mk4 GTi v6.0 - v8 RWD Edition

Thanks guys - really appreciate the feedback...wish there was a way to easily multi-quote on here, but oh well...

So couple things

adding the spacer to one side will effectively make the rack wider, my biggest obstacle that I still think will be ensuring the tie rods are the same length, have to address how to get this correct, but it will keep pivot points in the same plane horizontally

the rack is already "slightly down" from the factory, BUT, with the subframe location, it should keep the tie rods parallel with the control arms, so i think i will be pretty good in that regard.  the issue with going down too much more and keeping the L/R from the factory is then the rack very much becomes the lowest point of the car....again, not the end of the world, but something i would like to avoid b/c it will be use a lot on the street

front to back location is pretty close to where it was from the factory, so i dont think i should have too much impact to ackerman

The other option I have been thinking about is cutting up the oil pan, it is a very strange 2part design where some of it is aluminum with a steel bottom part, so I am going to see if i can modify the steel part enough to get the clearance that i need.

again, really appreciate the feedback, anyone else that has suggestions i am happy to hear....at this point i am thinking that it might be in my best interest to get my engine mounts made and start addressing the rack location after that is finalized

That spacer looks like it would be fine to me, it accomplishes the same thing.  What is the width between your lower suspension pickup points?  And what is the width of that rack?  Thats the dimension that needs to be as close as possible like the guys above said.   Positioning can be fixed to some extent, but that width dictates a ton.

Following.....lots of interesting engineering problems to solve......

If cutting up the oil pan is an option, I  would 100% choose that option over moving the rack from factory position. I've done it 2'ce to preserve steering geometry and never regretted it.

Shavarsh said:

If cutting up the oil pan is an option, I  would 100% choose that option over moving the rack from factory position. I've done it 2'ce to preserve steering geometry and never regretted it.

Yup.

I spent some time looking at it, I am going to cut the pan and see how far over i can shift it, but, I still think i am going to need to get a spacer to adjust for some difference.

Will work on the measurements of the rack ill get measurements of the rack and the pick up points this weekend and post them up to document and further out discussion.

thanks all!

Friday afternoon took a field trip to the metal scrap yard with a buddy for a little treasure hunt, always hit/miss on what you might find.....Friday was a "hit" day, could have bought a bunch more stuff, but didnt really have the need and metal storage is something I desperately need to work on, but these little brackets were a great find, then some box tubing which might come in handy as im working on the engine mounts and

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

My comment above about cutting the pan resulted from marking out based on the location of the rack pinion, gave me some hope that it will work, also ordered a new/cheap oil pan that looks to have some interesting shape to it in hopes of making the patching of this pan relatively straight forward.

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Satruday attended a car show and took a break from the car....Sunday I had a bunch of chores to do, but got wrapped up with them in time to sneak a couple hours of garage time in before it was time to cook dinner and settle in for the night.....spend that time working on some CAD for the engine mounts....knowing i have a game plan for the oilpan/rack situation, i want to get the engine mounts figured out and mocked up before i remove the engine to start on the oil pan modification.

Here is where i got with the drivers side, I have a plan to tie in the front/rear subframe mounts with the engine mounts so it will be fully integrated for increased strength

Mounts that will attach to the engine

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Tacked up

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Drivers side attached to the OEM engine mount bracket

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

CAD template for drivers side chassis mount bracket

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

in this photo you can see the front and rear subframe mounts, my plan is to tie that into the lower section of this bracket so it can be welded top and bottom for increased strength

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

More CAD fun last night.....this side didnt fit as well, but got me to a point where i think i know what i want....also note the silly coolant line for the water cooled alternator....I think i need to find a way to make that go away, seem prime for leaks

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

One thing I've been debating is the actual design of the mount, I can only assume, wider is better, right?  Quick excel sketch of what I am thinking (noteworthy, I do plan to add 3/16" plate to the chassis rails for added strength.

I am thinking Option #2 for the final, but certainly open to feedback as always

Chassis Side_Engine Mount Brackets by fouckhest, on Flickr

Either should work fine, I am using something similar to design #1 with no issues. There shouldn't be much force in the front/back direction.

Shavarsh said:

Either should work fine, I am using something similar to design #1 with no issues. There shouldn't be much force in the front/back direction.

Thank you again!  

Did some scrolling back in your thread, I like your bump steer measuring setup, looks like I have another rabbit hole to go down 

Yep. #1 has been in hard use in my v6 swapped miata track car since 2018. Should be fine.

Dusterbd13-michael said:

Yep. #1 has been in hard use in my v6 swapped miata track car since 2018. Should be fine.

Good to hear, hoping to get out and make a next round of templates tonight and drive closer to some bigger milestones

Also did some research on bump steer and my steering rack situation....I am likely overly optimistic, but I think this might turn out okay, just need to decide if I want to buy or build one of thosee measuring jigs....

