Adrian's epic 'What car thread' in only 6,000 words

Adrian’s epic what car decision!

OK, this is going to be long. I’m not necessarily looking for advice, although I’ll read all comments with interest. This is as much as anything a way to order my own thoughts and try and lay things out for SWMBO to help gain spousal acceptance if not unrestrained approval of whatever I end up deciding is the best course of action. Also, let’s face it, we all love spending other people’s money vicariously through a good what car thread.

So, a what car thread?

I bought my beloved C30 new in 2008 and always intended to keep it eight years before replacing it. TBH I thought that may be a tall order as, while not as bad as many of you guys, I do tend to want a change periodically. But honestly, this is the single best car I’ve ever owned. Reliable as gravity, quick(ish) but by no means fast, the best interior ever put in a vehicle and still probably the best looking vehicle sold in the last 20 years for under $40K. I have honestly loved every one of the 105K miles so far. But, It is getting time for something new-newish-newer-or even different. I am doing maintenance on it, but there are other vehicles I want and love. The problem is there are so many over so many price points that I’m in a quandary, the Pokémon strategy of getting them all isn’t an option unless I beat the lotto odds.
So there are four general scenarios playing out here. I’ll outline each one in brief then look at the different options within each scenario in detail.

First the ground rules and requirements.

First, as most people know, I work for Ford and this does have bearing on my decision making. I am not going to be buying anything new, or nearly new that Ford has a realistic competitor for. So, no Golf R or STi when the Focus RS exists. No recent or new Corvette when the Shelby Mustang exists. You will see the ND Miata and Fiat Spider Abarth on the list as really Ford has nothing in that category as considered by most people, but as we know GRM peeps cross shop a far wider band than most people.

Second I get a company car once a year. For a while we were getting Mustang convertibles, but now with a grandchild and a pop up camper we’re getting SUV’s. The loss of the Mustangs does play into the desire for and the type of cars being considered. The huge advantage of the company car is that we do a lot of miles; my wife does more than me so she DD’s the company car. We put 30-40K a year on that car and I do about 15K a year in the other car. Due to mileage while fuel econ isn’t a primary consideration as gas always has been and always will be stupidly cheap here, yes, I do mean when it was $4+ a gal, still stupidly cheap. But having said that something like an RX8 is off the list. The relatively modest performance for such stupidly low fuel mileage just doesn’t compute. I would have bought a new RX8 10 years ago (Ford still owned Mazda then) if it had either real performance or a real engine, and this from a past rotary engine owner (86 GTU when the GTU was basically a NA Turbo chassis).

Third, super hard core is out. I loved the idea of the Elise right up until I actually drive one. Great car for a third car toy, but useless as a DD for a 47 year old on Michigan roads (google them if you don’t live here, I’ve seen smother stages in the Safari rally than my daily commute) Also please note I’ll still be at least sunny day DDing this car, whatever it is, when I’m 55. Next, I like convertibles. If top down in as option then there’s no point in considering the closed version. Yes the Cayman is dynamically better than the Boxster and looks better to boot, but it may as well not exist for the purposes of this conversation. The Scoobie BRZ might be a great car, but Miata’s exist so it doesn’t for me.

Forth, general performance and looks. It’s got to be fun to drive both in the corners and in a straight line, quick enough not to fall asleep waiting to get up to speed. Not as hard as it used to be as even econo boxes are quick enough these days, but it does give me pause with some cars on this list.

Fifth, right now I also have the SAAB 900 Turbo project car; this can stay or go depending on which scenario, car, costs etc. It would score highly on the spousal unit approval scale if the final plan involved one less Saab in the family!
One more thing before I outline the scenarios. If we existed in a world were oil cooled 911’s were still priced at pre 2011ish levals this would be a no brainer. I’d be buying a mint 87-89 G50 Carrera with 964 cams, duel plug heads, updated A/C, some very mild suspension tuning and an LSD. Preferably in dark metallic blue/grey with cream leather interior and yes, sacraligious a sun roof. That used to be a $25K car, now it’s north of $40K, more like $45 and up. For that much money I’d be driving an Aston Martin, they have appreciated beyond their value to me.

