Semi-rough old Pontiac value?

I hate to make a thread like this, but I'm not getting anywhere anywhere else.

I have a '67 Pontiac LeMans convertible. My father bought it new for my mother for Christmas in '66. 326/2bbl/Powerglide, currently red with a parchment interior and good black replacement top.

It's a high-mileage car that has been driven. I got it from my mother in 1982 or so and with my father's help did a decent amateur restoration. At that point we changed the original color from Champagne Gold to the correct Rallye Red, including the door jambs/trunk/hidden areas, interior out, top off, etc. Fixed the body rust pretty well, but with Bondo, not steel, since it was 1982 and repro panels didn't exist.

The car has about 270,000 on it. Engine was thoroughly rebuilt at about 195,000 and looked great inside. Runs pretty well and consistently. I had the trans rebuilt with new TC about 3,000 miles ago; it was not well done and could use some massage, but it works and shifts fine. Leaks a bit at the main seal.

The car is complete but it's got some dings and the RR quarter was lightly hit, plus a bit of rust returning on the 25+ year old resto. Coupled with the old Bondo, you'd want to replace it. It had some frame rust which was reinforced, but will want attention again.

Been garaged for the last 18 years or so, during which it's covered maybe 5,000 miles. I haven't driven it in a year or more but it starts up and runs fine with minor coaxing.

What it really needs is a good frame-off restoration, which of course it is not worth because it is not a GTO (that's another story).

The real problem is that even though I'm emotionally attached to this car, I've lost interest in it as a vehicle. I'd really rather have a track rat / dedicated autocrosser.

Since I haven't really done anything in the last 15 years but drive it occasionally when the weather is nice, I have absolutely no idea what it would be worth. It needs work, but it's 42 years old and that counts.

I've looked at ads but all I can find are GTOs which are insane no matter what condition, and LeMans that have been restored into bastardized GTOs.

So if I wanted to sell this car to fund a different project, what would it bring? Any guesses within an order of magnitude will be welcomed.

I wanted to add that I harbor no illusions that the car is worth much in its present state, so any information is welcomed.

Threads like this are cool. By the way, my parents got a brand-new four-speed, Posi GTO in 1967. No, they no longer have it.

From what my wife tells me, back in the late 60s/early 70s the mother-in-law forced my father-in-law to take the GTO he'd just bought back to the dealership and get something more sensible...

Duke, are you sure that your car needs a frame-off resto? There's a big difference between 'needs' and 'I really would like to'. If the frame can be sorted without lifting the body it'll probably be worth doing. I guess.

Can't offer much advice on the value, sorry, but it might be worth sticking it on the bay with a reserve that'll mirror what you think it'll take you to part with it and see if it gets anywhere close?

It is a convertible. Depending on how well you can present it and how well it drives, expect $5-10K in its present shape. I would clean it up and get it to drive well but would not restore it. Let a new owner do that. Go to traderonline and see the current asking prices.

Cheers Ron

Thanks, gang! Here's the car:

It looks just like this on the other side except the quarter panel is stove in a bit.

My father bought the car new for my mother for Christmas in 1966. He was going to buy my mother a GTO, but coincidentally, my eldest sister turned 16 right around that time. My father decided that no way in Hades was he letting a 16-year-old anywhere near a GTO. So he changed down to a LeMans instead.

In a bizarre twist, in about 1976, my father was given a complete and running 1968 GTO convertible for free, which he cleaned up and gave to that same sister, who kept it for the next 25 years. So not only did my sister jip me out of my GTO, but she got given one of her own. Bitter much? Nah.

All of that is irrelevant to the story at hand of course...

Tim, the car could be made presentable and driveable without a frame-off, but to be truly solid, it needs one. As I said, though, there is little point from a financial investment perspective, and I'm not excited by the car any more enough to do it as an emotional investment.

It's fun enough to cruise around in and I have a thousand great memories of growing up with it, but with a 2-speed automatic, non-power all-drum brakes, and typical GM pinky-force power steering, it's a parade cruiser that would be great for local car shows if it was done up. I'm just not interested in that scene too much any more.

Thanks for the tips, too, Ron. I'll check out the traderonline site.

