And the P14 is scheduled for release being the 12Cs replacements(650s) replacement.
And the P14 is scheduled for release being the 12Cs replacements(650s) replacement.
I'm just curious if the 12Cs will drop much more. Weary mentioned seeing a few coupes 110k or under. If I could get a nice, no stories, blue coupe under 100 it would definitely make me consider moving a few of my other cars down the road.
So mclaren has the 570 depressing the 12c (Even though it is not a direct competitor, as the 570 is one level below the 12 C ), but the 650 and 675 are the replacements for the 12 C. With those cars being replaced that would mean the 12 C is two models out. The law of usedcars says that the 12 C has to reducing price more. And the benefit for me because all of them come as a spider forum the 12 C spider will reduce more as well.
It may be possible for some 20,000 mile versions of the 12C spider to be had at or below the $100k in a year when the new P 14 spider is released
A legitimate supercar available with less than 6 years old for under hundred grand is insane
Interesting about the P 14 is the styling looks somewhere between P1 and the 12 C . Almost like the 650/670 went to far to the obnoxious and they are bringing it back a little
I wasn't a huge fan of the 12C's styling. Each new model has looked just a tiny bit better. I think the P14 looks awesome. The front really reminds me of an F1.
I agree that with each new model intro, the 12C will continue to depreciate.
The 12c reminds me of the last of the previous NSX
Devilsolsi wrote: I wasn't a huge fan of the 12C's styling. Each new model has looked just a tiny bit better. I think the P14 looks awesome. The front really reminds me of an F1. I agree that with each new model intro, the 12C will continue to depreciate.
They'll stop at some point, but predicting that is the difficult part.
The waiting is hard. Especially when the cars had such a wide range in price originally with the $$$ options. Cars that are $15k apart in price can both be good deals.
The options and how they are viewed are weird. In typical "what I bought is worth more than what you did because I say so" fashion some owners seem to be putting high value on trim options, which really hold no value in relation to the value other than increasing the price if it gives a very nice finished look.
On the 12c even the CCB are something of an enigma. As the iron rotors are known to be more serviceable and have more pad options. The CCB rotors have been found to be the same as the Vette with new hats, so that as pushed their value up a bit. From researching the mclaren boards the big things are like owning a p car. Well documented maintenance, low number of owners and reasonable but not obnoxiously low miles with all service campaigns and updates done, (for those that don't know, Mclaren has given free updates to the engine, transmission, aero and suspension programming and replaced the infotainment system.)
As far as a functional difference in the 650 and the 12c seems to be minor(body withstanding). Revised actuator mounts (not really shocks are they?) New pistons and exhaust. A different steering rack and Akebono instead of Brembo brake calipers.
How much is that worth to you?
Now realize there are tuners getting 700+ bhp from these cars and putting them with in 0.4 seconds of the AWD P1 in the quarter and you have a bargain.
All that for less money than a new Nissan GTR at less weight than a WRX with F1 outlawed brakes, aero and suspension.
Flight Service wrote: As far as a functional difference in the 650 and the 12c seems to be minor(body withstanding). Revised actuator mounts (not really shocks are they?) New pistons and exhaust. A different steering rack and Akebono instead of Brembo brake calipers.
There are some pretty substantial tuning and calibration differences between the two but it kind of comes down to which one you think looks better IMO. The 650s is the one for me. When someone starts offering the ability to repair the transmission for the leaks without doing a complete 30K$ transmission swap I think I will make the jump. I really was hoping that the 675LT would become the new 650S and that would drive down the pricing a bit more to my liking.
MIn reply to wearymicrobe:
Apparently the last 650s tune and the 12c updates are supposed to be the same. According to the internets.
The optional sport exhaust now being standard is the other power increase.
I think waiting a year would be prudent, just because the P14 will carry the new chassis it should push the 650s down and the 12c way down.
IMHO at this level of car, 99% of the time and drivers will never be able to tell/use/skilled to see a nickles worth of difference in lap time.
So you are absolutely right it comes down to styling.
As far as the leaky transmisson, it is a leak. Seal the leak and be done with it.
This is GRM supercar or not we don't need no stinking service dept.