Miata RF. Final answer. See what I did there?

I'll show myself out...

Now the four basic scenarios

Scenario 1 ($35-45K)

Pass Volvo to eldest daughter (not yet interested in driving, but probably will be in a year or so). Keep Saab, buy new or nearly new car as my 12 month daily driver do it all car. This is going to limit the field dramatically and is obviously the most costly option. Candidates include:

New S550 Mustang GT Convertible, fully loaded, possibly even an auto. Even with employee A plan pricing this is a $40K + undertaking.
New 2017 Focus RS. I’ve talked to my local dealer, yes the 16’s are all gone at a premium, but they are taking $1,000 deposits on 17’s at MSRP although they are not offering A plan.
2011 up Shelby GT500 (alloy block)
Fiat Spider Abarth. As soon as the Abarth was announced I was smitten, I don’t know what the price or delivery is, but my spidy senses are guessing $35K.
Mazda Miata ND, the new hard top coupe one. Wow it looks awesome, possibly better looking than the Abarth, but not as special. Spousal until approves.
981 Boxster/S Nuff said.

Scenario 2 ($20-30K)

Keep the Volvo, sell the Saab, buy a used sports car for summer DD and fun.
987 Boxster S
Mint late 986 Boxster S
Get lucky and snag an 06+ Jag XKR X150
GT500 Shelby Convertible
The best 02+ X100 XKR out there
2011-12 S197 Coyote 5.0 Mustang GT, fully loaded convertible
Nice C6 Corvette, let’s face it these are up to 12 years old now
Cheap spec ND Miata
Nice PRHT NC Miata with full Flying Miata Targa package

Scenario 3 ($15-25K)

Keep Volvo, Keep Saab, but cheap sports car. Note, this is least likely from a spousal unit approval point, but a consideration none the less.

986 Boxster S
Nice NC Miata
Cheap NC Miata with FM supercharger

Scenario 4 ($15-25K but very different from above)

Sell the Saab, get a cheap sports car, keep the Volvo but upgrade it with a reflash, down pipe, LSD, light flywheel, wheels, tires, Rear sway bar and possibly Focus ST Recaro seats. Think performance midway between a new Focus ST and RS

I’ve been absolutely convinced that each of these is the perfect only way to go and nothing else should be considered at least a dozen times. Right now I think Scenario 4 is it, last week I was convinced a brand new Focus RS was the only thing worth even thinking about. This is my issue, you guys change your mind so change your car, I make up my mind and live the outcome for 5-10 years.

Scenario 5 ($5-50K Think so far beyond the box we’ll call the box a pipe)
Sell the Saab, keep the Volvo and get something really fun. Options include:

Early 2000’s Maserati Coupe with three pedals. I know of a nice one for $20K. Divorce potential high on repairs.
Import a Capri 2.8Injection from Europe
Import a Mk II Fiesta XR2 from Europe and build a hot 2.0L CVH engine for it
Build a Westfield 7 with Miata running gear and a 2.0L Duratec engine
X50 spec 996 TT
Aston Vantage V8 with three pedals.
Yeah, this lot aint really happening is it? It’s more to show what other crap my brain thinks of.

Here are some that people may ask about but are off the list. Why? Because I don’t like or want them.

Fiesta or Focus ST. Both awesome cars and great smiles per mile, but not enough different and not as good looking as the C30 to make it worth it.

S2000. They just leave me cold and I don’t want to rev that much for the daily commute. Plus they are old and overpriced.

Frisbee twins. Top doesn’t drop and that word ‘Toy-Oh-Duh’ not happening.

EVO/STi/R32/Golf R. The RS is better in every way plus FORD. Also the NVH and especially the ride is a berkeleying joke on the EVO and STi.

