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Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/9/15 11:09 a.m.

Wally: Holy smokes! I know just where to get one. Give me a little time and I'll see what I can do

Duster: Can you believe that I had the truck valet parked while away on my work assignment? When they pulled it around (upon my return) I exclaimed "What the crap!? This thing was new when I dropped it off!!!"

Kind of a roadkill moment

Spinout007
Spinout007 GRM+ Memberand UberDork
7/9/15 11:16 a.m.

I'm starting to think that by reading this thread I've been cursed to relive it. I've had the head off of SWMBO S15 3 times now. This time I'm doing the valves. No compression on cylinder #3.

And I WISH I was joking about that. Damn torque to yield bolts are more expensive than the head gaskets.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/9/15 11:40 a.m.

Oh man, I'm sorry.

Have you done a leakdown check? I can lend you the compression tester I used for mine if you need it.

Spinout007
Spinout007 GRM+ Memberand UberDork
7/9/15 1:00 p.m.

Yeah man, compression was 195,180,0,185. Leakdown test ensued, followed by much cursing, followed by much more cursing as I removed the rockers and still only had 10 psi of compression. Lapping valves tonight.

It's all good though, Took the excuse to go ahead and rebuild the rest of the bottom end. You know, "while I was in there". 200k miles, this motor had better be a sewing machine this time around, (or as close to a sewing machine as a gm 2.2 can be) or I might just take a certain old country song to heart and take a can of gasoline and a hill to it.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/9/15 1:03 p.m.

I'm afraid this thread MUST have rubbed off on your project. If it follows suit then no worries, the third time was the charm! (or was it the fourth?) At least you didn't buy an undersized piston

Spinout007
Spinout007 GRM+ Memberand UberDork
7/9/15 1:16 p.m.

There is that. Though I thought about this thread yesterday when I saw this craigslist ad.

Lightning bolts and all!

I was tempted, till I remembered what you went through. My BIL's 350 is out of the truck right now, and "while it's out". I've got enough on my plate without adding that headache to it.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/16/15 9:49 p.m.

HISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

So much hate all in once picture!!!! achk!

Good call on dodging that bullet man. That's the sort of stuff I only wish on Exes and people who use their brakes to get down on-ramps!

I did toss my bolt-piston up on the trophy shelf where I could send hateful vibes at it every day:

Also pictured is the 13B that ate a nut (and ran!), an Alfa 2.5 V6 piston that ate a valve (and didn't run), a chevy 350 piston where most of the material between the compression rings just fell out when I removed it for a rebuild, aaaaand a few other things.

So I haven't really messed with the truck in a while, but that's not to say I haven't been enjoying owning it a whole lot

We had a company barbecue where I was tasked (ok, I volunteered) to help a friend bring in the barbecue (I also got some great parking!)

I took the Hungary Kiddo for a ride down the street the other day (did I tell you this already?) That was a serious hoot. The radio turned on when I fired up the truck. It was Bon Jovi singing about something or other, and the kid started nodding his head to the beat If a 3-year old is digging it, I must be doing something right.

It kind of reminded me of the camping trips we'd make with my mom and step-dad back when these trucks were new. They had an 88-ish (89?) Toyota 4x4 turbo with chrome tube bumpers and a roll bar with lights and all that jazz.

We'd drive up to the mountains with my little brother sitting on my mom's lap and the dog would sleep in the passenger foot well (Mauze: a German Shepard/ husky mix) and go camping for Memorial day weekend. Don't ask me how we all fit. But one time that song "Keep your hands to yourself" by Georgia Satelites came on the radio and my brother and I started head banging like it was going out of style.

We'd usually get rain for the entire weekend. By Sunday morning people'd be leaving the campground and by Sunday night we'd have the whole place to ourselves. It never failed. By Monday morning the sun'd be out and we'd be the only people there

Good times.

You know... I might have to grab me a Georgia Satelites CD, load up the kid, and fill the gas tank. See what sort of trouble the two of us could stir up

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/16/15 9:55 p.m.

So on to things of the wrench nature: Nothing much to report.

recently I got the fast idle control rod in the mail, and today I installed it!

So first things first. The Choke plate now closes all the way! (it didn't do that before)

Second things second: Look at the bend radius of that nail! I know we've talked about it before, but I mean LOOK at that!

For a metal that's meant to be straight, that thing sure can BEND! I'm seriously impressed. We have some NDI folk coming over here soon to look at a panel we've been working on. I'm half tempted to have them run a die penetrant test to see if the metal cracked at all on the outside of that bend

No test results from the rod yet to report. I got it installed, hooked the wire up and'll have to wait until after my shift ends to see if it did anything or not.

