NMNA: Big Block Jagggg

yupididit said:

In reply to frenchyd :

How wide is the jag v12? 

Not as wide as a BBC.

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

22 inches to the outside of the exhaust manifolds.  PS, the spark plugs aren't down by the exhaust manifolds like a Chevy. They are right up on top. By the intake manifolds. 

In reply to frenchyd :

What's the width of the v12 far side of valve cover to valve cover? 

In reply to yupididit :

20 & 1/2 

But that's only at the front 3 inches where the timing chains are. At the valve covers it's 18 & 3/8ths 

Since this is the BIG BLOCK JAGGG thread, why not just use a Jaguar since both engines would fit and one without any special work.

Both engines and trans could be built by the individuals where they live before hand. Frenchy can take his time building.  Stampie can build his BBC T-400 combo and install it in a Jag because there's more work installing the BBC and since less rusty Jags are available in the South. Then Stampie goes on the epic trip to Frenchys. Run it with the BBC setup that was already installed by Stampie & get some lap times /ETs then swap in the Jag V12 combo at Frenchy's house & repeat.

Get GRM to send Colin wood along with Stampie to document the shenanigans for a GRM story.  He's spending waaaay too much time on the internet anyway.

EDIT: Open headers, because race car, and keep it simple.

frenchyd said:

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

22 inches to the outside of the exhaust manifolds.  PS, the spark plugs aren't down by the exhaust manifolds like a Chevy. They are right up on top. By the intake manifolds. 

One of the things I like

In reply to frenchyd :

I'd like to suggest we limit the engine/ trans cost to $500. Or maybe even $300?  Keep things more original. Closer to stock

I don't think that really meets the discussion that always comes up. I'm sure some money grubbing hacks bac a ways charged WAY to much to pull a v12 out and drop in a 180 hp sbc in. But that not what the folks here would do. 

NOT A TA said:

Since this is the BIG BLOCK JAGGG thread, why not just use a Jaguar since both engines would fit and one without any special work.

Both engines and trans could be built by the individuals where they live before hand. Frenchy can take his time building.  Stampie can build his BBC T-400 combo and install it in a Jag because there's more work installing the BBC and since less rusty Jags are available in the South. Then Stampie goes on the epic trip to Frenchys. Run it with the BBC setup that was already installed by Stampie & get some lap times /ETs then swap in the Jag V12 combo at Frenchy's house & repeat.

Get GRM to send Colin wood along with Stampie to document the shenanigans for a GRM story.  He's spending waaaay too much time on the internet anyway.

EDIT: Open headers, because race car, and keep it simple.

I think the man may be onto something!

In reply to NOT A TA :

Sorry but some of us have a rule of only build what we want to own afterwards. I don’t want a Jag. I do want to own a kick everyone’s behind race car using a 350z as a donor. 

Stampie (FS) said:

In reply to NOT A TA :

Sorry but some of us have a rule of only build what we want to own afterwards. I don’t want a Jag. I do want to own a kick everyone’s behind race car using a 350z as a donor. 

I get that. I decided many years ago to only "build" certain cars. However you wouldn't be building a car to keep, just installing the BBC into a basically stock Jag. Disposition of the donor Jag after the competition could be determined beforehand. Take the BBC home and stick it in a 350Z if that's what you'd like.

"Building" a 350Z you want to keep, will take a LOT of time. Frenchy building a Jag he wants to keep will likely take even more time.  AND if you were to build a 350 Z so Frenchy's engine could be swapped in that would really increase your build time/expense.

It seemed a while back in this thread, an engine "build off" might be possible, but if you guys just want to argue on the internet until we all get tired of reading it in threads so be it. Baiting Frenchy and then folks ganging up to beat him up is getting old, we should all be friends here. The likelihood of you both building capable cars you want to keep,  individually, and then actually meeting up to compete is pretty slim. Hell, Frenchy's been talking about building a car for years. And even if the competition came to fruition whoever loses will forever say it was some other factor, not the engine (unless it blows up).

NOT A TA said:

Since this is the BIG BLOCK JAGGG thread, why not just use a Jaguar since both engines would fit and one without any special work.

Both engines and trans could be built by the individuals where they live before hand. Frenchy can take his time building.  Stampie can build his BBC T-400 combo and install it in a Jag because there's more work installing the BBC and since less rusty Jags are available in the South. Then Stampie goes on the epic trip to Frenchys. Run it with the BBC setup that was already installed by Stampie & get some lap times /ETs then swap in the Jag V12 combo at Frenchy's house & repeat.

Get GRM to send Colin wood along with Stampie to document the shenanigans for a GRM story.  He's spending waaaay too much time on the internet anyway.

EDIT: Open headers, because race car, and keep it simple.

I'd be willing to do that. Build the Jag car and run it. Let Stampie come up with his engine and transmission and install it in my car . Then run it. 
If the Chevy is carbureted it shouldn't be too difficult. I have welders and tools galore. Anything special Stampie needs he can bring with him. He would need a tach since mine is set for 12 cylinders. Stampie did say he was willing to travel. 