Camaro. I don’t do dead hookers, plus FORD.

996 series Porsche 911. Nearly made it on the list, but at the end of the day Boxster/Cayman for the same money are just infinitely better propositions.

E46/E90 M3. Thought about it, but a) I want a sports car and b)If I’m going to have a Euro car with the maintenance it entails it’s gonna say Porsche, Jag or Aston on the hood. Nissan 350/370Z. Very capable cars, I love V6’s, but come on, give me a Ford employee a single reason to consider one over a Mustang. They just don’t compute.

Hyundai Genesis. Seriously, you have seen it?

Charger/Challenger. Nope, too big and Mustang.

Taurus SHO or new Fusion ST. Too big, I want a sports car. The only 4 door in consideration is the RS and that’s only because it’s not a three door.

More in a min

Ecoboost mustang. Then dress it up to your specs.

No real reason it is just what came to mind after reading your post.

Scenario 1 ($35-45K) in more detail.
So this one is the most expensive and would effectively be my only car. This means it would be a 365 day a year DD and put on up to 15K miles a year. It’s needs to be rock solid reliable either with or without a warranty. While this has a lot of upsides and is affordable. I don’t know if I want to afford this much money. I keep vacillating. To recap it involved passing the Volvo to my eldest daughter. She’s not yet interested in driving and I won’t force her to be, but probably will be in a year or so. I’d plan on Keeping the Saab to tinker with but I’d be buying a new or nearly new car.

Let’s look at the field as I listed them.

New S550 Mustang GT Convertible. The way I’d spec it is:
GT Convertible Premium.
Guard Green
Saddle leather interior (I want the porno red premium, but you can’t get it with the Guard green)
GT Performance package
Reverse sensing
Spoiler delete
So with A plan we’re talking around $41K.
Yes that’s spitting distance to a GT350 so why not that. Two reasons. 1. No Convertible. 2. No sign of ‘Market adjustment’ AKA I berkeleying hate closed shop dealer agreements meaning that they will still be $5-10K over sticker.

Next up New 2017 Focus RS. As I said, my local dealer is accepting $1,000 deposits for 2017’s at MSRP. For me that would be just over $41K for: Nitros blue
RS2 package (heated seats, power seats, heated steering wheel etc.)
Moonroof

Not cheap, actually more expensive than the Mustang above, but wow what a car. A civilized rally wanna be. Will blitz anything in real world conditions. Relatively rare and seeing how Shelby Mustangs hold their value and how STi’s hold their value here as do other RS products in Europe I bet depreciation will be glacial. Not a convertible, but seriously the highest performance car anywhere in this list even if some others are faster by the numbers, I bet nothing could get point to point faster or with more smiles per miles. Oh, and Drift mode of course.

2011 up Shelby GT500. OK so for 2010 the Shelby got the refreshed S197 styling like the base Mustang. The Shelby jumped from form ‘only 500hp to for 07-09 to 540hp/510lb/ft in 2010, but still the iron block. The 100lb lighter alloy block came in 2011 with 550hp. OK the 13-14 cars with 662hp and 631lb/ft are berkeleying animals and a whole bunch of fun. I have personal experience of punching it in 3rd at 80mph and hitting 130+ before you can say ‘holy berkeley that’s stupidly fast I want more’ (closed course not the freeway of course and absolutely nothing like being under a bridge on I696, nope, nothing at all). Yes they are the older platform with a live axle, but these cars are a tone of fun, total giggle machines. I do wonder about insurance rates for a DD though.

I mean look at it, it sort of says berkeley off you don’t matter just sitting there, especially in grabber blue. The pisser is the friend whose car I drove has traded it in for a GT350R. His looked just like the one above.
CarGurus shows 26 Convertible 2011-2014 GT500’s available nationwide in the $35-45 bracket and a further 7 if I went for the iron block 2010 cars priced as low as $28K. I mean, where else does a factory ready 200mph 4 seat 500+hp vehicle exist. I’m not sure it does.

