Choices

Okay everybody, feel free to weigh in on this one. I am considering a few cars to own as a bit more of a long term proposition. I know about each but am on the fence about a choice. I have located examples of each with one exception which would likely trump the others.

The first is a 1961 Bristol 407. If this car really turns out to be real it will be what comes home.

The next is a MGB/GT. I have located 3 nice ones, a 76, a 69 and a 73. They all cost about the same money with the 73 being the best value as well as the cleanest and nicest example.

The next is the 1964 Volvo 1800S I have a deposit on that I am willing to walk away from and the owner won't care as it was a decent deposit.

The final choice is a 1968 Fiat 124 Spider, all original and at least as nice as the Alfa was with original paint and interior.

All the cars with the exception of the Bristol cost about the same amount of money.

I will be using the car to go to the Mitty, Kohler and many other events including a cross country drive to Monterey.

Opinions? Experience? Warnings? Thanks Andy

I could afford three of your choices and likely not the Bristol. So that is trump. It is the most collectable to take to a show but the least sporty. I own a Fiat 124 and it is very good if you want "cool" and convertible and sporty and useable. But, they are rather uncomfortable for long runs. The Volvo is likely the most comfortable for long drives. The GT is a very good LBC but I feel tight and hot in them and it is the least comfortable of the three. You choose your poison or is it tonic. You have the resources to address the weaknesses of each model such as good A/C and insulation in the Fiat. I would go for the Volvo since they are rare at a show and that is half the fun.

Cheers Ron

The Bristol, 1800 and B-GT are coupes. The Fiat is a convertible. Stating the obvious, I know, but sometimes it brings clarity.

Leaving the Bristol out (Trump as Ron said) then you're choosing between 2 coupes and a convertible.

If you would have said 124 Coupe, then I would understand the dilemma. Throwing in the 'vert confuses the situation.

This begs the question, do you want a coupe or a 'vert? From there, the choice is easier. If you chose the 'vert, you have one option and you're done.

Personally, I'd take the 1800 over the B-GT. It might be different if it were a C-GT. I like both cars actually, but the Volvo is really pretty. As a 122 owner, I am partial to the 1800, but mostly because they're really well built. However, there is a ton more aftermarket support for the B-GT.

For an sort of long distance driving, it's got to be the Volvo. I've had B GTs and while they're fun, I find them too uncomfortable for long distance driving - and that's from someone who doesn't think twice about driving a coil-overed Miata from the UK to the easternmost part of Switzerland and back.

I'd also think that the Volvo is probably best placed to digest some proper highway miles without too many parts falling off or otherwise demanding attention.

I would agree that the Bristol would trump all of them, though.

What you need is a Chevelle SS! Ok, just joking..... I vote for the Volvo. Considering how Andy has size issues from what I hear, (not from his wife!) I'd think the Volvo would offer the most comfortable cabin, especially on a long drive. I love MGB/GTs, but I'd think your 6'4" or so frame would get awfully cramped in there after a few hundred miles.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the Bristol though.

Thanks for the wishes about the Bristol. I really want it. We shall see if my vintage racing friend from California John delivers on getting me in touch with the owner.

I think I am crazy not to complete the deal on the 1800S. It is a 64 which means all the original styling cues and the owner has been more than candid about the cars needs. Also the price I am paying seems like an extremely good deal.

I have had two Volvo 1800's. Loved the style but a little short on power. Tended to be hot in the summer. That said I am looking for another one. If you don't get the Volvo, please send me some info on it at gw143gw@aol.com.

Thanks gwade. I will let you know. I need to do a few things to it immediately and will likely drive it for the summer. If I get ready to sell it I will give you first crack at it if you like.

The Bristol is the stodgiest old style of the nw series, and wouldn't turn my crank, but having said that, the Bristols aren't exactly thick on the ground and if one really wants to own one, you can't afford to be picky.

I much prefer the fire eating Jensen CV-8 - which is why I own one instead of an early Bristol.

The MGB GT is a classic usable car and looks nice. 73 = OK 76+ no go 69 = best choice but sounds like the 73 condition trumps that.

Fiat 124 - wouldn't even consider it if it were a coupe. The converts were fun. Check body very carefully......

The Volvo is an interesting choice. A bit heavy, dead reliable, not as sporting as even the MGB, but solid and it does have interesting avant garde styling that endears it even if you weren't a fan of the early Simon Templar Saint with Roger Moore.

You've posed an interesting choice. I'd incline to the Volvo, then the MGB, but only if it has OD (if one has OD and the others don't consider buying the one that has it - very important for cruising).

But I'm not sure I could make myself ignore the stolid old Bristol....but then what can you say about the styling sense of anyone that would own a Jensen CV8......

Let me say a few things in defense of the Volvo, not so much to influence Andy's decision (he's done his homework), but for anyone else who may be considering one.

A '64 1800S is rated at 108 bHP, and weighs 2450 lbs. with half a tank of gas. Power to weight ratio is comparable to the 124 Spider and I think a tad better than the MGB. It's not torquey at lower revs -- you have to twist its tail a bit to get to the power. '66 - '68 models had 115 HP, '69 118, and '70 - '71 130 with EFI standard. For those who want more go, it's dead simple to get ~135 HP from a B18 engine or ~145 from a B20, which is a bolt-in swap. It's possible to get w-a-y more without compromising tractability, but that starts getting expensive.

