mk4 GTi v6.0 - v8 RWD Edition

Found a little time last night to start chopping away at the oil pan, I have to say my optimism is growing!

First cut based on what I, "theoryized" by looking at the rack under the car...didnt get a photo of what it looked like installed, but I knew I could definitely take a little more out....Didnt get a photo of what it looked like installed, but I knew I could definitely take a little more out....marked up for next cut

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Feeling good about the amount removed and the minimal impact to oil capacity

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Tough to get a good angle, but should be pretty straight forward to box this in, going to try and get it tacked up so I can get the engine back in the car and start fitting the steering rack

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Fun with CAD....found some time last night to get out to the garage to make up some templates and get them fitted up....Pretty happy with how it is shaping up....hopefully get to the metal store today to see if i can start getting them cut out tacked up

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

I think I am good from a clearance standpoint, I've got the pan back installed with the cardboard templates, I can't "feel" any interference, but that is where the cut/tack will come into play

One of my new favorite stores is metal supermarkets, there is a location (luckily) 20min from my house, called them yesterday after I updated this thread, ordered 3x 6"x12" 16ga HRS sheet, was ready at 1130a, ran over at lunch which kept me moving forward last night....

Didnt really take many step by step photos...but here is rough fit up

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Then tacked it into place...I have to admit, the pan welded much better than I expect, espeically for being a high mileage car

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Will likely try and weld as much as possible from the inside, then just fuse the outside and fill where needed....

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Hoping to get back out there tonight, plan is to get the pan reinstalled, engine back in the car and start mocking up the steering...but we have a house project going on that may divert my efforts, but either way, my optomism continues to grow that this steering rack location issue, might not end up being as much of an issue as I had originally thought 

Nice fab work 

Looks great!

TurboFource said:

Nice fab work 

wvumtnbkr said:

Looks great!

Thanks guys, appreciate you following along

Im digging this. And that engine looks amazingly compact for dohc!

Dusterbd13-michael said:

Im digging this. And that engine looks amazingly compact for dohc!

Thanks, Yes, it is really compact, I first drempt the idea for this swap up many years ago when my buddies shop was doing timing chains on an s4...saw how "little" the engine looked, couple quick measurements of the engine that night, went home measured my empty engine bay and the gears started turning.....also - looks like you arent too far away, if you ever make your way to upstate SC (greenville/spartenburg) area, let me know....always happy to share a cold beverage over some shop/car/project talk

Also, just found out my seats will be shipping today, they should be arriving in the next 3-4wks, so that is now big time motivation to get the engine back in, rack placement settled and be prepared to start working on seat placement and tunnel and fire wall build....time to start shopping for a bead roller!

Lol and here I am, struggling to put an Audi i5 into a bay that originally housed a (very slightly different) Audi i5. Great work! I only really have experience with the earlier belt driven Audi V8's (ABZ, PT). Always kinda stayed away from the chain driven ones due to all the horror stories, but I'm really digging this.

That's awesome Audi gifted you the steel lower pan to use! Even the most popular swap on earth(ls) uses factory cast aluminum pans. Which are a nightmare to weld. 

Looking good! you might want to bolt the pan onto the block a few times during welding to make sure there isn't too much warp growing. 

Turbine said:

Lol and here I am, struggling to put an Audi i5 into a bay that originally housed a (very slightly different) Audi i5. Great work! I only really have experience with the earlier belt driven Audi V8's (ABZ, PT). Always kinda stayed away from the chain driven ones due to all the horror stories, but I'm really digging this.

Thanks for following along.....its funny, I "cut my teeth" in the early days of the 1.8t and the horrors of snapping timing belts, so the earlier belt driven engines in the 4.2 always scared me lol....aside from the chain driven engines being an engine out service for a daily driver vehicle, there aren't many horrors that I've seen...the only other thing I've heard of is bore scoring...but that problem comes up in many differnet engine platforms....and at the end of the day, this will be a weekend/mtn drive and hopefully occasional track day toy 

now get back to that i5, such an amazing engine!

mitch5 said:

That's awesome Audi gifted you the steel lower pan to use! Even the most popular swap on earth(ls) uses factory cast aluminum pans. Which are a nightmare to weld. 

 

You can say that!  definitely a stroke of luck in my favor 

Shavarsh said:

Looking good! you might want to bolt the pan onto the block a few times during welding to make sure there isn't too much warp growing. 

Thanks!, and yes, that is part of my plan, I didn't take a photo, but while I was tacking a couple spots, I had it clamped one of my aluminum blocks to the grafted in piece to help hold it tight, I think it helped for sure

For now it is going back on the block for a while for test fitting....it doesn't seem too bad at this point, but it is certainly on my list of concerns...was actually trying to dream up a way to bolt it to something while welding it out....still noodling on that

House projects have kept me from doing much on the car unfortunately, but got out to the garage last night, got the pan installed, engine back in the car (always a learning experience, especially this time as it was the first time with the new engine mounts, but went relatively smooth

Once the engine was back in I marked center on sub-frame, grabbed the PS rack and held it up there....womp womp....the rack is certainly in a better position, but still needs to move

Here is the rack sitting in the area where I modified the oil pan

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Unfortunately it is now hitting up here, and the worse part is there is no good way to further modify the pan

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Here is the new offset...just about 1"...was tricky to get a good photo with the tape measure

