Post something on social media about comparing these four particular classic roadsters, and the comments will fly:
“The MGB couldn’t possibly hang with this group of cars.”
“The TR6 has two more cylinders so it’s a shoe-in.”
“The Miata is too modern for a fair comparison.”
“The Alfa’s styling makes it the clear winner.”
As it turned out, none of …
I read this article on a flight from Palm Springs up to Seattle . I thought most of it was fair to say comparison wise. The only car I haven't driven in the bunch is a TR6. I've even driven the roadsters you didn't test. I'm glad I didn't make it to the 2000 Challenge as I would have had to Pimp Slap you Tim. Why you ask? I have both a Alfa Spider and a Fiat spider in my garage. The fiat has a way sexier look to it than the Alfa does. Not saying the Alfa is a slouch it just looks like most of the other slab sided sports cars out there.
My sister's boyfriend got a new 1970 mgb when he graduated college (koo koo ka Choo, Mrs Robinson), which he left with me for the summer while he did it stint in the peace corps.
My other sister's boyfriend had traded through 289 Mustang, chevelle SS 396, barracuda, and 350 C2 vette.
I was hooked on acceleration...until the MGB. SO much fun when you could turn without braking.
So...Corvairs with modified suspensions, engine swaps....to a non-running BMW Bavaria (which looks a lot like the Vair!). Now I had light weight, handling, reasonable power, headroom, and RELIABILITY. Other than my Mark 1 MR2s, I've stuck with the bimmers.
Since I'm too tall for miatas and the like, I have an M Roadster and M Coupe....solves my equation the best.
What's really nice is that we have so many options to meet our "needs".
My sister's boyfriend got a new 1970 mgb when he graduated college (koo koo ka Choo, Mrs Robinson), which he left with me for the summer while he did it stint in the peace corps.
My other sister's boyfriend had traded through 289 Mustang, chevelle SS 396, barracuda, and 350 C2 vette.
I was hooked on acceleration...until the MGB. SO much fun when you could turn without braking.
So...Corvairs with modified suspensions, engine swaps....to a non-running BMW Bavaria (which looks a lot like the Vair!). Now I had light weight, handling, reasonable power, headroom, and RELIABILITY. Other than my Mark 1 MR2s, I've stuck with the bimmers.
Since I'm too tall for miatas and the like, I have an M Roadster and M Coupe....solves my equation the best.
What's really nice is that we have so many options to meet our "needs".
I am a long time MG fan (not MGBs, but MGAs and MGC) and have also added a Z4MC to the fleet (but my other modern sports car, a Solstice coupe is quicker).
Enjoyed the article, which I thought was quite accurate.
I wonder where these classics would fall in the mix?
Not every old car is a classic :)
1990 Miata vs a bunch of 60's and 70's cars. Now let's put the 1990 Miata against, say, a 2022 Miata.
Keith Tanner said:Now let's put the 1990 Miata against, say, a 2022 Miata.
Funny you mention that. I drove a 1990 NA yesterday in the morning and a 2001 NB in the afternoon. There was a big difference in the cars with the NA feeling a bit rough and tumble and NB felt more grown up. Wanting a better daily driver experience, I bought the NB. Maybe it was the difference in miles, 100k on the NA and 49k on the NB, but I wanted the more refined car for this part of my life.
In reply to jimbob_racing :
They're not really much different under the skin. Mostly a stiffer structure on the NB and better bumpstops in stock form. The 2001 interior is made with thicker materials and more emphasis on soft touch, and the car is heavier due to the structural changes. But really, they're fundamentally the same car. You could unbolt the entire drivetrain/suspension rollerskate from the NB and bolt it up to the NA in a few hours with no drilling or welding other than maybe the radiator mounts.
An ND is a very different beast but with the same spirit.
Your 71 Spider with the tiny chrome bumpers and the headlight covers is really lovely, like a Ferrari Dino's little brother. I know you said you wanted to bring a 1966 MGB , but I wonder how the comments about looks between the MGB and the Alfa would have turned out if the chrome/rubber bumper tables were turned:
vs:
In reply to Keith Tanner :
And all of those refinements definitely made the difference.
My exwife would be shocked that I made a mature choice.
On a personal point of observation, something old compared to something new is not going to be as easy as it seams.
Working through the issues off getting a car back on the road starts the process. Then the inevitable "what if's" creep into the picture. More time and more money will not fix everything. The limitations of the original design and build of a car will come into focus.
My 1970 Datsun 1600 represents the end of the model run of a car conceived and designed in the late fifties and early sixties. The total run of these cars in all configurations was 40,000 units. If mine was a 2000 , a 2 liter, it would have a 5 speed but other than that it is the same car. With the same brakes....
Now the 1995 NA Miata is a car on stock springs with the 14" rims and tires that is red with a black convertible top but the comparison ends there. Conceived in the 80's from the starting point of taking on the first series Lotus Elan and fixing the "what if's", and succeeding is obvious. The production of these cars in the numbers delivered to willing customers is the result.
Staring with an over drive 5 speed, fuel injected motor, A/C and LSD, these are what all these early cars would have to have to start a comparison. Oh, and 4 wheel disk brakes...
