch transmissions, but should be able to find spline count and axle length info online.

In reply to linkinparker445 :

You, sir, are absolutely correct. I was curious about how the T350 would hold up to the turbo engine. You are having good service in a PTGT?

Below is such a transmission in GoLucky's X1/9. 

So, that looks like it would get me out of quite a bit of frame surgery. The only "downside" is 3.50 vs the 3.25 gears I have in this transmission. Totally worthwhile trade off, says I.

Today, I wanted to take it a bit easy, and just do some mocking up.

But a few minutes in, and the sawzall and grinders came out. Decisions have been made.

That's a $40 radiator from an XJ Cherokee that I eyeballed at the Pull-a-Part, and figured I could make fit.

A copy of the Project X1/9 book I referenced earlier came in the mail today. It has all kinds of neat ideas like raising control arm mounting points in the body, drawings for a dual master cylinder balance bar brake bracket, fuel cells and the like. I'm not sure how much I'll implement on this thing, due to the fact that I won't have any actual Fiat suspension on this car.

Here's a picture from that book of the car my local guy says he owns:

(I edited my above post so the cover picture actually shows up now.)

I have a 3.55 and a 3.92 trans here of the t350 variety. My understanding is that it is better to use the 3.55 for boost.

In reply to Dusterbd13-michael :

We'll  check em out when I get down there for the intake (it shouldn't be too long, now). And yes, in this car, I believe the taller the gears, the better.

I have PTGT big front brakes, uprights, struts, and springs I thought might be of interest to a connoisseur such as yourself -ok, the springs, maybe not, but the big brakes are what goes on a SRT-4, I believe. Maybe a partial trade? 

The big question here is budget. Does switching transmission mean axles, flywheel, and clutch? Budget is already getting tight, and I'm having little luck with recoup. 

Front calipers should say "TURBO" which is same as neon srt4; thicker rotors than NA pt, but same diameter.

I have a T350 from an 01 pt, so 3.94 final drive, .81 5th gear.  Fun in the sense that I can spin the tires at will, but 3.55 and .72 5th would be way more useful.  Trans has been in the car 7 or so years, so major issues.  Started with a Stratus R/T clutch (2.7L V6 cars) which was super great for a daily but slipped under boost.  Moved later to ACT 6 puck which is super great, but killed the stock hydraulic lines and flexed and cracked the firewall where the master cylinder mounts due to the heavy pedal.  The Stratus clutch is usually the go to for mildly boosted neons, so the extra weight of the PT probably did it in.  It might be good for your application.

The vehicle speed sensor is different between getrag and t350; it's still a 5 volt square wave, but roughly 16x higher frequency.  If you hook it straight into the pcm, you have no pcm boost control, so just the roughly 3psi wastegate pressure, and obviously inaccurate speedo.  I use a Dakota Digital variable frequency multiplier to modify the signal to the pcm.  You'd have the added benefit of correcting speedo for tire size.