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Next steps....I found that the z4 came with a manual steering rack, seems to be a common upgrade for the e30 guys, so this was a cheap buy in to test if the "skinnier" steering input shaft will give me enough clearance to either eliminate the need for a spacer on one side of the rack or have it be minimal 

z4 manual rack 1 by fouckhest, on Flickr

z4 manual rack 3 by fouckhest, on Flickr

z4 manual rack 2 by fouckhest, on Flickr

hopeful this will keep me moving in a positive direction...currently waiting on shipping info, the wife and I are doing a weekend get away for our 1yr anniversary, hopefully back at it next week.....until next time

New rack arrived....but it is much narrower than the OEM rack, so the steering input now needs to be further inboard than the e90 rack, going to need inner tie rod extenders, to bring the tie rod attachment/pivot point back out to where the OEM rack would have been, that is easy enough as long as i can get the rack mounted and centered....trying to stay optimistic at this point

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

did some mock up last night, I think with some additional modification to my modified oil pan and subframe the rack will fit....you can see where i've marked what I think needs to be clearanced....pulled the engine out last and that got me to a good stopping point, going to attempt to remove the PS pump from the engine while it is out this time to hopefully create as much room as possible to get the steering joints at angles that wont bind

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Got out to the garage last night to start on v2.0 of the oil pan modifications....

Notched for the "added clearance"

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Quick CAD mockup of boxing just that section in

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Looking at the inside, I will likely have to put some holes in this baffle as what looks to be the main return tube dumps into that corner...but small modification at point

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Next, clearanced the subframe and got the rack clamped back in place...should have plenty of room to weld a nice stout piece of aluminum tubing in there....also happy to see the rack lined up dead center

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Rack hopefully in its new home

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

While the engine was out this time I wanted to take the opportunity to remove the power steering pump....its is mounted to the rear of the engine and driven from the timing chain set....in this photo is is the lower output (with it out of the way, I am hopeful it will allow for better angles to build the steering shaft setup)...upper was for the A/C compressor, figured why not get it out of there, its just more drain on the engine

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This is looking at the front of the engine, the A/C compressor would have sat right in that big void under the engine bracket

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Hoping to get out to the shop tonight and try to get the engine back in and see if this was a success or if i have a new set of challenges

Are you going to be using those tie rod spacers to get the pivot location close to the lower control arm pivot?

Looks awesome!

SpeedAddict502 said:

Are you going to be using those tie rod spacers to get the pivot location close to the lower control arm pivot?

Looks awesome!

Well, that was the plan, but might have to be going back to the nuclear approach and shelling out a small fortune to someone like flaming river for a custom rack :(

Made it out the the garage last night....was happy to see I could get the engine in the car with the rack install, small victory....but once the engine was installed, it was immediately apparent that the pinion shaft is far too long....

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

I pulled the pinion shaft out of the rack, but I just dont see this being a part that "should" be modified....I am confiden it "could" be done, but those are very different things....so in leu of all this, going to do a couple things....

1. dig out the mustang steering rack I have up in the attic and see how it looks fits, just for E36 M3s & giggles

2. going to pull the OEM rack apart this weekend, measure it, fill out the custom rack for from flaming river and see what they might come back with for options....I certainly hope I canfigure someting else out, I was really excited about this engine combo....

....if this doesnt work, wondering how an LS would fit?

You can definitely properly shorten that rack.  Either cut and weld, shorten and grind it into a D or cut and have splines recut

it also looks like you could rotate the rack more even within the existing notch. Or rotate more, notch more, and reinforce the frame from below. 

jfryjfry said:

You can definitely properly shorten that rack.  Either cut and weld, shorten and grind it into a D or cut and have splines recut

it also looks like you could rotate the rack more even within the existing notch. Or rotate more, notch more, and reinforce the frame from below. 

You sir are a gentleman and a scholar....definitely appreciate the advise, welding would certainly worry me, going to a DD setup is a good thought, same with recutting the splines...but sometimes the simplest and most logical is right in front of you....rotating the rack looks like  it could be my golden ticket....

VERY much appreciate you pointing that out, and this is one of those times where I do like working from home and having my shop 15ft away!

Exagerated rotation, but I do think there is an angle in there that will work easily and not cause any interference with the oil pan!

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr  

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Whew, glad to hear there is a solution!

This is impressive.  Following along.

Shavarsh said:

Whew, glad to hear there is a solution!

Hoondavan said:

This is impressive.  Following along.

Thanks guys!  Not out of the woods yet, but went ahead and returned the original u-joint for the e9x rack and ordered one for the z4 rack.  Looks like nice weather tomorrow here in SC, should be a good day to get out to the garage and see if I can make a mount  

Not pretty but effective....got mounts made Saturday, rack is now in place and seems to be in a spot that I can start building my steering system once the universal joint arrives

Rudimentary mounts

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Rack installed, input shaft seems to be a good angle

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Untitled by fouckhest, on Flickr

Also confirmed that my location is, "close enough for gov't work," in regards to the spacing/distance from the subframe, used an old subframe section I kept, mocked up the OEM rack and measured to be sure....rough measurement of the center of the rack tube to the front of the subframe...I'll call it good enough

Not great photos, but I feel confident

OEM rack

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While finalizing my mount location on the car

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I know your mounts look pretty beefy, but if possible I would put something similar on top and bolt thru. You don't want your steering rack coming loose from hitting a low curb or speed bump.