My experience was pretty close to sink or swim. Thankfully I had run HPDEs at the track already to learn the line and breaking points, and I had some karting experience so I was familiar with driving two and three wide into brake zones and through corners. If you haven't done any track driving or racing at all you will find yourself over your skiis.
It is really more up to the team's to decide if you have enough experience.
I would suggest going to a race and checking it all out and get to know a local team. Spend some time helping them prep the car and you will usually get a chance at some seat time.
I don't know how much lemons cost these days, but champcar is anywhere from 1k for 4 hours of seat time in a midpack car to 2k for that same 4 hours in a front runner.
You will need suit, helmet, Hans, gloves, shoes, coolshirt.
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
Thanks for the breakdown. The cost of PPE seems like the biggest obstacle if $$ really matters.
Pete
In reply to NOHOME :
i got a pretty cost-effective setup from a GRM advertiser (back in 2012, no magazine handy to see if they still advertise). if you're OK with separate long-johns vs a 3-layer suit, that knocks the price down a good bit. IIRC it was under $400 for long johns, suit, socks, shoes, gloves, and balaclava. add helmet ($300-ish IIRC, got a freebie from work because i was a vehicle test engineer at the time) and HANS (i borrowed one) and cool-suit and/or camelbak. but those are one-time costs. race more and they become cheaper per use. :-)
NOHOME said:In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
Thanks for the breakdown. The cost of PPE seems like the biggest obstacle if $$ really matters.
Pete
There are places that will rent you all the gear you need as well.
http://www.racesuitrental.com has been used by several people I know with good results/
Raceimage.com also has good quality used suits.
icaneat50eggs said:To me this is like saying, congrats , you've won a date with your favorite supermodel. However, your only going to get to second base.
Is it as much fun as you could possibly have? No
Does it beat the heck out of sitting around bored? Hell yes
Is it likely to leave you wanting the ENTIRE experience? Most definitely.
some teams just have more mechanics than drivers. Lots of people do it
Canoe with enough class to quote a good supermodel analogy
In reply to golfduke :
I agree with you, it feels like cheating. But it's commonly done.
I like short sessions where you can get some direct feedback as to how to improve. SCCA. does the best job of that in their drivers schools. However many if not most clubs have SCCA staff and tech guys helping.
The flaw with SCCA is they really only want newer cars. They want high dollar tube frame fiberglass bodies.
Vintage racing however tends to accept older cars. Old Mustangs Ford Falcons, MG's Triumph and others. Basically clean out the car straighten up the body, give it a decent paint job that looks OK from 10 yards away. Put on safety gear, rollbar/cage. Have fun.
There is one basic rule. No body contact.
Drive as fast as you can maintain control. If you have contact you are put on suspension for 13 months. If during that period you have another contact you are banned for 13 months.
We race, we race hard. But in control.
Vintage has drivers schools where experienced guys help you be better, faster, easier on your equipment.
SVRA which is the big national club has cars as new as 5 years old. But many are 30-40+ years old.
I bought a $500 Jaguar XJS and I could go vintage racing spending around $2000 if I do all the work myself. I'm going to spend a little more tovreplicate the. group 44 car. Typically people have $5000-$15000 in their car. Most are paycheck racers buying parts with whatever spare money left out of the paycheck. although I have raced with multi million dollar Ferrari's etc.
The nice thing about Vintage racing is the rules don't change. You don't have to spend a lot of money mid season to stay competitive. You'll meet nice people who are just trying to have fun. Few have offensive ego's or are jerks. Most will lend or even give you parts. Help you get back together and then race you. I seem to have a sore face after the races from all the smiling I do.
In reply to golfduke :
If you really want to race a Lemons car the only two ways are to build one or rent one.
Some people realize the renting option for the bargain it is, others want to go their own way.
The smart way is to buy a car with good miles left on it, build it to conform to the rules and get others to help build it and pay for it.
The choice of cars is up to you. I like cars that depreciate quickly and maybe are rough on the interior. Paint is less than perfect but have lots of speed and reliability.
Jaguar XJS is such a car. A few hundred dollars should buy you one but get the 6 cylinder not the V12. The 6 gets a strong 20-25 mpg so you won't be hurt on fuel mileage. It's nearly as fast as the V12 because it's lighter and the power is within 20 horsepower of the V12 ( 240 stone stock and easily increased by a cold air intake and delete all the mufflers). It's an all aluminum 4 valves per cylinder and is capable of hundreds of thousands of miles with high reliability.
If you like real power the six haas got a supercharged version that will rock your soxs. Plus I've seen over 700 horsepower in them drag racing in the 9's
There are sedans that use that engine and mechanicals. And they are even cheaper. Replacement engines cost $2-400 because they just don't break and there is no used market for them.
Later V8's had problems at first but you can still buy them cheap too
nderwater said:If you haven't done any track driving or racing at all you will find yourself over your skills.
What experience would you recommend before your first lemons race? I have done a bunch of autocross and rallycross and a few track days. I get on track rarely enough that I never get out of the point by groups. My wife is in a similar position except she doesn't have the track experience. In addition to a track day to get used to watching for flags and watching your mirrors, how do you get the skills to be comfortable in a w2w Lemons race? We want to try Lemons but don't see an education path that costs less than $10K per person to "do it right".
ojannen said:nderwater said:If you haven't done any track driving or racing at all you will find yourself over your skills.
What experience would you recommend before your first lemons race? I have done a bunch of autocross and rallycross and a few track days. I get on track rarely enough that I never get out of the point by groups. My wife is in a similar position except she doesn't have the track experience. In addition to a track day to get used to watching for flags and watching your mirrors, how do you get the skills to be comfortable in a w2w Lemons race? We want to try Lemons but don't see an education path that costs less than $10K per person to "do it right".
Just #sendit. Really. There is nothing that will prepare you for all of the traffic and inputs coming your way. I did roughly 2 track days before my first lemons race. My team had a total of about 5 track days total. We finished 5th overall out of 120 in that first race.
Now, we have about 40 trophies split between us in the last 10 years of racing.
Gotta start somewhere and that's what lemons is all about!
I'd probably do it.
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