Making the car port a working garage

I guarantee you will have significant better opportunities to bend and mangle that thing with a crane then you ever will be capable of doing by hand.

You are underestimating your concrete by a lot, but there is a way you can get away with it.

You are overlooking the footings and turned down edges. It would take a LOT more concrete to build a slab that could ever function as a building.

However, you could pour a parking pad only with no footings. Build it the dimensions of the inside of the "garage"- in other words, let the carport continue to sit on the ground like it does, with concrete ending inside. If someday in the future you ever decided to try to build a "real" garage, you could dig footings outside of the slab, and build a building around the pre-existing floor.

I might be underestimating because I'm not planning a footer. Just a 6 inch parking slab, with block 4ft knee walls on 2 sides. What I'm overlooking and probably should be considering is digging a footer for where the block will be laid on the 2 sides. Still thinking about whether I need or it would be worth rodding and filling the block.

As it sits now, I get rain and snow about 3ft in from the open edges 95% of the time, so I'm planning on leaving the front and back open. That could increase with a rise in height so I'll have to watch out. At most I might get some of the plastic I used to make greenhouses from and make a roll up door. It's something like 15mil woven plastic, treated to resist UV and condensation, but also clear to let light through. It likes to be stretched tight, but I think it will make a good door/wall.

Regardless of how though, knowing I need to raise the roof to fit a lift inside is causing headaches. Right now I think the easiest way will be 4 to 6 guys just picking it up at the corners and maybe middle, and moving it, pour cement, lay block, and putting it back. Putting it back should only require getting one end started up and then towing on to the block. Could probably set up a nice ramp system on either side to really help.

To get the height needed for a lift pouring inside the car port, we'd either have to move the whole car port, pour an extension and lay block later, or, take the roof off add height and put the roof back on. Putting the roof back on seems more of a pain than moving the whole car port. Unless we tore the roof apart and rebuilt it, which would still be a pain, but wouldn't require any machinery. Hmm, my old boss had a 22ft A Frame ladder, putting a pulley on top could help raise and move the roof...

I only want to do this once, which is why I started the build thread when I started putting money away, so I can get thoughts and advice to consider. What I've noticed though discussing with friends, so I'm sure happens here, is that I can't explain things properly so both sides get kind of confused. My power is currently out, because apparently the storms we had all week were fine, but a bright sunny day is to too much to handle, but when it comes back on I'm going attempt to draw some stuff up in auto cad or sketchup. I used to be really good with cad, it seems a lot has changed since college, but I think some drawings will help.

In other news, I discovered I've got enough conduit, I can run 2 from the garage to the car port. Which now has me considering running one with power and one with an air hose through it to a manifold in the car port. Not that my garage is any better insulated from the cold in the winter(hollow block on slab, no insulation) but it would ensure that no water got into the compressor. I guess it depends on where I want the compressor taking up space. Might not be a bad idea to bury both and leave one empty in case I need more power later, but I really don't know where I could get it from.

There's a 50 amp sub panel in my garage for my old welder that I'm planning on running power from to another sub panel mounted in the car port. Should be more than enough to handle anything I need juice for running one thing at a time. Lift, compressor, maybe some lighting, and a welder. Fluorescent and led don't use much power, I think the welder is the biggest draw, and I'm not even close to shopping for a better one of those.

Basic thought to layout

More than basic thought to layout

Left = Front; Right = Back; Bottom = side towards my house/garage

Not exactly the drawings I'd intended to make up, but they do give me some ideas of spacing.

The box is 22x25, current size of the steel carport.

Green is centerline

Red is where the lift posts are estimated. 3.5 feet off the wall for room to work on that side, then 12 feet wide because that's the high end of the lifts I've been looking at "overall width"

The White rectangle is where I intend to put the actual lift. Obviously it won't take up that much space, but it's really hard to tell without measuring one in place.

The feint purple lines are 4 feet in from the front and back, that's more than the current "weather" line

The big H is my press, actually in it's current position. It will be getting casters

The two rectangles at the top are wall mounted tire racks. Under the one on the left will be shelving or a bench, under the one on the right will be my craftsman tool chest.

The circle is roughly a 60 gallon vertical compressor.

Unmarked, but the power will be coming in on the bottom side.

I sat down to start drawing up the sides, and wound up making these instead. It does look like with some careful parking, I could have a vehicle on the lift and another inside the car port. Tight squeeze, but what I was hoping for. I also think the lift will be far enough in that I can park a car in front of it, but not on it. kind of why I wanted to offset to one side.

Every time I try to start something new in sketchup, it brings up the autocross course I was last working on. How do I make a new template? I haven't been able to figure anything out, but I know it's more useful then 3d Home Architect because of the built in libraries.