Fiat Spider Abarth. As soon as the Abarth was announced I was smitten, I don’t know what the price or delivery is, but my spidy senses are guessing $34-35K which is quite a lot for a baby roadster. In a lot of respects the ND Miata coupe is a better looking vehicle, but as soon as they showed the Abarth version I was smitten. It may not look ‘better’ than the ND coupe, but it looks ‘right’ to me, and that’s who matters here. The simple changes to the hood and front and rear fascia’s makes a huge difference to my eyes. Especially with a throw back satin black hood. I’d have to end up adding a light pod too. TBH I’d be interested in the Abarth if it was just the cosmetics as the base Spiders 1.4 Turbo engine sounds like a pissed off baby hell hound already with its barking popping and banging. So the claimed plus 10hp, real LSD and rumored 100lb weight loss really seal the deal. It’s going to be a long wait though as it’s not going on sale until the fall in Europe and sometime after that over here. I do like the fact that even with the Abarth they are sticking with 17” wheels and not going for 18” with zero side wall rubber band tires. That’s important for Michigan roads. I wonder if Rally Armor universal fit mud flaps will match the red?

This is the base spider at NAIAS with me and an admirer of mine in the foreground.

Mazda Miata ND, the new hard top coupe one. Wow it looks awesome, possibly better looking than the Abarth, but not as special. Spousal until approves. As soon as I showed her the launch video after asking what it was, she liked it and would be on board with this in a heartbeat. Not sure on the price though. If I build a regular ND the way I like it (Grand Touring, crystal white, spoiler, advanced keyless) it comes out close to $32. I’m concerned that the power top could add up to $5K, I think they will ask a bigger premium than they did for the NC PRHT pushing this way over $35K. That’s a lot of cheddar for a Miata and I have my doubts. I speced the Grand Touring as I want the leather seats, if I could get leather with the club I would as I get the LSD and Bilstein shows and loose things like built in Nav (which I find pointless with a smart phone), rain sensing wipers, lane departure etc. I could save $2k by going that rout, but then the Brembo/BBS option is calling my name for another $3.4K which negates it. If I were to stick with a regular soft top Club and avoid the Brembo/BBS the price becomes a far more palatable $29,500, but it wouldn’t be an Abarth Spider and I think I’d always have that in my mind.

981 Boxster/S OK, I’ve always been a Porsche fan, as I said if G50 Carrera coupes with nice mods were still $25K this thread wouldn’t exist, but those cars prices have way surpassed their worth to me. I’ve always loved the Boxster. Some people don’t like the styling, especially the early 986 cars, but I honestly do. To me they look better than the equivalent 911’s, especially if you look at the convertibles. The 911 convertibles look like pregnant humpback whales taking a E36 M3. There is no doubt the 981 > 987 > 986 in terms of fit, finish, build, squeaks and rattles and any and all subjective and dynamic tests. Also with the M97.1 series engines IMS Bearing issues are finally a thing of the past. But the real question here is, is a $35K 981S a better value proposition than a $10-5K 986S? That I’m not sure of. Also, is a $35K 981 a better proposition than a new Mustang, Focus RS, Shelby GT500 or Abarth. Of that I’m not sure.

im just happy to see all the fords even if you do work there. scenario 2 with the shelby convertible gets my vote. im a hard top guy but also a giant mustang fan and think that would make a really fun fair weather car. Ive seen Michigan roads, i wouldnt want to try a mustang + snow on that very often.