Progress has been slow due to commitments, but found some time friday to do some work on the engine mounts, following everyones advise/support, turned paper into aluminum templates to ensure a nice tight fit

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Overall, I am pretty happy

drivers side

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

passengers side

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

found a few minutes monday night to start on the front subfram mounts....working towards something like this that will hold a bind nut in the bottom and for safetys sake a 21mm socked will fit down in a 1.5" DOM tube just in case...

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Wife is heading out of town this afternoon for a girls weekend, so i should be able to capitalize on some garage time....Need to source some new nuts for the subframe mounts, then decide how i want to build the plates for the frame rails, get those tacked in so i can start cutting out the mounts and getting them tacked in for next phase of test fitting and engine removal

I wouldn't trust aluminum that thin to hold the engine.  I thought you were going 3/16 steel.

I personally would not use aluminum in that configuration for an engine mount. Fatigue of weld joints would be my concern.

The way you are mounting to the rail effectively makes that mount member a straight cantilever acting on the rail. You have some good fab skills but out of simplicity I would use 3/16 steel plate and weld them straight to the rails(with some boxing to tie in to either the top or bottom of the rail). Then there is no worrying about how to bolt and locate that mount to your not straight frame rail 
 

It's wayyyyy more work than I think it's worth to do a bolt on mount. 
 

I'm reading it as the aluminum is just for a very precise template. 

buzzboy said:

I'm reading it as the aluminum is just for a very precise template. 

Ah!  That would make more sense!

buzzboy said:

I'm reading it as the aluminum is just for a very precise template. 

Thanks for all the concern guys, but this is exactly right!  I wanted something a little more rigid to fine tune the size & design.  

Final product will certainly be made of 3/16" CRS

Not as much progress as I would have liked last night, but a trip to the local ace for some hardware delayed progress a bit, but great to be able to get grade 10.9 m14x1.5 locally is great...

Spent some time getting the brackets cut for the subframe mounts and tacked together the nuts that will be welded into the support tubes...that was my stopping point to let the nuts cool down and not risk them getting friction welded together....excited to get back at it tonight

front subframe mount components

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

glamour shot of my nuts tacked 

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

....excited to get back at it tonight 

With the wife out of town I was able to make some good progress yesterday and able to set myself to finish things up today in time to get the house cleaned up and ready for her return.

I now have a car that is self support at v8

Finalized my subframe mount points on Friday night

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Saturday started with getting engine mounts cutout using the aluminum templates

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Reinforced the frame rails with some 3/16" plate steel

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

They will be fillet/rosette welded into place, the inaccessible spots did get welded in before mounts were tacked in...first engine mount test fitted 

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Passengers side engine and front subfram mount tacked into place

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Rinse and repeat for the drivers side...little harder to get good photos, but same concept

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Engine hanging with the new mounts, no more support....

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

leaving for a work trip tomorrow morning, hopefully get back to it next weekend.  time to pull the engine, start on rear subframe mounts and the oil pan project so I can finalize steering rack location and then onto steering shaft build

Weekend got consumed by house projects and getting ready for a shindig this coming weekend, which meant clean up around the house/garage...but in that clean up found time to throw the front end on the car to see how things look with the core support on it...have to say, really in love with how menicing it looks with the front end on without the hood...also, definitely going to be ideal for a v-mount radiator and hood duct!

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Wow, this is looking amazing! Really great progress!

I am amazed at how much room you have in front of that engine. With these engine  how often do you have to service stuff that faces the firewall? I know there is the  dreaded t chain. 

mitch5 said:

I am amazed at how much room you have in front of that engine. With these engine  how often do you have to service stuff that faces the firewall? I know there is the  dreaded t chain. 

Honestly other than the chains there shouldn't be too much, I'll do the chains before the car gets finished, the only other obstacle i see is the oil filter cap, but I have already been scheming how to do a remote filter & sandwich plate for oil cooler, all-in-all it shouldn't be too bad.  Plus at the rate I drive my play toys, it will best case see 3-5k miles a year

Not much progress this weekend, offered up the shop to help a buddy with some maintenance on his new to him daily beater on saturday, which took the full day...but did get the engine back out yesterday and pulled the pan....

Engine out, pan off

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Hard to tell in this photo, but the area in the top right/middle of this photo is where i need to clearance for the power steering rack, so it looks promising that there will be no concerns with any interference, will only lose that small amount of oil capacity

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Also, last week I ordered some steering components, flaming river makes the specific 17mm to DD adaper joint, picked that up along with another 3/4 DD u-joint and some 3/4 DD bar stock to hopefully get the steering mocked up soon

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr