2016 SCCA CAM rules

2016 CAM rules in downloadable form

https://www.facebook.com/download/1498575863804447/2016%20CAM%20handout%20-%20Rules%20Final.pdf

Interesting, min weight for CAM C is now up to 3200. Should be no problem getting the Camaro down to that this winter

the only thing i don't really care for is inclusion of the new vehicles. the classic part of CAM gets lost there. i know it's introduced a whole new group of people, but that always confused me. either way, i will probably run something in it next year. maybe tow the Z with the 454SS clone pickup and run both

patgizz wrote: the only thing i don't really care for is inclusion of the new vehicles. the classic part of CAM gets lost there. i know it's introduced a whole new group of people, but that always confused me. either way, i will probably run something in it next year. maybe tow the Z with the 454SS clone pickup and run both

Agreed, especially considering how structurally similar the 3rd gen f body and fox body Mustang are to the subsequent generations. Just seems like they fit much better in contemporary.

I don't get the class name either. It's either a classic or it's not. Don't get me wrong, love to see the new, big cars out there but just think the name is misleading. Maybe a class name for the new American Muscle to be closer to what it really is. Can't think of a good name though. HAM - Heavy American Muscle? Nah. Ideas?

The reason they are included is because they are included in the optima/goodguys stuff which started this whole CAM thing on the SCCA side anyway right?

I don't know if I can take on a fox Mustang or 3rd Gen F-body in the Javelin, but I think I ought to give it a go. Unlimited engine mods and tire sizes?

Javelin wrote: I don't know if I can take on a fox Mustang or 3rd Gen F-body in the Javelin, but I think I ought to give it a go. Unlimited engine mods and tire sizes?

Hell yea you should give it a go. Suspension is pretty much unlimited as well. Didn't Donohue/Penski win the Trans AM in a Javelin?

In reply to Jaynen:

I believe that's the deal. For the guys with classic mustangs and camaros that have engine swaps and suspension upgrades, but are still street cars and didn't really fit in prepared or modified. At the Kentucky region it's a very popular class, but only one car is as actual classic, and it's a factory five roadster kit car. The rest are late model pony cars, and maybe a corvette or two.

The problem is, there is only one "bolt on" suspension for the Javelin, and it's $$$$. I'd have to homebrew something. Honestly, I'm not too worried about the front end, there's so much weight there all I need a block in place of the spring and it will stick fine. What I need is a quick-ratio steering box, and to do something about the buggy suspension rear end. I can't really 4-link the car, but I could fabricate a panhard rod and some slide-a-links. The biggy is tires, I could go 275 F and 315 R on the stock fenders with the wheels I already have...

The changes for 2016 should be good ones. Before you had people showing up with 400+hp Coyote Mustangs with 315 section tires against cars 20-30 years older with less rubber in the class. That has been fixed. The 60s,70s and 80 cars still have to go head to head but that seems like a fairer fight than 80s vs 2010+. I'm looking forward to 2016!

Also notice that they made the C4, C5, C6, and Gen I and II Viper to CAM-S in an effort to save it. Car counts in CAM-S have been very poor. A friend of mine won the Indiana CAM Challenge in CAMS with a BS-legal Solstice ZOK. The addition of the modern Corvettes will probably attract a lot of SSP and SSM Corvettes to the class for national events.

drdisque wrote: Also notice that they made the C4, C5, C6, and Gen I and II Viper to CAM-S in an effort to save it. Car counts in CAM-S have been very poor. A friend of mine won the Indiana CAM Challenge in CAMS with a BS-legal Solstice ZOK. The addition of the modern Corvettes will probably attract a lot of SSP and SSM Corvettes to the class for national events.

Solstice + power for CAM-S was the first thing that came to mind when I saw the new rules. Might be tricky to get down to min weight, but considering they start in the low 2600lb range for the N/A ZOk you'd still be at a considerable advantage over the vettes and vipers at 3k. Seems like an oversight. Probably would have been better to penalize all '84 and newer vehicles to ensure capture of all modern ABS equipped 2-seaters.

I view modern cars in CAM-C and CAM-S sorta like ESPN does really good games: "Instant Classics"

I like it because it gives the Vettes/Vipers a place to play on street tires. With the 2015 rules it was A-street or stright to SSP/SSM/ASP if you had any mods (minus the standard C5 that can play in STU). There are 4 C5Z cars in my region alone that are loving this new classing for next year.

having run a couple Optima events in the past I'm pretty excited to give CAM S a whirl in my c5z next year.

I've been trying to figure out though, will this be considered a "real" class for nationals? I haven't gone to Lincoln in a few years and would love to change that this year but even though I won't have a snowballs chance of winning one of those fancy jackets I'd kinda like to know I'm at least competing in a class that has the potential for winning one.

klodkrawler05 wrote: having run a couple Optima events in the past I'm pretty excited to give CAM S a whirl in my c5z next year. I've been trying to figure out though, will this be considered a "real" class for nationals? I haven't gone to Lincoln in a few years and would love to change that this year but even though I won't have a snowballs chance of winning one of those fancy jackets I'd kinda like to know I'm at least competing in a class that has the potential for winning one.

CAM is not a National Championship recognized category. CAM has it's own "Championship" in the form of the CAM Invitational held the weekend of the Pro Solo Finale on the opening weekend of the Solo Nationals week. To be invited you must win or place at one of the 3 CAM Challenges or be recognized as a "competitor of note" within CAM or the Pro-Touring community. CAM is offered at the Solo Nationals as a supplemental category.