I'd drive it.

Nice car, too rich for me and I have no idea what it's worth.

If you make it a GTO clone, tell them up front it's a clone and send it to Barrett Jackson your very short driver in the photo may get a pass to college.

Dan

Convertible = good,
not the high output engine = bad

All things considered a nice car to play with or just drive.

I had something similar - a 1972 Le Mans convertible that had been in my family from new. It had the big engine (one of only 30 or so cars built with the 455HO) but because it was a Le Mans instead of a GTO (they didn't make a GTO convert in 1972) so lacked that name, it brought about half what a GTO convert from the year before would have. It just wasn't my kind of car, and I couldn't see keeping it around to not use.

wspohn wrote: Convertible = good, not the high output engine = bad

Although it's probably easier to swap engines vs. chopping a top. And please, stop bumping this thread. I really, really lust after these cars. Yeah, I'd want a GTO, but a drop-top LeMans would be cool. No, I don't need any more cars at the moment.

This: began life as a parts car for my buddy's GTO. I convinced him it was too nice to scrap so we did a budget resto on it. Beautiful car. Not at all fast (326/powerglide). I really, really liked this car but as the OP stated, the driving experience just wasn't that rewarding. We did this car over 15 years ago and I know it sold for over $5000 then, and it was only a hardtop. The ridiculous rise in GTO prices have dragged the LeMans and Tempest models up with them. Any convertible is really money in the bank. I think I may have sold my '65 Skylark ragtop far too cheap a few years ago but I needed money and space more than I needed to make a killing. Being a convertible makes all the difference to driving these, IMO. I find the top-down joy easily negates the lack of sportiness. It's nice to sometimes just leisurely drive and enjoy the day, and American convertible beat sports cars in this regard handily. No wind buffeting. No tractor suspension. I've got other cars for that purpose.

David S. Wallens wrote: And please, stop bumping this thread. I really, really lust after these cars. Yeah, I'd want a GTO, but a drop-top LeMans would be cool. No, I don't need any more cars at the moment.

David:

I'm looking for a track rat / dedicated autocrosser. What leftover GRM project cars fit that bill that you'd consider trading for?

David S. Wallens wrote: Although it's probably easier to swap engines vs. chopping a top. And please, stop bumping this thread. I really, really lust after these cars.

The guys that want these cars and are willing to pay big bucks want certified original cars, not enghine swaps. Originality and matching numbers really matters to them and WILL affect value.

I still kick myself for not buying my pit crew's old car back in the late 70s - a low miles Plymouth Convertible with a 440 sixpack. All I could think of at the time was the gas bills. Now I own a sixpack Chrysler (although in my fibreglass Jensen, so much much more economical.....)

Holy thread revival, Batman.

I still have the car. Every word in the original post still holds true. A couple months after the OP, we had a yard sale. A couple guys poked their heads in the garage and asked to see what was under the cover, and left me their phone numbers if I wanted to sell.

Fast forward to this morning. One of those guys stopped my wife as she was leaving for work this morning and told her he was really interested in buying the car if we still had it. Gave his number again and asked us to call him.

I'm still 100% torn - brain says "sell", heart says "keep". Wife says "do what you won't regret later". She'd approve getting the bodywork done (at least a basic 15-foot job), but I can't do that myself and I have at least 3 other things I could spend that money on more rewardingly.

I could also use the garage room. What I really need is a time-space vortex to park it in until I retire in 10 years.

Talk me through this, my CM therapists. Sell? Keep? Restore? Send it to the local vo-tech for a year and have them rebuild it? Help... me...

I can feel your pain.

I finally got my wife to list her 67 Dodge Coronet on CL this weekend. Been in her family since new, parked for 20 years in the garage. Not running, needs a full restore. 4 door, 273 V8. We have two people coming this weekend to look at it. She can't get a good selling price in her head. I'm thinking $30 over scrap value, she listed (emotional value) it at $1200. She's been seeing too many car auctions on TV comparing, price wise,it to 2 door hemis in her head.

We're restoring my oldest son's Spitfire over the winter, so the garage space would be nice.

good luck

mike