All except for a few very early examples have overdrive standard. You can cruise the things all day at 70 MPH (about 3300 RPM) and get 30 MPG doing it.

Ride is on the soft side, and with the better grip today's tires have, there's a lot of body roll when pushed in the twisties. A heavier front sway bar transforms the handling, and further suspension improvements in all areas are readily available. The unibody is extremely stiff and handling is inherently well-mannered.

Aftermarket support was thin some years ago, but it's gotten steadily better. You can't build one from scratch out of a catalog, but pretty much anything you'd need to restore one and/or rebuild the mechanicals is available from small suppliers.

I am hoping to pick mine up the first weekend of March and drive it back to Chicago.

Now a 124 Fiat Coupe would be my choice over a the Volvo and MG for the driving experience. The Volvo has the showier and more complex body style but the Fiat is a bit more elegant. They are sporty, uncommon and, with a few upgrades in insulation and A/C, can be very comfortable long distance cruisers.

Cheers Ron

I would love a 124 Coupe, especially in the earlier body style. Haven't seen one in decades, though...

http://www.volvoklub.com/razno/1800_337sema_volvo.jpg

I love those volvos, especially when theyre updated some.

I agree with everyone on the 124 coupe but I only like the first 124 AC models with single headlights and they are all gone. It was my first car. If I found a really nice one I would already own it. There are just no nice ones for sale.

I love the CV-8 Jensen but have never seen one for sale in this country. I would even entertain a nice Interceptor notchback hardtop but know of only one of those fro sale her either.

Oh and the only reason I am still fence sitting at all is that the Fiat Spider I found is a 1968 and is in amazing condition, no rust and 60000 original miles. If someone wants an early spider to maintain, not modify and enjoy this is it.

As far as the Bristol goes, if the guy gets in touch with me, I will be buying it.

Sometimes it is the particular example that overturns the decision. An early Spider in great shape gets a lot of points in its favor. I don't think you will go wrong purchasing one if only to keep it, clean it up and sell it in two years. Unrestored ones are getting very rare, indeed. This is like last night's men's skate performance in the Olympics. You had athetics versus style and a quad versus the cleaner performance and experience versus youth. Too bad, that there were not two or more gold medals.

Cheers Ron

I agree Ron. I am actually likely to buy both. I pick up the 1800S next Saturday.

It's an 1800S? That's what I want next =)

Not the P1800 or the 1800E or 1800ES, but the 1800S. Nice.

So it should have the older style gauges and the carbed motor. Right?

It is in fact a 1964 1800S. It is on of the cars that has lots of Jensen details, the hockey stick side trim, egg crate grill and cow horn bumpers and is in fact still built by Pressed steel in Scotland with final assembly in Sweden. It has the older style dash and green face gauges. It has second style seats and twin SU carbs.

A lot of people people, including myself, think it is the model to get. I would have loved a Jensen built car but there are none for sale.

I pick it up a week from Saturday, drive it to Daytona for meetings at the GRM/CMS office and then back home to Chicago.

What could go wrong? It is only 46 years old.

Andy, is the Illinois DMV easy to work with when you buy a car out of state and drive it back? What about insurance? And Tim did that recently with the land yacht he bought out west. And Tom did it last year with the TR6 he bought in New Hampshire and drove back to Florida. So Florida must also be easy to work with. The DMV here in Rhode Island has some pretty convoluted rules and regs about that kind of activity and strives to do whatever they possibly can to make as much trouble and red tape for us. They go out of their way to make life our lives miserable.

Hey Gary, that was me who drove the TR-6 from NH to FL. Come to think of it I drove the Edsel with Tim from CA to FL as well!

FL is pretty easy. Speak with your insurance agent first, and get the car insured. The plates can be occasionally be bought beforehand, but many states have a 30-day grace period where you can drive on the bill of sale. I know in FL they need to verify your vin in person before they issue a plate.

Sorry Joe, now I remember It was you.

I use a collector car insurance company for that stuff so it is a non-issue fro insurance, they just add that car. As for titling, I have not had any issues in Illinois and you guys know that I change cars a lot.

I spent a summer in Newport RI when I was in college at my then girlfriends parents palatial estate. It was terrific fun.

Sorry to get off-track, but Andy mentioned Newport, RI so I thought I’d add a little to that. Newport is a great resort and party town, at least during the summer months. The Newport Concours d’Elegance in May is superb (http://www.newportconcours.org). It’s small compared to a venue like Pebble Beach but is a quality show nevertheless. And the setting overlooks Narragansett Bay, almost as pretty as Pebble Beach. A couple years ago a competing organization tried to muscle-in and create a new perennial mega-show called the Vanderbilt Concours d’Elegance. They went as far as to bring in Dan Gurney, Sterling Moss, Bob Bondurant, David Piper, and a few other big names. Gurney shipped in a half-dozen of his historic race cars for the event. Unfortunately the organization lost their collective shirts on the deal and the inaugural Vanderbilt Concours d’Elegance became the only one. (But the original and smaller Newport Concours d’Elegance in May continues on). If anybody out there is near Rhode Island in the summer, then Newport is a great destination.