Scenario 2 ($20-30K)
Keep the Volvo, sell the Saab, buy a used sports car for summer DD and fun. This has the advantage that I get it all in some respects. The Volvo is awesome and I do in many ways want to keep it. I’d be far more likely to be buying used in this scenario so wouldn’t be suffering a massive depreciation hit, not that that really matters as I tend to keep cars until fully depreciated. If you assume maintenance for the Volvo and a value of say $10K for it, this is broadly similar to the same overall price point as above. 987 Boxster (S) we have the similar discussion to the 981 above about the 987 being better than the 986 but is it better value and is it a better proposition than other cars. For this price point a really nice base late post face lift 987.2 is easily obtainable and they get the 9A1 engine without an IMS bearing so it can never fail. These late base boxsters have all the performance of the 986S with the M96 engine with 255hp from the 2.9L engine. These cars could well be the sweet spot of the 986/987/981 line. While loth to admit it I think I have to nix the 987S models. In this price range the S’s will be 987.1 from 05-08. These had the M97 engine derived from the M96 engine and while the IMS bearing was improved, it’s still not perfect and unlike the M96 engines the case has to be split to repair it. This means preventative bearing change goes from a cheap ‘while you’re in there’ when doing a clutch, it becomes an engine out job, forget it.

Imagine this with either Brumos or Martini stripes!

Mint late 986 Boxster S. So, I’ve already said several times that I like the look of the 986 cars and while some people are asking $30K for cars, $25K can buy you a mint low mileage S, $20K still buys a really nice 50k mile example. I think these cars are a bargain as I don’t see a really nice S dropping below $10K even if rough bottom feeders are in the $5-8K range. Long term ‘S’ cars will always be more sought after than base cars even if the later base cars can outperform them. For any 986 car with an M96 engine I’d look at dropping $2k off the bat for a preventative clutch and IMS bearing change, especially if low miles. The only person I know who’s had an IMS bearing issue was a 10K mile car.

This is a 50k mile car at a dealer asking $19.9K Imagine a little negotiation and or private sale? This could be a winning proposition

Jaguar XKR either a late 02-05 X10 or a cheap 06+ Jag XKR X150. Now some people may be surprised at having a Jaaaggg on here, but I grew up in a Jag family, my father had several and to me they represent the ultimate gentleman’s express this side of an Aston. Not as overtly sporty as the Miata or Porsche, not the ground shredding monster of the Shelby, but an exquisite cross country mile eater. Closet you on the daily commute, lay waste to most plebeians behind when the road is clear and allows you to drive 9/10ths on the twisties without upsetting the spousal unit too much. Something like an XK8 would probably see two up trips to Chicago that we normally use the company car for. The early alloy bodied X150 cars used the same power train as the late X100 cars, that is to say either 400 (X100 up to 05) or 420hp (X150 06 and up) Supercharged 4.2L AJ. Variants of the same basic AJ V8 series of engines were used in millions of Jag’s, Lincoln LS, T birds, Land Rovers and Aston Vantages. By this time all the kinks were well out of the engine. The Nikasil liners were long gone and they’d fixed the plastic timing chain tensioners. They appear to be very robust indeed. Now I know standard Internet lore says all Jags are ticking time bombs, but I’ve followed various threads on these basic vehicles as well as S types and XJ’s. There are a couple of threads over on the once great, now fallen Corner Carvers where people were running an S type R and XKR. The bodyshells are different but the mechanics plus electronics (read the supposed unreliable parts) are basically the same as other cars. People seem to have very little issue with these cars. Yup a coil pack or fuel pump can go out, but that will happen with anything this age. In all they seem to be far more reliable than people are claiming. There is no doubt the later alloy cars are more refined in their exterior and very closely echo the Astons, who’d have thunk it with Ian Callum penning them all. But the nose of the early cars is just glorious, as is that mile wide one piece wood dash. Tough to choose, I thought I’d be lucky to find a nice X150 under $30K while I’d have my pick of mint X100’s in this price range making it more likely. As a point of reference cars.com has 10 X150 XKR convertibles in the $20-30K range so both are out there.

Grey Poupon anyone?