2000 Jaguar Vanden Plas $1800 obo - $1800

https://jacksonville.craigslist.org/cto/d/jacksonville-2000-jaguar-vanden-plas/7137921994.html

I know Stampie doesn't want a Jag for the platform but this is in Jacksonville and cheap!

03Panther said:

In reply to frenchyd :

I'd like to suggest we limit the engine/ trans cost to $500. Or maybe even $300?  Keep things more original. Closer to stock

I don't think that really meets the discussion that always comes up. I'm sure some money grubbing hacks bac a ways charged WAY to much to pull a v12 out and drop in a 180 hp sbc in. But that not what the folks here would do. 

Maybe that's my point?  Or at least one of them?  A Stock Jaguar engine is a wonderful place to start.  Yes you can spend a lot of money ( or get lucky buying used parts). and fix up a Chevy.   

Since few here  have much experience going wheel to wheel on a race track they may not understand  the strains a 30 minute race put on a car.  How much a Chevy needs to change to survive at the track. 
They think some flash reading on a dyno will result in a race win.  
I know from experience a cast Chevy crank won't last a race weekend. Even a forged crank needs real work done on the oiling system to last a weekend. And neither will survive much over revving.  

A few 30 second passes at an autocross is a world difference  with a race weekend.   That's a couple of  30 minute track sessions on Saturday  a 30 minute warm up Sunday morning and  a 40 minute or even hour long session  on Sunday.

 My Corvette with forged LT1 crank. 4 bolt mains block . Forged Rods Forged pistons. Etc. lasted through drivers school and 99% of my qualifying race. Blowing up on the main straight allowing me to coast across the finish line for 3rd place.  Yes they were used pieces. 

frenchyd said:

I'd be willing to do that. Build the Jag car and run it. Let Stampie come up with his engine and transmission and install it in my car . Then run it. 
If the Chevy is carbureted it shouldn't be too difficult. I have welders and tools galore. Anything special Stampie needs he can bring with him. He would need a tach since mine is set for 12 cylinders. Stampie did say he was willing to travel. 

Ok now we're getting somewhere.  I have questions that I'll post tonight but first, you won't hold me responsible when my BBC blows up your Jag IRS?

I've got a couple tachs sitting on the shelf I'll never use. Be happy to ship one to Stampie to use & keep if he needs one.

Stampie (FS) said:

frenchyd said:

I'd be willing to do that. Build the Jag car and run it. Let Stampie come up with his engine and transmission and install it in my car . Then run it. 
If the Chevy is carbureted it shouldn't be too difficult. I have welders and tools galore. Anything special Stampie needs he can bring with him. He would need a tach since mine is set for 12 cylinders. Stampie did say he was willing to travel. 

Ok now we're getting somewhere.  I have questions that I'll post tonight but first, you won't hold me responsible when my BBC blows up your Jag IRS?

The rearend from a v12 xjs won't break easy. You need a lot of power and traction. I think the weakest rearend jag used was basically a dana44. 

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

If you BBC swap an XJS for this competition, I'll buy it from you. 

In reply to yupididit :

You gonna pay me for my hours in it?  Actually Frenchy might be onto something.  Trans mounts would be the same.  Just motor mounts and ;maybe radiator to swap to the better engine.

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

$.10 a hour?

In reply to yupididit :

Only if I get to fudge the timesheets.

In reply to Stampie (FS) :

That's fraud, Sir! 

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

My suggestion...

Since neither of you is gonna play in the other's sandbox, I suggest you both have to do both. Frenchy will build a $2000 Challenge car and bring it to Gainesville, then both cars will compete on the road course of Frenchy's choice. 
 

Transport costs will be covered by donations from forum members. I will start by contributing $100. 

I'll add $100, so now we're at $200. 

dettonator20 said:

2000 Jaguar Vanden Plas $1800 obo - $1800

https://jacksonville.craigslist.org/cto/d/jacksonville-2000-jaguar-vanden-plas/7137921994.html

I know Stampie doesn't want a Jag for the platform but this is in Jacksonville and cheap!

That won't be an easy swap for either of us. The Last V12's were in  1996  plus the transmission tunnel is smaller.  

dyintorace (Forum Supporter) said:

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

My suggestion...

Since neither of you is gonna play in the other's sandbox, I suggest you both have to do both. Frenchy will build a $2000 Challenge car and bring it to Gainesville, then both cars will compete on the road course of Frenchy's choice. 
 

Transport costs will be covered by donations from forum members. I will start by contributing $100. 

I'll add $100, so now we're at $200. 

Only if we can also race at someplace like Daytona . A track where real top speed matters. Where you can hold it WFO  ( wide flat open for the censors.  ) for a decent interval. 

Stampie (FS) said:

In reply to yupididit :

You gonna pay me for my hours in it?  Actually Frenchy might be onto something.  Trans mounts would be the same.  Just motor mounts and ;maybe radiator to swap to the better engine.

Are you saying that a big block Chevy runs hotter than that V12 with all those pistons?  Fair enough I'll take out the more efficient Jaguar radiator and put in an aluminum one I got with mine.