Furious_E wrote:

patgizz wrote: the only thing i don't really care for is inclusion of the new vehicles. the classic part of CAM gets lost there. i know it's introduced a whole new group of people, but that always confused me. either way, i will probably run something in it next year. maybe tow the Z with the 454SS clone pickup and run both

Agreed, especially considering how structurally similar the 3rd gen f body and fox body Mustang are to the subsequent generations. Just seems like they fit much better in contemporary.

As an example, to me it means that I have no chance of running with an 80's Mustang or Camaro without putting a ton of money into my '65 Mustang. Seems that will exclude a lot of people with classic vehicles because they can't be competitive.

Furious_E wrote:

Javelin wrote: I don't know if I can take on a fox Mustang or 3rd Gen F-body in the Javelin, but I think I ought to give it a go. Unlimited engine mods and tire sizes?

Hell yea you should give it a go. Suspension is pretty much unlimited as well. Didn't Donohue/Penski win the Trans AM in a Javelin?

All the other factory backed competition had backed out in 1971, so when AMC won their championships, they were pretty much the only show in town. I like AMCs quite a bit, but it's worth noting that their major wins came after everyone else stepped away.

NickD wrote:

Furious_E wrote:

Javelin wrote: I don't know if I can take on a fox Mustang or 3rd Gen F-body in the Javelin, but I think I ought to give it a go. Unlimited engine mods and tire sizes?

Hell yea you should give it a go. Suspension is pretty much unlimited as well. Didn't Donohue/Penski win the Trans AM in a Javelin?

All the other factory backed competition had backed out in 1971, so when AMC won their championships, they were pretty much the only show in town. I like AMCs quite a bit, but it's worth noting that their major wins came after everyone else stepped away.

Not even close to being true.

Javelin wrote:

NickD wrote:

Furious_E wrote:

Javelin wrote: I don't know if I can take on a fox Mustang or 3rd Gen F-body in the Javelin, but I think I ought to give it a go. Unlimited engine mods and tire sizes?

Hell yea you should give it a go. Suspension is pretty much unlimited as well. Didn't Donohue/Penski win the Trans AM in a Javelin?

All the other factory backed competition had backed out in 1971, so when AMC won their championships, they were pretty much the only show in town. I like AMCs quite a bit, but it's worth noting that their major wins came after everyone else stepped away.

Not even close to being true.

Yes, the Javelin won the SCCA championship in '71 (although it was a reskinned '70), '72 and '76. They had reasonable success, especially considering their underdog status, in the earlier seasons but 1966 and 1967 was won by Ford, 1968 and 1969 was won by Chevrolet and 1970 was won by Ford. After the 1970 season, all other OEM pulled their sponsorships for the series (GM and Ford saw the writing on the wall, Mercury had been forced to discontinue after '67 by FoMoCo execs who felt the Cougar was a little too competitive and on the verge of beating the Mustang, Pontiac never really fielded a car due to them abandoning the 303 Ram Air V development, and Chrysler never had the success they hoped for even with Sam Posey and Dan Gurney driving for them). AMC was the lone OEM to continue backing SCCA Trans Am. T

In reply to NickD:

AMC didn't compete in 67, came in 3rd in their first season in 68 with two cars total (only the top 2 of every make got points, so if 1st-5th were all Camaros, only 1st and 2nd counted), and nearly won the whole thing in 70 with Donohue missing a number of races (leaving one car to score). In 71 Bud Moore still had the full stretch of Ford's funding, including Parnelli Jones and George Follmer. They successfully lobbied the SCCA in order to run the 70 bodies again because there was no Boss 302 in 71. GM never overtly sponsored any team, Shelby forced Mercury out back in 68, and Mopar's program was 1-year/1-shot deal to promote the new 70 E-Body. People can't help but admit that AMC ever did anything, so it's always revisionist history with "everybody pulled out and gave it to you".

Try reading "Trans-AM: The Pony Car Wars".

Javelin wrote: In reply to NickD: In 71 Bud Moore still had the full stretch of Ford's funding, including Parnelli Jones and George Follmer. They successfully lobbied the SCCA in order to run the 70 bodies again because there was no Boss 302 in 71. GM *never* overtly sponsored any team, Shelby forced Mercury out back in 68.

Bud Moore himself said in an interview that in 1971 they were an independent team. Sure, GM never openly sponsored any teams but it's common knowledge that they were feeding all their teams parts out the back door (After all the all-aluminum ZL-1 427 was designed explicitly for Can Am use and if GM had no interest in racing then they wouldn't have built the Z/28 with it's series-spec 302 to homologate it for SCCA use). And Shelby wasn't involved with Mercury's exile, it was Ford executives, who didn't want their cash cow (or horse) being unseated by it's upstart cousin.

Like I said earlier, it is impressive what AMC did manage considering their limited budget in all of their motorsports ventures (SCCA, NHRA, land-speed and NASCAR).

As an example, to me it means that I have no chance of running with an 80's Mustang or Camaro without putting a ton of money into my '65 Mustang. Seems that will exclude a lot of people with classic vehicles because they can't be competitive.

I wouldn't count your '65 out. you get a huge weight break over the newer cars and Robert Lewis has proven that the '65 is practically the car to have in CP. I don't see why you couldn't copy his build but on street tires and with an interior and have an awesome CAMT car.

In reply to drdisque:

And it would take a ton of money. Most competitive pro touring style first gen mustangs have $10-20K suspensions in them. I don't have that much in my entire car.

We should build a CAM car.