Maybe not the best driving of all time, but the Fiat 124 Coupe was a seriously nice driving car back in the day, and much overlooked today. In fact I think Road and Track gave it the nod in a comparison test that included the then new 240Z in terms of driving dynamics.
TeamEvil wrote: Late model Porsche 914; once you get used to the over-center clutch and brake pedals. Handling, safety, and over-the-top fun !
Yeah, I like my 914, a lot
Tim Suddard wrote: Leo, You mention MGB. That car is really underrated, as it does pretty darned well at just about everything.
Funny, cause I put the MGB at a yard short of just about everything. Performance and technology-wise, the MGB was a 50s car playing in a 60s arena. "Adequate" is about the best way to describe anything it did compared to its contemporaries. As a classic it is a moot point, its cool cause its old and looks good.
Back on topic, I think that you need to specify eras in order to answer this one. The term "Classic" is way too broad since it includes the Miata that would walk away with all the awards.
I really think Chapman had this figured out in that he made cars that handled very well while not beating the driver into kidney failure. That was a rare thing in his time.
My personal favorite is the 240Z as it ushered in the era of comfortable, reliable, mass produced sports car. The BMW 2002 is also in this class.
The Miata is in the shop to repair the lane splitting bingo thing, been driving the 911 for the last week and have to say, the driving experience is just better in that car than I can put into words. Direct steering, stellar brakes, stiff chassis. How old are we talking about, does 30 years old count, or does it have to be 40 or 50?
I didn't get it until I drove one. 911 is a pure drivers car.
Maybe not for all tastes but my TR250 is the best driving classic I can afford and enjoy driving nearly every day.
In reply to 68TR250:
Not a matter of taste, really. The stock handling of the TR5,250 and 6 was impaired by poorly chosen rear spring rates and the North American cars were crippled by losing 30% of their power in coming to North America.
Not saying you can't enjoy it - I'm sure you do, just that on an absolute scale it doesn't measure up to nomination as one of the best driving classics of the 1960s, much less of all time.
PS - I have owned multiple Triumphs and have enjoyed them.
My father used to have an old Corvair. That thing was a blast to drive.
All old sports cars are fun and the best in their own right. That being said, my personal fav is the TR8 coupe, followed closely by the TVR 280i. The TR8 coupe does everything well except carry more than one passenger. Lots of power, lots of room, great heat and AC. 35 years old and they still drive like a modern car. The 280i is just plain comfortable, gets looks wherever you go, accelerates well and stops better than just about every race car ever built. The best part is 20 grand will get you one of each.
Couldn't agree more regarding the TR8 Coupe ! ! Great car, terrific body style.
The TR6 could not be worse for anything other than driving around the lake, on a smooth road, on a sunny day. I had a fine one owner 1974 which I had completely restored, sold it within a month of getting it back from the shop. Ridiculous rear suspension, nose heavy front, worthless second gear, limited engine performance, and massive tires all added onto what essentially began as a neat little TR4.
Tragic . . .
TeamEvil wrote: The TR6 could not be worse for anything other than driving around the lake, on a smooth road, on a sunny day.
I just autocrossed a TR6 faster than many newer/better cars today, and had a blast doing it. It's not the easiest car to drive fast, but it can be made to go quite well. In stock form, it isn't a great performance car. Change out the springs, firm up the shocks, and add a rear sway bar and it can be very fast once balanced. No, it doesn't handle like a Miata. But I'd bet money it could take on many more expensive classics. Given the number of modifications required to get to this point, I don't think it meets the spirit of "best driving classics". I'm just saying the stock shortcomings can be easily improved upon. In terms of ruggedness and reliability, I'd certainly take a Triumph over a Lotus.
"In stock form, it isn't a great performance car."
Exactly what I said, totally agree. For cruising smooth roads in the best of situations, it'll do, for anything else, modifications are sorely needed, as you mentioned.
As this thread seems to be about cars as-delivered, the TR6 should be left out/never included. Anything can be improved upon with any car, but I think that we're talking about the best driving classics as they came from the manufacturer. In that case, the TR6 is badly flawed. Totally agree with you, but I wish that I didn't.
I wanted a TR6 since they were first announced, used to scoop up those wonderful color brochures at BL dealership and simply dream over the car. Owned four of them and finally found a one owner, anticipated driving it forever once a full restoration was completed, then sold it a month later. Dark green with tan interior and tan canvas top, new red lines and perfect chrome/body. New everything top to bottom. Beautiful ! !