Hell, I could probably design this in the Sims to see what it will really really look like.

4" thick concrete will be fine for a residential slab. Thicken the slab to 6" under posts of the lift.

Don't build block walls unless you have built a proper footer.

Putting this project on hold until next year. With my unwillingly being handed a job this past week, it has been decided I should do the adult thing and grow my credit score until spring with a secured credit card through my credit union.

This does give me more time to think and work, and save I guess, I'm just not happy about waiting until next year to do it. The benefit of waiting though, is that I can take the cost of the project, put it into a secured loan, and use the floor as a credit building exercise. Not to mention the adult size tax return I'll be getting next year serving as a nice injection of cash to get everything squared away.

Since I already have the conduit though, I'm going to be burying it before snow fall to feel at least slightly productive.

Welcome to the club! Work is always crampin' my style. You'll get there, just keep at it.

So with recent financial revelations, and the decision that I will be staying at this house and needing to make the most of it, making the carport better is working itself back into priority. My goal for the year, hopefully the spring, is to stop using extension cords and actually have some power down there.

I have a 50 amp sub panel in my garage that I will be running another sub panel off of. I should be in the clear power consumption wise, as there really won't be a need for tools working in the garage while I'm in the carport.

I already have more than enough 1" conduit to get from point A to point B, about a 85FT run. 6 guage THHN is $55/color per 100ft. That leaves plenty of room for a loop for if/when I raise the carport. I might just pour a slab and call it done, so I at least have someplace nice to work, and take that over a lift. But that's another topic.

So. I'm looking at $215 plus tax for the THHN from Home Depot online, haven't checked with my electrical supplier but I suspect similar pricing. Compared to 100ft of UF-B, and needing to dig deeper trenches, I think it's cheaper to go individual strand, especially because I already have the conduit. An outdoor breaker panel, even though it will be mounted in a spot in the carport that never gets wet, is going to be about $80. Breakers are cheap, and 100Ft of 12/2 romex is only $40.

That's $330 before any outlets and lighting. I can live with that, for the ability to have more than one tool plugged in at a time, and to stop driving over extension cords.

As a start for lighting, unless I find a deal on some 4 ft fixtures, I have a 50 foot site lighting set. Plugs into an outlet has 25 light sockets on it. I'll experiment with it, see what kind of coverage I can get over the ceiling, and put some clearance aisle LED bulbs in it. Should take weather fine, and any light is better than the xmas lights I have there now.

After the electrical, which will clean up floor space by getting rid of the conduit, I'm going to look into making a folding table/work bench for one wall. Something that will fold up out of the way when not in use, but be sorta level and solid to actually work on. Easy button would probably be 2x4s and plywood, but I'm going to keep an eye out for counter tops on craigslist. I'm hoping some heavy duty spider bolts will attach inside the studs and hold everything up nice and tight.

Eliminating the lift would make a floor simpler, but I can't pretend to budget for that yet as I don't know what the year will hold. But a 4" slab, with a slight ramp at the entrance, and wire mesh across the floor shouldn't be too expensive and hard to maintain. Shouldn't float either if pouring it cements the carport into it, since the carport is held in with 18" mobile home anchors. Time will tell. I'll be having some contractors in to survey the termite damage and figure that out, and he should be able to give me a price or a phone number for the concrete work while he's here.

RevRico wrote: After the electrical, which will clean up floor space by getting rid of the conduit, I'm going to look into making a folding table/work bench for one wall. Something that will fold up out of the way when not in use, but be sorta level and solid to actually work on. Easy button would probably be 2x4s and plywood, but I'm going to keep an eye out for counter tops on craigslist. I'm hoping some heavy duty spider bolts will attach inside the studs and hold everything up nice and tight.

If the last 4 hours of googling have taught me anything, it's that adding shelves to these walls will be an interesting project. The only toggle bolts Mcmaster Carr sells that I'd consider a safe weight rating at 5 inches long. That glavanized is 2x2, so that is a lot of overhang to make up.

Plus it's galvanized, and I don't like welding that.

Site searches of here and garage journal have pulled up lots of questions, but no real answers. Just "someone covered it in this thread" or "here's a pic someone took 4 years ago and never explained anything".

This has me currently thinking I have some options. Maybe put full 2x4 studs against the vertical metal studs, and connect them together with carriage bolts, then attach some shelving to the boards. Share the load instead of putting so much stress on the metal. Maybe run carriage bolts from the outside, through the wall, and through the 2x4 as well, hold it from the side and the back, and theoretically spread the weight even further.