Flight Service wrote: The options and how they are viewed are weird. In typical "what I bought is worth more than what you did because I say so" fashion some owners seem to be putting high value on trim options, which really hold no value in relation to the value other than increasing the price if it gives a very nice finished look. On the 12c even the CCB are something of an enigma. As the iron rotors are known to be more serviceable and have more pad options. The CCB rotors have been found to be the same as the Vette with new hats, so that as pushed their value up a bit. From researching the mclaren boards the big things are like owning a p car. Well documented maintenance, low number of owners and reasonable but not obnoxiously low miles with all service campaigns and updates done, (for those that don't know, Mclaren has given free updates to the engine, transmission, aero and suspension programming and replaced the infotainment system.) As far as a functional difference in the 650 and the 12c seems to be minor(body withstanding). Revised actuator mounts (not really shocks are they?) New pistons and exhaust. A different steering rack and Akebono instead of Brembo brake calipers. How much is that worth to you? Now realize there are tuners getting 700+ bhp from these cars and putting them with in 0.4 seconds of the AWD P1 in the quarter and you have a bargain. All that for less money than a new Nissan GTR at less weight than a WRX with F1 outlawed brakes, aero and suspension.
P1 ain't awd.
That is all.
sesto elemento wrote:Flight Service wrote: Now realize there are tuners getting 700+ bhp from these cars and putting them with in 0.4 seconds of the AWD P1 in the quarter and you have a bargain.P1 ain't awd. That is all.
Flight Service wrote: As far as the leaky transmisson, it is a leak. Seal the leak and be done with it. This is GRM supercar or not we don't need no stinking service dept.
It's even worse then that its a O-Ring failure but the box is a "sealed" unit so no repairs outside the factory that I have seen yet.
Calibration is definitely different. Specifically on the throttle mapping and the suspension setup between the 650s and the MP4, I think they changed the exhaust over s well or everyone figured it out and they order the sports exhaust as standard on the 650S.
If the 570s fall to say 120K and the 650S falls to say 150K I would have a hard time getting the 650S.
In reply to wearymicrobe:
Yeah, o-ring failure. Yeah we fixin that.
So 80 bhp and the hydraulic suspension isn't enough for you to drop an extra $30k?
So what is insurance cost on a car like this? Can you get collectible insurance like Hagerty? I always figured it would be like hundreds a month but then maybe the risk profile is so different that it's less than I expect.
dculberson wrote: So what is insurance cost on a car like this? Can you get collectible insurance like Hagerty? I always figured it would be like hundreds a month but then maybe the risk profile is so different that it's less than I expect.
Without calling my agent, people with State Farm on the boards are reporting $1800 a year (Married, 48, clean DR) to $3700 (Single 35, license never suspended)
dculberson wrote: So what is insurance cost on a car like this? Can you get collectible insurance like Hagerty? I always figured it would be like hundreds a month but then maybe the risk profile is so different that it's less than I expect.
On both my Modena and my 930 I have agreed upon value policies that don't cost me 1k per year combined. Now I have a bunch of cars insured, so that probably helps, but I would expect a Mac with an agreed upon value of over 100k to be less that 1k per year for me.
Flight Service wrote: In reply to wearymicrobe: Yeah, o-ring failure. Yeah we fixin that. So 80 bhp and the hydraulic suspension isn't enough for you to drop an extra $30k?
Not for someone of my height and weight. I have a hard time getting over the tub in the Mp4/650S and well I would use it every day. Plus the Mp4 vs the 570s in looks, the 570s is a much better looking car to me.
FYI insurance for occasional use is dirt cheap, I ma paying ~900$ now a year for 3500 miles on the viper with a agreed upon value of around 120K.
That's pretty good. It's hard to believe insuring something like this could be that reasonable of a price.
What would it be for reasonable mileage..say 10k a year.
Flight Service wrote: What would it be for reasonable mileage..say 10k a year.
Just check with the major players because there are many factors based on you, your location, history, etc. Also call your current provider because some of them offer limited use, but just aren't well known for it. Also, personally I think 10k is a lot, so you might want to start at 5k or so and add if needed. The attention alone some of these cars generate can pretty annoying at times imo.
In reply to Cotton:
You are right. I don't drive our current car 10k a year anymore.
5k is probably a better estimate, but both of these sentences are sad.
dculberson wrote: That's pretty good. It's hard to believe insuring something like this could be that reasonable of a price.
It's the limited miles and limits usage as written in the contract. For instance is 2200 a year to DD the Viper plus another 400$ for the modifications to be covered as well.
Porsche because it's a 4 season car.
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