TeamEvil wrote: new red lines
There's your problem. 
I'm amazed that those tires were used on so many performance cars back in the 60s. If those were the hot ticket, I'm not sure why you'd need more than 150 hp.
I'm not disagreeing with you. Just wanted to point out that a TR6 can be made to go fast. In the late 80s, our local Triumph club visited Group 44 in Winchester (my brother went, but unfortuately I was on travel). They got to ask Bob Tullius questions about racing Triumphs, and he couldn't help but burst a few bubbles. He pretty much stated that the TR6 was outclassed by the 240Z, and it took a lot of effort just to stay competitive. In stock trim, the difference was even greater. You're really comparing 1970s technology with largely 1950s engineering.
What about a Yenko Stinger? It's a homologated race car, but a wonderful example of what American cars could be.
Good stuff guys. We have been talking about categories or different budget levels. And of course modified cars don't really count. I have fixed all of the problems on my TR6, and it is now a fantastic car.
Tim I'm glad you mentioned mods and budgets; The aforementioned TR6 is a good example, all of the issues are known and fixable, but for a quarter of the investment you could have something like my Datsun. The 1200 would easily outperform a TR6 dollar for dollar, naturally it's not as stylish, but does that make it a "better" driving classic.
Usability must factor in as well; wspohn mentioned early 911 turbos and their propensity to snap spin. I have to tread lightly here; I know full well I am a just a club racer I also know that I have a better than average skill level. I have only driven an early 911 turbo once and it was only on track but I didn't find the car that diabolical but again I'm not the average driver. What I did find that would take the car out of the running for me is the very heavy controls on the car. If I had Tim's build rather than my typical motorcycle racer jockey-esque 139lb I'm still shoppin in the kids section build, it wouldn't be an issue.
So my favorites are:
Any 1970-1983 911 (non turbo) but 911 prices have become completely stupid.
Based on price I think the 240-280Zs provide a heck of a bargain and performance.
For bargain fun I'd say Fiat X 1/9 or Datsun 1200 (prejudiced view)
For a sedan I actually like the early 5 series BMW but those may be considered to new.
5-10 years from now the choice will be "Miata" they are 25 years old now.
My totally subjective .02
Tom
Something I always thought would be an interesting comparison would be to do test of full stock, as delivered cars (as close as you can get at least) from the early 60's. Driving in an MG or Corvair these days is a bit "uh OK, it's nice", but in the early 60's, oh boy! they must have been a revelation from the "common" car of the day. Going from a "floating boat" style car to a light 4 wheel independent suspension car has to be pretty dramatic.
One thing that is a bit hard to judge is the effect of bias ply tires on each type of cars. I know you can still get them these days (I believe), but I am sure they are not cheap, and do not offer a lot of sizes.
Even driving a stock Mustang after driving Corvairs is a bit of a shock. I thought the rear end was about to fall out when I went across a large expansion joint on a freeway curve!
I have never driven one but I hear that the Lancia Fulvia is a really, really good drive.
I'll second both the FIAT 124 coupe and spider. The coupe is more buttoned down because the top adds rigidity you can feel. The same goes for comparing the Alfa GTV and the Duetto / Spider but I digress.
I loved my 124 spiders. They make great noises, rev like mad, and are adroit enough to be loads of fun to drive on twisty two-lane. I've driven 10-12 hours straight in them on the highway and felt fine, unlike some other sports cars of the era.
That smooth five speed and effortless convertible top were wonderful as well. Had a 124 Spyder in the early 80's and loved it !
My vote would go for a mk2 Scirocco. Just everything for that car worked for me when I drove one.
mk1 Sciroccos are nice too. Good ones are almost impossible to find these days. When they first came out, it's hard to explain how different they looked.
German schnitzel in an Italian wrapper, and those Italians design a good looking wrapper.
E9? Just a thought.
racerdave600 wrote: Maybe not the best driving of all time, but the Fiat 124 Coupe was a seriously nice driving car back in the day, and much overlooked today. In fact I think Road and Track gave it the nod in a comparison test that included the then new 240Z in terms of driving dynamics.
I would have one.
More for the design and fiat twin cam though i don't have any idea on what the handling is like. I'm guessing it's just a typical solid rear axle car but the AE86 Corolla is as well and is praised.
The Skyline I have is the oldest car i've driven that had the best suspension on a stock car that old even when those older cars were refreshed or near new. Probably because it's a foreign suspension setup and not watered down for the US.
My 77 celica liftback was really nice driving car.
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