I really, really want to attach a workbench. And the reason I want to attach is so that I can ensure it's at least half level. Without grading or pouring the floor, just loose shelving/benches won't stay very flat at all. I could at least attach kickers or something if I attached it to the wall and not need to worry about the floor.

Those tire storage shelf from HD I've seen people use is pretty nice too, but I don't know if it would span the stud gap, I'd probably have to stick frame it in too.

You need to decide if it's going to remain just a shelter ($), or become more like a building ($$$).

In PA - I expect your frostline is 3-4 feet below grade. If you're going to build block walls to support the steel carport cover, you need a proper footing under them.

If a durable slab and elevated walls is your chosen path... I recommend figuring out what is the slow season for a concrete crew, and try to find somebody to form and pour concrete walls with some rebar, high enough to net your desired lift height. Forget the block work, it's just another trade to pay. Then pour a slab in between those concrete walls. This option smells like a few thousand dollars.

A less expensive plan, is using graded aggregate base ("crush and run") with some portland cement mixed in (rent a small mixer) to make a reasonably stable and flat working surface.... for a couple hundred bucks.

What does the steel frame sit on right now? Is it rusting at the bottom?

One more thought.. I would be very cautious attaching shelves to that steel frame. Definitely don't cantilever shelves off of the post framing because it's likely not engineered to support more than itself (and just barely).

The steel frame is sitting straight on gravel on one side, and on some bricks on the other to level it out, with the big auger style anchors going into the ground.

I've been thinking and bouncing ideas around again, trying to predict the future a little bit.

Just to make a 4" pad with 80lb bags of redi mix is almost $1300. 323 80lb bags. At that point, it ischeaper to have concrete brought in. And would definitely be easier and faster having 8 yards brought in. Should be 7.1 to do the pad, 10% spillage and I can find a use for most of the extra if I put some small projects I was going to do around the house on hold until then. Cost is about 100/yard delivered here, so only $800 plus wire and rebar.

That's not a lift or load bearing slab, that's just the inside of the carport covered in 4" of concrete to make a flat and level surface to park and work on.

For starters though, I am making electricity a priority. I'm going to bury a 4x4 post against the wall and mount a breaker panel to that. No stress on the building, won't interfere if I do concrete in the future. MC cable to steel boxes on brackets, so I can just tek screw the brackets to the building.

Just need to wait for the ground to thaw.

You could easely roll it back on 4x4's placed on the ground and one or two foot pieces of 1" ridgid pipe. You would need about 4-5 on each side. Once one rolls out the back you place it in front and keep going until you've cleared the area. Then you could pour the slab wide enough to roll the shed back onto the slab and then wedge anchor it to the slab. Have rolled 4000lb switch gear and transformers around this way since the 80's. Even moved a shed in my yard 15' over uneven ground on 3/4 emt on top of plywood on the ground.

When doing the underground pvc make sure you have no more than 360 degree's of bends total. That will keep it code compliant. You will also need a ground rod if you put a subpanel in the shed and depending on where you're at 2 maybe needed at a minimum of 8' apart. I believe the pvc needs to be 18" below the surface off the top of my head. Would have to look in the code book to verify.

• If I had to choose between a slab and a lift, the clear choice would be a slab.

• You're crazy to attempt that with redi mix. You will have so many cold joints it's almost guaranteed to begin cracking before it even fully cures. I've done hand mixed poured-in-place slabs, but I wouldn't attempt one with less than 20 people. 30 would be better.

• I like your electrical priority. Make sure you stick to Brad's recommendations on grounding, etc.

• As OHSCrifle noted, you have a frost line. If you don't put a turn down perimeter footing on that concrete, you are not building a slab for a building. More like a sidewalk. It will be subject to frost heave, and you are not gonna hold it down with mobile home anchors. Those are designed to resist a limited amount of wind lift, not frost heave. It would still be useful as a work space, but I would make whatever sacrifice necessary to add turned down edges below the frost line, as a minimum.

• There will always be more concrete waste than you are expecting. It's an art, not a science.

• Do not add a load to the 2x2 galvanized posts. (Shelves, etc). They are not designed to hold ANY additional weight.

• I strongly doubt you will move that structure on rollers, then move it back without destroying it. The issue is not the weight- it's the flimsy-ness. If it fails, it won't be a minor thing. 1 leg will buckle, the load will shift to the rest, and the entire thing will collapse in a spectacular pile of twisted scrap metal. Dismantle it and reassemble- it will take you and a couple buddies a day or 2.

• I also admire your efforts to get your financial matters in order as a priority.