Wow, just wow

Yes it’s a more modern up to date place than the X100, but just not as Grey Poupon-ie

GT500 Shelby Convertible. We talked about the Shelby’s up above in Scenario 1. In this price range I’d certainly be limited to 07-09 preface lift iron block cars with ‘only’ 500hp. But hey, we’re still talking 500hp. These cars really give lie to the widely accepted ‘fact’ that cars lose 30% of their value as soon as you drive off the lot. In 2007 the MSRP for a convertible GT500 was $47,800. Today people are still asking $25-55K for these cars. At best that’s just over 40% depreciation, at worse people think these cars are already appreciating. Going with Cars.com again there are only a handful of cars under $30K, I don’t think the value proposition is there for these especially when moving up to $35K can start to get you into the 11 up alloy block face lifted cars. I think I can strike this one off the list. 2011-12 S197 Coyote 5.0 Mustang GT, fully loaded convertible. Most certainly on the list though is the 11-12 Coyote engined face lifted S197 cars. I’ve had two V6 versions of this cars in the past and they are great. With some added torque they could be awesome. I’m listing the 11 and 12 models here as I prefer the look of the early face lifted cars. I don’t like the grille treatment as much on the 13 and 14 model cars, plus another couple of years helps depreciation. That said if I found a nice 13-14 car I’d obviously consider it. The biggest strike against these cars is that they are holding their value surprisingly well considering the S550 has been out for a couple of years and the affordability of C6 Corvettes . If I was willing to go for a V6 which I had before they can be as low as $13K with manual, call it $15K for a nice one. But a V6 Mustang for a company car / spousal unit transport is one thing, for me err…. Dunno, I did really like them and think with a rear gear they could be pretty quick, cheap to insure and get 30mpg on a run. Not totally discounted, only 99% discounted.

Nice C6 Corvette, let’s face it these are up to 12 years old now and even with an early LS2 still has 400hp and weighs less than a Mustang. I’ve been >< close to buying a Corvette three times in the past and always backed out in the end. A Corvette and a Porsche are both certainly in my future somewhere. I loved the C5’s when they came out, but with the passing of time the exterior styling hasn’t aged well and the interior is a nightmare. I actually still love the looks of the early C4’s and think they are stunning, just not DD material. The C6 still looks modern and fresh compared to the C7 which looks like it was a great looking car, but they continued to ‘throw styling details’ at it after it was finished. Instead the C6 is by far the best looking Corvette made in the last 25 years. Euro snobs can whine that the interior is a step behind a Porsche, but really the 986/996/987/997 cars aren’t the best in interior terms. C6’s are a massive bang for the buck. Even if I put a 40K mileage cap on there are still well over a hundred nationwide to choose from. This has to be the bang for the buck model out there. Other advantages are big load carrying capacity, Targa top is more reliable than a soft top long term and an easy 30mpg on the freeway with that super long 6th gear. Really, this is a huge step up on the old cars. Cheap ND Miata. I won’t go into too much detail on the ND as I covered above talking about more expensive models. But I you spec low you can get new ones out the door for under $25K, that’s getting really cheap. Add in that the 17’s will be arriving soon I’m sure it’s possible to deal on a left in stock 16 model in a couple of months’ time. I should probably go and drive one. The biggest loss of the Sport over the Club model is the lack of LSD for a savings of $3,600. It can’t cost that to add one can it. I might have to start a separate ND thread.

Nice PRHT NC Miata with full Flying Miata Targa package. Yeah, things are taking a bit of a detour into left field here but bear with me. I’m not as anti NC Miata as some and don’t forget this is a DD car not a track car. The PRHT is a great addition and they are getting cheap. Also the whole Flying Miata Targa package for the PRHT is ‘only’ $7,200. That’s the supercharger. Clutch, springs, shocks, sway bars and exhaust. That’s a lot for the money. Figure in $15 to 20 for the best PRHT on the planet and you have an extra 100hp and 80lb/ft of torque in a package that should last as long as a stock engine. Cosworth Engineered, Flyin Miata tuned TUV approved. 2013 Club editions seem to be down to $17K, I was hoping for lower, but just do the blower as the suspension is already fixed and you can come in at $22k although you really need a clutch to be safe. The options are endless here.