I still have the fuel pressure regulator to put in. I'm on hold with that at the moment while I wait for a few budget related things to settle down (read: I have that extra heater panel and some circuit breakers on E-bay and I'm waiting until they sell to buy the barb fittings I need for my fuel line)

Good times

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/17/15 5:44 p.m.

Test results:

Well, that choke plate is definitely closed! I say so because of the increased amount of throttle input required to get my truck down the highway since the fast idle control rod was installed, but also by the "fast idle" I was experiencing towards the end of the commute.

I wired the choke up to the connector that has the switched 12v line for the Toyota's original electric choke, but when I did I heard a relay click (the relay box is right next to the plug's location) and the charge light came on.

I got a bit worried for a second, but just removed the wire and decided I'd just drive home with the choke the way it was (hence the increased throttle requirements). I've got the truck's wiring diagrams with me, so hopefully I find something useful there. I'd like to do my best to keep this thing from becoming an "electrical nightmare".

All in all, I'd say the choke battle is half-won

I did spend some of my money on impulse buys though. Recently Grassroots was offering their "Employee" stickers for sale and when I clicked the link I noticed I had a back issue and two stickers in my cart. I had no idea what issue it was, or what I was going to do with the stickers but I went and bought them anyways.

I think I was interested in the "making the most out of your dyno day" article, but honestly it could have been years ago that I put that in my cart (secretly I was hoping that whatever article I wanted then would apply to my truck now. I doubt my truck will see a dyno, but you never know!)

Good times

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/17/15 5:45 p.m.

Oh, and notice neither of the stickers I ordered were the "employee" version? Funny how impulse buying works

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
7/18/15 5:23 a.m.

Has anyone reminded you lately a SBC fits in one of those engine bays like it was meant to be there?

I'm just sayin'...

Carry on.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/18/15 9:26 a.m.

I had given a bit of thought to a 1UZ, but it's kind of an expensive option. I do, however, have this Alfa V6 laying around...

Jayisacarguy
Jayisacarguy New Reader
7/20/15 8:54 p.m.

This thread is great, thanks for keeping it updated! Also, for my .02, keep going with the 22r! You've taken it too far to bail on it now.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/20/15 9:20 p.m.

Thanks! I've gone back and forth on the 22r vs a swap a couple times now, in all honesty I really don't think it's going anywhere. That engine is perfect for that truck, and it can take some abuse! (apparently)

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/20/15 9:42 p.m.

So "Double Whammy Day" at the Hungary house!

That is, I used the truck and I worked on it on the same day. First things first, I hauled an old basketball hoop from my grandmothers house to a friends house just down the road. Oddly enough this is a guy who was out in Hungary with me and we happen to live a block from each other. It's also the same guy who's kids stopped the would-be thieves a while back

Anyhoo, this basketball hoop was mine when I was about 12-years old. Now it's time to pass it on to another 12-year-old (plus my grandma doesn't have to have it cluttering up her yard)

It's on a bit of a slope, so.... well... best of luck to them on that one

I found a suitable 12v switched line to tap into and got the choke working!

(applause)

Normally I'd report how great it is having an engine that can breathe again, but I haven't exactly got it dialed in correctly yet:

First the choke was set too tight and it never came off the fast idle screw. No big deal. Then I realized that the entire life of this carb, (well, since I've owned it) it's never been off its fast idle screw because when it kicked down to its "idle" screw it was beyond loose and the truck stalled.

Idle adjustment was no problem, but then I realized I had the choke adjusted too loose and it wouldn't idle when it was anything other than completely warmed up.

Right now the choke is still a bit loose, but it's working. It still is a bear to get to idle at stoplights as dragging a gear to slow down causes the fuel pump to overpower the floats and it tries to stall (or at least that's the logic behind the upcoming fuel pressure regulator install). When the truck does stall I sometimes I have to drag second gear two or three times (while braking for a stoplight) to restart the engine.

The trick, I've found, is to push in the clutch early and have second waiting. Then coast while braking to the light from a distance. That way I have plenty of time for any "stall/restart"s. By the time I get to the light, the truck idles!

Meh, I've driven worse

On the bright side: Accelerating is less.... "raunchy" (?) I think that's probably the best word for it I really cant tell much with my butt dyno but that kind of makes sense as the throttle linkage would force the choke plates open at WOT. Unfortunately I haven't had much more than a couple errand and one commute to work to play with it, but things are looking promising! (I have to remain optimistic or else that megasquirt is going to jump out of it's box at attack my engine, I just know it)

Good times

tuna55
tuna55 UltimaDork
7/20/15 9:55 p.m.

Keep going, you're getting there!!!

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
7/20/15 11:31 p.m.

Almost sounds like the idle mix screw might be a little on the lean side.

355S10
355S10 New Reader
7/20/15 11:42 p.m.