It's not going to move. Between the cost, and sheer labor involved, it's just not a good idea to put a lift in a carport in SWPA. I was more than a bit too ambitious about cost and work when I started this thread and the ideas were being tossed around originally. Realistically, a slab and electricity are more than I had before, and allow more freedom of space overall. Being able to do both for challenge money just makes the decision for me.

I am considering burying some 4x4 posts along one side to use at mounting points for wooden shelves or a pegboard down there, but that's going to be determined by how much of a PITA the first one I use for the electric panel is.

In the mean time, since I can't do any sort of digging, and don't have anything that actually needs done on any of the vehicles, I'm going stir crazy. The only indoor "project" I have is recaulking the shower, but it still gets too cold in the laundry room at night for caulking to set right, so I can't even do that.

So slowly I've been chipping away in the garage I have now. Believe it or not, this is after about 5 hours of progress. I didn't think to take a proper before picture.

This is right now. I can actually see and use the work bench. The sawdust caked on with mouse piss has been scraped off, simple greened the whole thing. But the problem with this workbench doesn't show up well in pictures.

The whole benchtop is a wavy mess.

But I'm still happy-ish. It's a solid, well lit surface, rarer than a unicorn fart around here.

At 10 feet long and 24.5" wide, it'll be tricky finding a single piece counter top that will replace that, but I'm still thinking about that. I might get a 6 foot piece of countertop, then use doubled 3/4" plywood with a hardboard surface to finish the rest. That would make it two benches in one, right? Right.

Lighting and electricity are going to change here too. Currently, almost all the lights and outlets in my garage share the laundry room breaker, with a heater and the washing machine. Really really annoying vacuuming or drilling something and everything stops. But as mentioned before, I replaced a 220 outlet in the garage with a 50 amp sub panel(and new 6/3 UF wire). I currently only have a couple outlets on it going outside to supply the extension cords I have to work with, this will also be the panel I run power to the carport from.

There's a junction box on the ceiling of the garage, that hits the lights, outlet at the workbench and the garage door opener outlet, I'm just about 3ft short of romex to make the run from my panel to that junction box. Now that it is becoming an annoyance, I'll be solving that situation probably this week.

If you look close, you can see some wirenuts on the front of the workbench. There was a powerstrip there that fell apart. After I make the tie in to the junction box, changing those wires to a freer circuit, I'll be mounting an outlet there and screwing on that black power strip. The light annoys me with it's 9" cord, but a longer cord can be made and tucked out of the way to raise that light a bit higher. I may also put a small light on the bottom of the pegboard for detail work. I do have another 4ft fixture (again with the stubby cord) that is just taking up space currently, maybe 2 lights over the bench would be a better idea.

The bench grinder will be getting it's own stand soon, and I may build a wheeled stand for the drill press, it's kinda tall on top of this 43" high bench. The red toolbox has sawblades, sawzall blades, and dremel accessories in it. Ok, there's a bunch of extra crap there now, but that is the organizational end point.

But I typed all of that just to say PROGRESS. Too many of my projects are on hold for the winter, so it feels good to be getting something done.

SVreX wrote: - Do not add a load to the 2x2 galvanized posts. (Shelves, etc). They are not designed to hold ANY additional weight. - I strongly doubt you will move that structure on rollers, then move it back without destroying it. The issue is not the weight- it's the flimsy-ness. If it fails, it won't be a minor thing. 1 leg will buckle, the load will shift to the rest, and the entire thing will collapse in a spectacular pile of twisted scrap metal. Dismantle it and reassemble- it will take you and a couple buddies a day or 2.

∆This. I've seen a few of these fold up for various reasons and I'm glad to see you're not planning to move it. It's really quite scary how flimsy they are. (And also much much heavier than you probably were thinking.)

They're really just metal tents.

Crackers wrote:

SVreX wrote: - Do not add a load to the 2x2 galvanized posts. (Shelves, etc). They are not designed to hold ANY additional weight. - I strongly doubt you will move that structure on rollers, then move it back without destroying it. The issue is not the weight- it's the flimsy-ness. If it fails, it won't be a minor thing. 1 leg will buckle, the load will shift to the rest, and the entire thing will collapse in a spectacular pile of twisted scrap metal. Dismantle it and reassemble- it will take you and a couple buddies a day or 2.

∆This. I've seen a few of these fold up for various reasons and I'm glad to see you're not planning to move it. It's really quite scary how flimsy they are. (And also much much heavier than you probably were thinking.) They're really just metal tents.

What he's saying is "if you move it, please have a camera going"

Kidding, be safe.

They sell 10' sections of laminate counter. It's quite sturdy; I used one as a computer repair workbench (full time job) for years and it still looked good. My dad has it now and it still looks good 20 years later. He's not very hard on it though. I was.

