Turn an ugly duckling rubber bumper MGB into an homage to 60's endurance racers?

Without going too much into the backstory, I present the newest member of the stable, a slightly beat up 1977 MGB roadster with a surprise:

It has some nice stuff, including one of those fancy interior kits:

But the real reason I was interested in this particular example is right here:

No, that is not a B-series 1.8.  It is a 3.4L 60 degree V6 from a 90's Camaro kindly installed by the previous owner, a helicopter mechanic who likes to tinker.  Not shown is the accompanying T-5 5 speed overdrive transmission.   

I know a lot of folks here are not big fans of the 60 degree V6's.  To be honest neither am I.  As a someone who is currently LS swapping an 81 Trans Am, in all my time around F-bodies I have never heard anyone singing the praises of any of the various 60 degree V6's installed in 3rd and early 4th gen models.   

But in an MGB it really makes a lot of sense.   These engines really do just "drop in" without any sheet metal modifications, particularly in the rubber bumper models.  On a 77-80 model like mine, you can even keep the stock radiator and electric fans.    As a plus you get a nice 5 speed, and a quick look at the Moss catalog will show that you could spend MORE just putting a 5-speed behind the B-series then it costs to do the whole V6 swap.   And even the most modest 2.8 will get you into the 130-140 hp range, which is just north of the horsepower most people get with the $5k supercharger kit for the 1.8.   In fact, it is pretty close to the power that the factory GT V8's from the 70's made.   

So with this one simple swap, you are looking at the same horsepower (or more) than the full-on racing MGB's that competed at Sebring, Daytona and Le Mans had (more on those later).  Is it a mini Cobra?  No, but it makes for one healthy MGB.   Anyhow, I'm not here to convert anyone who doesn't like the 2.8/3.1/3.4's, but that's my story and I'm sticking to it.   

Are the front brakes big enough or are there easy swaps from another car ?

Question: is that v6 pretty much the same as the 3.8 that they used to use in brunton stalkers? That came supercharged in Pontiacs iirc (positive displacement blower).

We had a brunton that used to autocross with a group I ran with years ago, had good grunt and north of 300hp iirc.

3.8 is something else entirely.  There are NA parts from other motors in the 2.8/3.1/3.4 etc family that could be used to make more power.

SEADave said:

But the real reason I was interested in this particular example is right here:

No, that is not a B-series 1.8.  It is a 3.4L 60 degree V6 from a 90's Camaro kindly installed by the previous owner, a helicopter mechanic who likes to tinker.  Not shown is the accompanying T-5 5 speed overdrive transmission.   

Man, got to love the ingenuity the PO showed when extending that throttle cable to meet up with the TB

Good starting point indeed.  

To turn the ugly duckling into slightly less ugly, read up on lowering the ride height. There is easy ways to do this and crappy ways to do this as well as correct ways to do this. 

B

In reply to StripesSA1 :

Gm actually did that from the factory on a few cars in the 80s.....

I didn't believe it either, but ive seen it often enough on unmolested examples to say that they did. 

In reply to Dusterbd13-michael :

The previous owner actually did really nice work.  That cable with the ball chain is for the cruise control, and I have also seen them that way from the factory.   

I don't hate rubber bumpers MGs, at least in black cars. 
 

In fact, I've loved them ever since the first time that I saw this ad. 
 

Dusterbd13-michael said:

In reply to StripesSA1 :

Gm actually did that from the factory on a few cars in the 80s.....

 

I didn't believe it either, but ive seen it often enough on unmolested examples to say that they did. 

Well oops.... Shows my my lack of knowledge on some US cars. 

But still, very impressed with the idea by who ever thought it out

It's not that I hate the rubber bumpers, it is still an MGB, and as mentioned previously there were changes to the body shell, position of the steering rack, etc. that make the RB cars better for engine swaps.   Apparently the factory made changes to the shell when they put in the 3.5 to make the MGB GT V8, and those changes were incorporated into all the cars by the rubber bumper years. 

My main issue is how the front bumper obscures some of the most attractive features of the B, that little sculpted area under the headlight cut-out and the grille area:

In the past few years, a few intrepid souls have undertaken the task of converting rubber bumper cars to chrome.  You can even buy a kit direct from Moss with everything you need included.   I have even seen a picture where someone flipped the front rubber bumper upside down, and even that is an improvement.   But honestly that is not where I plan on going with this one.   

