305 performance?

looking at buying 1980 chevorlet malibu coupe, very clean car for decent price, have concerns with the 305 performance. i am not looking to race just want a nice looking , mean sounding, street car. any advice would be greatly appreciated

The cheapest modification you can do to a 305 to make power is replace it with a 350. The 305 has tiny bores which limit breathing. The 305 is about 87% of the size of a 350, but it doesn't have 87% of the potential. You can spend thousands getting a 305 to perform, but you don't have an engine that is worth anything on ebay.

The 305/350 debate is ancient. But, if you want to make 300 hp, you'll usually save yourself money buy using a 350... even including the cost of purchasing a 350, and you'll have much more streetable torque with the extra cubes.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/305-v8-performance/15039/page1/

Here ya go

i would def end up dropping in a crate motor in due time, until then would cams, headers, and a new intake make it atleast sound decent.

snoopycooter wrote: i would def end up dropping in a crate motor in due time, until then would cams, headers, and a new intake make it atleast sound decent.

How many cams do you think a 305 has?

curtis73 wrote: The cheapest modification you can do to a 305 to make power is replace it with a 350.

Yup. You could bolt on better heads, intake manifold, and the like, but you'd still be 45 cubes or so shy of a 350. 305s are also known for detonation.

snoopycooter wrote: i would def end up dropping in a crate motor in due time, until then would cams, headers, and a new intake make it atleast sound decent.

Get an exhaust system that can live with a bigger engine later on. Something like this; http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PYE-SGG10S/

Note that I've never heard this thing and it still won't be amazing to listen to with a wheezy 305 in front of it but it'll be more interesting and will allow you to keep it after doing other real work, like offing the 305 (or putting a ton of work into it, your call).

If you could find one, a lower mileage 5.7 Vortec truck / van motor would be a great swap for that 305 and you're bolt-ons away from getting it to fit (at least in theory).

I looked very hard into getting a 3rd gen Camaro and gave the 305 some very serious consideration (as as manual was a requirement and I wasn't going to turn up any 350/T5 combos). There are guys that have done it. Look at the f-body forums. But the 350 is so cheap and easy to swap in.

Will wrote:

snoopycooter wrote: i would def end up dropping in a crate motor in due time, until then would cams, headers, and a new intake make it atleast sound decent.

How many cams do you think a 305 has?

LOL! Quoteworthy.

snoopycooter wrote: i would def end up dropping in a crate motor in due time, until then would cams, headers, and a new intake make it atleast sound decent.

you can buy stuff that would swap over to your 350 later, like exhaust, maybe a good carb. but frankly, anything even close to the amount of work it takes to install a cam is a huge waste of time/money.

excuse me will, cam. if i buy the basic engine assembley will the other parts from the 305 transfer to the 350 , intake man, carb, water pump, etc...

In general yes, althogh there are some variations. Honestly though, if you think you could do the wiring to get it working, an LQ9 ( I think thats what they are called, the H2 engine) with just a cam would make alot more power for what it would cost than a 350 would.

I don't know anything about those engines myself, but those Malibus are cool looking. Its really a very clean, neatly pressed design when all the trim is taken off.

its a very clean car, all the trim is already off, clean white paint, looks garage kept. going to test drive today and run it to my neighbors shop to get it on the lift and look it over well. anyone have opinions on what a fair price for it is, i was thinking 2500 to 3000

If you are just going for a street driven car, I would agree with the other people who said intake manifold, cam and headers. I would throw in some noisy cam gears just for kicks. If you want something really mean on the street, do the 350 swap.

96DXCivic wrote: If you are just going for a street driven car, I would agree with the other people who said intake manifold, cam and headers. I would throw in some noisy cam gears just for kicks. If you want something really mean on the street, do the 350 swap.

Noisy cam gears? Ick dude! Do you have a giant fart can muffler too?

What's with this thread and the sarcasm? I think some of us need to lighten up.

A clean malibu is a car that I'd (as in me, personally) buy based on the condition of the body. If it's clean, it's worth having no matter what (or if) engine is in it.

As for value of a 305...If you let someone hear the engine run before YOU pulled it out...you MIGHT get someone to give you $100 for it.