I bought mine at lowes or Home Depot.

dculberson wrote: They sell 10' sections of laminate counter. It's quite sturdy; I used one as a computer repair workbench (full time job) for years and it still looked good. My dad has it now and it still looks good 20 years later. He's not very hard on it though. I was. I bought mine at lowes or Home Depot.

I haven't actually priced any new ones, but I've been on CL everyday looking for stuff to melt and tools, and see a lot of old countertops there free and cheap. We also have a Habitat for Humanity store and a building recycling center pretty close by. My only issue with a 10ft piece is that I then have to borrow a pickup truck to haul it. The miata isn't wide enough to put it on the passenger spot like I do lumber, and the jeep is too short inside. And now that I say that, I realize I need to take pictures of the miata after a lumber run.

Years ago, like mid 90s, we picked up a 6ft piece of ugly pink countertop for like $10 on sale that we used as a computer desk for years. I finally threw it away last year, and have now figured out that my workbench is warped.

The bench might even work as is. My only real want for it to be flat is ramming sand flasks, which I will be making a solution to outside in the spring time when I make a foundry/bbq area. I won't deny the benefit of a built in backsplash though, to contain leaks and keep stuff from rolling off the back.

For the first time since highschool, I have a functional workbench, and not a whole lot to do with it. It's currently being used to breakdown old locksets for the cast aluminum, and shelf storage while I try to organize my big rolling 3 piece tool chest.

That was actually how cleaning got started, I wanted to organize my rolling tool chest so I could start labling drawers and save time while working. Totally lost focus around contractor trash bag number 3.

Actually, does anyone have tips for putting new boards on a Black n Decker Workmate? I just have a hell of a time finding straight, flat boards anymore, maybe MDF instead of wood?

Sometimes it pays to clean. In the past 2 nights I've found 3 boxes, 2 bags of MC connectors, and a package of grounding leads with screws. That's not a huge savings for the cost of adding electricity, but still $30 less that I have to put out.

I'm hoping to keep finding boxes and maybe some GFCI outlets, but I doubt I have any of those left in inventory.

Baltic birch plywood.Or I can almost guarantee a GRMer in PA has a plainer if you want hard wood.

I've been thinking about your project for a while. My suggestion would be to pour a concrete floor inside your carport to make a better work area. I'd definitely run the electric to it for lighting and tools but aside from adding a back wall (not sure if it has one now), I wouldn't do anything else. Instead, use it as best as you can for now but plan for building a proper garage in the future for the lift. That way you'll have both the carport and a working garage at some point in the future.

In reply to jimbob_racing:

Yea that's kinda the thought now. It's open on the front and back, and will be staying that way though. Between parties, music when I'm working, and car storage, 23x25 is too small to be closed up on more than the sides.

I swung by the only concrete place within reasonable distance today to get some block for another project. Concrete is $135 per yard, plus $7.50/yard if I want fiberglass. Plus a $30 delivery fee which is whatever. That's $42 more per yard than I was expecting, but this is Pennsylvania, everything costs more than the national average here.

Swung by the lumber yard too. shiny happy people are no longer open on the weekends, so I didn't buy anything to bury tomorrow. I refuse to buy wood at big box stores, it's not much straighter at the lumber yard, but it is closer to a straight board. I don't know how anyone builds anything anymore, couldn't tell you the last time I saw an actual flat, straight board for sale.

Shop lights are due in on Monday. A start for lights anyway, 4 4ft LED fixtures will be much better than the Xmas lights I have now.this also pushes me to get the power down there sooner.

It's supposed to be in the 60s all week, I'm going to push to get a 4x4 in the ground and at the very least a 90 going up towards the house, if not all the conduit buried finally, but my kid is coming early this week so I don't know how much will be possible come Monday.

Things are going to happen for real this weekend!!

I've picked up a 4x4 to mount the panel on, a panel, breakers, a switch, boxes, 6gauge THHN in all 4 colors, MC cable and one hole straps, outlets, ground rod, and other connectors.

I'm going to work a bit in reverse though. Hang the 4ft LEDS, mount the boxes, and get the wire all run to where the breaker panel will be. Then bury the post the panel will go on along with the conduit to the house, tie everything into the panel, then finally take the wire to the house.

I'm doing this in this backwards order because it's supposed to be wet Friday and Saturday and dry sunday, so it should make the yard much easier to dig up to bury the conduit. I'm also not sure when a slightly more experienced and less nervous friend will be able to help me tie into the main panel, so I'll only need him for a very short time to hook everything up.

Being nervous around electricity is smart.

Connecting hot- not so much.