As a preview of my inspiration, here is a picture from the 1964 running of the 12 Hours of Sebring:

Here is an MGB, the "lost" #46 car, in the golden age of racing hanging out with Cobras, Ferraris, Porsches, etc.  If you look closely you can see there are two Ferrari GTO's in this picture, including the one that just got nailed by a Porsche 904 (yet still finished 7th).   That's Ken Miles in the #1 427 Cobra (didn't finish - mechanical).   

For some reason I think it is amazing that a humble little MGB was racing alongside all of these amazing historic and now almost priceless cars.   The #46 car didn't finish, but its teammates (#47 & 48) ending up coming in 17th and 22nd place overall, which is hard to comprehend considering the cars they were racing against and how minimal their modifications were by today's standards.   Those other two 1964 Sebring MGB's are still around and you can read about them here: https://classicmotorsports.com/articles/sebring-special-mgbs-window-racing-1960s/  This is my inspiration for the direction on this build.  

Seems like a great idea. You lose the heavy (and IMO ugly) rubber bumpers and add a lot of mid 60s race car style. I imagine the fiberglass parts for the Sebring conversion are lighter and cheaper than the chrome bumper parts too. Seems like a win win. Do you plan to add a hardtop and wires and racing stripes like #46 had?

Even just a set of vinyl cut meatballs would add a lot of style to the exterior. 

A nice moto lita steering wheel would go a long way too. 

I pulled the rubbers off mine then just sheetmetalled the front and rear. Huge improvement ( to me anyways)

The polyurethane ends are not so bad. Yes the reinforcement behind these ends weigh quite a bit but read up on removing these reinforcements,  not so daunting and this will adds  many many lbs of weight saving, all the while retaining the look.  

Lowering to chrome car height makes everything look right of course, even with te polyurethane ends.  Paint them body colour and wow a modern 1990's car will appear. 

B

In reply to petey :

Since the subject of brakes was broached, you might want to post some pics and details about the brakes on the OMGB. 

I support the notion that meatballs do a lot for a car of the era.

In reply to petey :

I really like what you have done with that car.   Lots of cool little details.   

In reply to SEADave :

Thanks its been fun

mblommel said:

Seems like a great idea. You lose the heavy (and IMO ugly) rubber bumpers and add a lot of mid 60s race car style. I imagine the fiberglass parts for the Sebring conversion are lighter and cheaper than the chrome bumper parts too. Seems like a win win. Do you plan to add a hardtop and wires and racing stripes like #46 had?

Even just a set of vinyl cut meatballs would add a lot of style to the exterior. 

A nice moto lita steering wheel would go a long way too. 

You guys are getting way ahead of me.   By my reckoning, here is what needs to be done to get where I want to be:

1. Works (factory) hardtop,
2. Lower to CB specs,
3. Wheels,
4. Remove rubber bumpers,
5. Front grill (either 60's style or custom)
6. Front & rear valence,
7. Address front fender indicator area (rubber bumper issue)
8. Address gap under taillight (another rubber bumper issue),
9. Side marker delete,
10. Backup light delete (why not),
11. Early style taillights,
12. Talbot/Raydot mirrors,
13. Moto Lita style steering wheel, and
14. Putting a quick-release fuel cap through the bootlid may be too much, maybe just put a quick release cap in the stock location.
15. Paint, stripes, meatballs, period sponsor stickers??

Some of these will be more challenging than others, particularly since I have no welding or bodywork skills...

In reply to SEADave :

Get a decent 220 MIG set up with .026 wire and start practicing on some 20 GA scrap. There are a few good tutorials on YouTube. Fit up is super important. Tack in opposite corners, take your time, add more racks, keep it cool. You shouldn't have too much trouble. 

Arent the metal filler pieces for the chrome bumper conversion available? 

Sounds like a great plan, good luck!

If you wander off to the MGExperience MGB forums there is a great writeup on how to properly lower a RB MGB. It was authored by "Ballonfoot" who knows more about MGBs than most anyone I know. Worth doing a bit of a search to see if you can find the thread.

If you are planning on fitting the flush valences that replace the bumper, be aware that they all fit very poorly and will rely on your skills to make them work. As I find it much easier to work with steel than aluminum or fiberglass, there is an alternative using steel repair panels from an MG midget. https://www.mgexp.com/forum/mg-engine-swaps-forum.40/how-to-make-sebring-rear-valance-in-steel.3286942/

.

Oh boy, I was hoping this wouldn't become one of those there's only one "right" way to lower a RB MGB threads...

In reply to SEADave :

apologize for trying to help. Will butt-out now. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