Hey I have a 98 s10 with the nv3500 and I am wondering what kind of clutch and pressure plate I am going to need to get the 350 sbc to bolt up to it? Can you help me out please lol

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/24/15 4:00 p.m.

I'm still chasing my tail on this choke adjustment. I have my baseline marked, but no matter what I can't get the same results twice with any adjustment I do. Even returning to my baseline settings wont give me the same results twice!

It's so bad that I could almost say that stoplight to stoplight changes as to whether this thing will "fast idle", stall, or idle. It's like rock paper scissors!

I've got the barb fitting on order to hook the fuel pressure regulator up. I'm hoping that fixes the weird issues. Failing that I'll go back at it with the vac gauge and the idle mixture screw. It's also possible that the electric choke isn't opening... If that's the case I'm going to say "screw it" and buy a cable to pull.

I also seem to have a leak coming out of the accelerator pump arm... I think that's what it's called. I can get a drip or two when I blip the throttle by hand (when the truck isn't running). I'm hesitant at this point to order a rebuild kit. The last time a seal leaked on a carburetor of mine it was because the needle float valve was letting fuel past it, and had nothing to do with the gasket I blamed as the culprit.

So yeah:

  • Make sure choke is working. Possibly order a pull cable and ditch the coil.

  • install FPR

  • see if leak persists

  • order rebuild kit and possibly jets

I'm really beginning to wonder if I could get a 22RE intake manifold for the same price. Or at least for the same headache!

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
7/24/15 4:40 p.m.

If you have the faintest clue what you're doing, a carb rebuild is never a bad idea when things are acting funny. Jetting a weber on the other hand, I've been led to believe that's a little out of the ordinary. As I recall, they pretty much run entirely on the idle circuit up to 1/3 throttle or so. Unless the plugs are telling you otherwise, I doubt that's very far off to begin with though.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/24/15 5:19 p.m.

I haven't checked the plugs yet. I'm sure they'd read rich though given the bent nail/choke always on condition I got it in. I'm actually coming due for the head re-torque here in a second (accompanied by the oil change that goes with). I'll pull plugs then and give them a cleaning.

Really though (read: now that I'm no longer in a wrench throwing fit of rage) I went and got ahead of myself. Rule 1: Good troubleshooting starts with proper maintenance. I should make sure the carb is getting the right fuel pressure and NOT leaking gasoline before I go screwing with the fiddily stuff.

The rebuild? well, I do have an idea of what I'm doing. But my experience is limited to dirtbike carbs and one Rochester single barrel (so really a downdraft dirtbike carb). This weber shouldn't be too much more difficult.

If the guy hadn't helped me out a ton, I'd really like to punch him in the face for getting rid of the stock carb in favor of THIS weber. Honestly, if you're going to swap out something that works then spend the money and make sure what you're installing is going to work as well!!!

As it sits though, I pretty much owe all of the success I had in finding my truck to his phone call so.... We'll call it "paying my dues"

Ordering the rebuild kit means I won't be able to buy that Carboy I've been wanting. Damn carburetor Maybe next time.

Parts ordered. The hard part will be not playing with stuff till they get here. Oh, and there's a 22re in a local yard Not sure how complete it is, but I saw it on pick-n-pull's inventory.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/25/15 12:19 a.m.

Alright. I'm now 100% positive my electric choke is not opening as it should.

I've been eyeing it with suspicion for a while now, so i finally went out to check it with a completely cold engine and opened the throttle, the choke plate (I assume at least) should have closed and engaged the fast idle screw. It did neither (that explains some of my problems).

I have good 12v at the choke coil when the key is on. I'm thinking I'll run a ground wire and see if that helps anything (I was assuming it would ground through carburetor...)

Bleh

Good times

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
7/25/15 12:37 a.m.

It is often possible to crank the choke adjustment far enough that it stays open full time. Then you can see if it was the problem or not, it will start cold that way if you pump the gas a couple times.

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
7/25/15 1:15 a.m.

That's what I ended up doing. It still fluctuates at idle a bit but it does seem to idle more often than not now (without help, that is. if I catch it with the gas pedal before it dies then it will idle after a bump or two).

My other option was to partially close the choke and unscrew the fast idle screw until the throttle stop rested on the normal idle screw. I thought this would help with the cold start aaaaand, well I didn't know how much of an effect it'd have anywhere else, but in the end the plate being all the way open seems to work.

I'll have some poking to do with my multimeter. I want to make sure the 12v is going through the coil etc. I thought it could be a poor contact in there that's causing my issues as well.

Anyhoo, it's friday night, I just got off work, and my home brew is ready!

Prost!

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UltimaDork
7/25/15 2:03 a.m.

If it won't run right with the choke out of the equation I'd say it's carb rebuild time.

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