I've owned and driven Datsun roadsters since 1971. My currrent car is perhaps the last 1970 2000 imported. I am the second owner since 1985. The 2000s not only had 5-speed transmissions but the U20 SOHC 4-cylinder engine produced between 135 and 150 hp depending on the carburetion with dealer-installed Solex/Mikunis being optional. I would disagree about parts availability, however. I have found most parts to still be available from several sources who specialize in these neat little cars. And lastly, they are finally appreciating on the classic sports car market and it's about time!
In reply to Flyman615 : Couldn't agree more. I've had 5 0r 6 roadsters (only one a 1600) and also a Miata. Loved to surprise the MG's and Triumphs with my "Is that an MG?' Datsun. Not even 'Vettes had 5-speeds.
Not even worth asking. Miata hands down no question. Done a thousand mile day in a Miata FL to SD with the top down all the way and the AC or heat as needed.
The MGB convertible is not a great place to be for long and seldom do you get the lumpy species to ride along for a second topless experience. Consider also that an MGB with the top up is a damp and or cold torture chamber.
In reply to Geno1 :
The Fiat 124 Spiders had a DOHC engine ,4wheel disc brakes, and a 5 speed transmission as early as 1969
Having had two TR 6's, a TR 4 IRS and a TR 3. I liked the 6's the best. I'm 6'3" and I fit quite well. We had a Mercedes dealer in Buffalo that also sold TR's but they sucked when it came to handling TR issues. I learned a lot about British sports cars as a result. I up-graded the ignition system to a Lucas breakerless type. Seemed that it almost always got to the point where I needed to keep a spare ignition system in the trunk along with a flashligh and the tools to change it out. Seems it always died in the middle of the night in the absolute middle of nowhere. I got quite good at it.
My ex-wife loved the last car, a red '74. She even flipped off a cop who beaped her at a red light. She was six months preganant so the cop didn't know what to do when he pulled her over. I had a navy blue '69 as well. Unfortunately as a I recall, the engines in the Triumphs all originated from a farm tractor so they weren't particularly high reving engines. I keep on longing to get one again but I also had a '63 XKE that was my first love. Bought it from a friend who's daddy was in the mob in WNY. Then I discovered Porsches... Oh damnation!
Does anyone make a rear disc brake set-up for TR 6's? Those rear drum brakes were a PITA!
Very interesting article.The Alfa and MGB fared better than I'd have expected. I would have liked to see the Datsun 2000 thrown in there, beause the version with the Solexs was a pretty formidable car and from a performance standpoint at least would have given any of these cars a run.
gaspyder said:In reply to Geno1 :
The Fiat 124 Spiders had a DOHC engine ,4wheel disc brakes, and a 5 speed transmission as early as 1969
With the exception of the 5 speed, so did m MGA - in 1958.
JakeMacZ said:Unfortunately as a I recall, the engines in the Triumphs all originated from a farm tractor so they weren't particularly high reving engines.
No - the 6 cylinder was no relation to tractors, and in fact neither was the wet liner 4 cylinder that started out in the Triumph Vanguard and was used in everything including boats up iuntil the TR6 came on the scene.
CM - I would add one more grading category to this assessment. To quote James May from a very early Top Gear episode: "bloke factor." While the TR6 will have it's doors sucked off by a modern Camry, and quite possibly both the Alfa Spider and the Miata in this group, the TR6 brings something else to the table that no other car in this group does - quite frankly, it's just beefy! And yes, I own one and I am naturally jaded. Does it handle great? Well, with lots of mods, somewhat. Is it fast? Well... fast-ish. What it is, is rugged, edgy, unrefined; something built by a bunch of old Brits drinking warm Guiness and chain smoking Chesterfields at 2AM. (And yes, I know, the body was a German design...). If there was ever a British sports car that seemed like it wore a perpetual 3-day growth on it's face, it's the TR6. Like James May said, "...it leaves the seat up." I guarantee you that it also sounds the best when first started. When non-car afficianados see it parked, many just think it's just another old convertibile, some think it's an MG. And then they hear it start and drive off. Woah. What's in that thing? 6 raw cylinders in a straight line! So, bloke factor? A+. And that is why I drive it. Now, where'd I leave my hair product...
wspohn said:JakeMacZ said:Unfortunately as a I recall, the engines in the Triumphs all originated from a farm tractor so they weren't particularly high reving engines.
No - the 6 cylinder was no relation to tractors, and in fact neither was the wet liner 4 cylinder that started out in the Triumph Vanguard and was used in everything including boats up iuntil the TR6 came on the scene.
Actually standard vanguard they didn't sell that car as a triumph. Standard was the parent company of triumph. My grandfather had one that he raced here in the late 50s and early 60s. It made 68 in the vanguard but they tuned to about 90hp in the tr.
Keith Tanner said:Not every old car is a classic :)
1990 Miata vs a bunch of 60's and 70's cars. Now let's put the 1990 Miata against, say, a 2022 Miata.
No comparison. Having driven 3 different NDs extensively in 2022, i'll take my '97 NA every single time.
gaspyder said:In reply to Geno1 :
The Fiat 124 Spiders had a DOHC engine ,4wheel disc brakes, and a 5 speed transmission as early as 1969
Actually, the 124 Sport debuted in 1966. Arrived in the USA for the 1968 model year with a 1438cc engine through 1970.
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