If you need transportation, it doesn't matter what engine is in it if it's running fine now. Build a 350 on a stand and just have it ready. Or...as said before, you could do some upgrades to the engine that will work will with your longterm goal.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about a cam swap in a 305. If you want a cam, buy one for the 350 you're planning to build.

Exhaust stuff, though...that could be done on the 305 and be ready to go (one less thing) when you're ready to drop a nicer engine in there.

Clem

Hey now Clem, this thread is okay. It doesn't hurt that there was another, near identical thread that somebody linked to. I think the basic gist is (at least my opinions), if you're building for under 250-300 hp, go ahead and cam/intake/headers/carb/HEI whatever, and if you want anything else out of it, build a 350 on the stand and swap everything in one day.

They're right though, man, swapping a cam or intake or headers in the car is a pain, and it's a lot of work to get 250-300 hp.

In reply to tuna55 & swap issues in-car:

This is why I suggested a set of pipes. After that just a basic tune-up and leave the 305 alone. There are cheap used motor/trans combos from trucks that would make this thing move quite well, 5.3 swap bits are probably available from the aftermarket.

I wonder, and this is written in as friendly of manner as possible, if the OP is really ready to do a lot of crazy stuff with the car. Teething on projects like throwing an updated ignition, or an intake & carb swap, might be a good start.

my best bet, add the 5.7 V8 from a tundra, and then supercharge it. up the handling by adding new shocks, a strut tower bar, and a rear sway bar off a camaro Z28. paint it gray, and leave half the side trim missing, and add mismatched hubcaps, for the ultimate sleeper.

come to find out the car already has edelbrock intake manifold and carb, didn catch the size. so i wouldn be putting any more money into the 305, but if i order the basic engine assembly 350 will the rest of the parts from the 305 be compatible, intake, water pump, etc

If it's the original 305 (probably...see precedent set in the case of "Replacing a 305 vs. Waste of Time") and you want to be able to use that intake manifold...you'll want to stick with an early (pre center bolt valve cover) small block. I think there was an overlap of one year between center bolt valve covers and the new intake manifold bolt angles somewhere. 85 or earlier is a safe bet for heads that the intake will bolt to.

I did 305->350 in my '83 Z28. I reused the water pump, alternator, and steering pump brackets with no problem on an older, 2 piece rear main seal 350. The problem you might run into (if keeping intake manifolds) could be the dipstick. I had to run headers on mine to have a functional dipstic (the factory camaro manifolds wouldn't allow for the use of a dipstick on the driver side). Malibu manifolds might not be a problem (and I get the feeling you're more interested in running headers anyway).

Even your distrubutor should swap over with no issues.

Clem

tuna55 wrote: Hey now Clem, this thread is okay. It doesn't hurt that there was another, near identical thread that somebody linked to. I think the basic gist is (at least my opinions), if you're building for under 250-300 hp, go ahead and cam/intake/headers/carb/HEI whatever, and if you want anything else out of it, build a 350 on the stand and swap everything in one day. They're right though, man, swapping a cam or intake or headers in the car is a pain, and it's a lot of work to get 250-300 hp.

I guess I was just jumpy about two posts..."how many cams do you think..." and your muffler remark.

I like the civility here and don't want to see it become more like some of the other forums. And yeah...I originally thought this was the other 305 post...

Clem

stoptheeconobox wrote: my best bet, add the 5.7 V8 from a tundra, and then supercharge it. up the handling by adding new shocks, a strut tower bar, and a rear sway bar off a camaro Z28. paint it gray, and leave half the side trim missing, and add mismatched hubcaps, for the ultimate sleeper.

This is an interesting set of ideas...

tuna55 wrote:

96DXCivic wrote: If you are just going for a street driven car, I would agree with the other people who said intake manifold, cam and headers. I would throw in some noisy cam gears just for kicks. If you want something really mean on the street, do the 350 swap.

Noisy cam gears? Ick dude! Do you have a giant fart can muffler too?

it seems to me that putting noisy cam gears on a v8 in a classic car, and some kid putting a fifty dollar mufler, and some spinner hubcaps on his moms geo metro and are about as different as night and day.