Scenario 3 ($15-25K but very different from above)
This is where it gets crazy! Still I think this may be the best all round compromise. Sell the Saab, get a cheap sports car, keep the Volvo but upgrade it with a reflash, down pipe, LSD, light flywheel, wheels, tires, Rear sway bar and possibly Focus ST Recaro seats. Think performance midway between a new Focus ST and RS. For the ‘cheap’ sports car bit I’ve covered the bases before. It would pretty much be limited to the nicest examples of one of the following available for under either $10 or $15K depending on what I agree with SWMBO: 986 Boxster or S. Good early base 986’s are available for $10K with IMS already done. S’s are available in this price but I would probably have to travel for a really nice one. I’d have a ‘quick’ car with the Volvo so do I need the S? NC Miata. Early cars are plentiful in the sub $10K range and there are some 09 up cars too, but they are few and far between. No PRHT though, but I’d have the Volvo for any day the sun wasn’t out. Mustang. Either a 11 or 12 V6 convertible or maybe an 05-09 V8 Convertible like this.

Legend lime is my flat out favorite color for these early cars, but is not that common, especially in a V8 with three pedals. A rear gear really wakes these up as well. Unfortunately V8 manual cars are rare under $10K and those that are way over 100K miles. Going up to $15K opens up the field massively. But that makes really interesting cross shopping with 6 speed 11 up V6 cars.

Let’s look at the Volvo side of this equation now. I already have a separate thread going on C30 re-flashes but roughly this is what I’d be thinking of: Reflash circa $500-1,000
Downpipe $300-800
Possible CAI $100-300 Exhaust $500-900 On the engine side prices and companies are all over the map. I want to stay within the range of the stock turbo until it dies down the road, but let’s call it 300lb/ft torque and 280hp. I’d hope to do that for less than $2,500. The engine is in fine shape. The last Blackstone lab report I had done on the all showed all was good at 75K miles but I’m now at 100K and about to do a timing belt as P.M. per the book. I’ve already got Koni FSD shocks to go on, I’ve no interest in going lower or stiffer on the springs, I’d leave those stock. The car is a ‘2.0’ model which was a trim level not capacity before they went to the R design so it’s already slightly lower and stiffer than stock. I would add a rear sway bar to reduce understeer and probably stabar end links all round to help transitions without ruining the ride which is one of the many things I love about the car. Call it $400 for the suspension. I might start replacing a few suspension arms to refresh the bushings, but that’s maintenance not an upgrade. Exterior. I’m sorely tempted by a skid plate with the roads we have. The stock plastic under tray has plenty of scratches on it and a year round car on these roads needs help. IPD has theirs on sale for $150 and I’ve just discovered Volvo do an OEM one (part # 31269433) for about $250 so they recognize a need. Here’s a guy who lost his engine with only 500 miles on it after hitting a rock on the road.

Also toying with the idea of Rally armor mud flaps and possibly some spot lights rally style. All easily removable with no trace and functional too. Total exterior $150 – 500 Wheels. Note I’m saying wheels not tires. Tires are consumables and unless they are considerably more expensive than stock I don’t’ count them as upgrades. I’ve been through I think 5 sets of tires up to a 245 section on the stock wheels. I’ve already got a thread on Plasti-dipping the stock wheels and the clear coat is trashed. I was/am planning on getting the stock wheels correctly re-finished in the next year or so, but that’s pushing $800. That’s getting close to new wheels. Most aftermarket wheels look like E36 M3, but there are a few. Volvo R designs, I like classic Team Dynamics pro race 1.2’s etc. I might even step down from 18” to 17” diameter and gain some side wall for a tiny loss of transitional response on Michigan roads It’s probably worth it. Call it $1,000+/- for wheels. Here’s the biggie. LSD. The transmission is shared with various Volvo’s and Ford’s. A Quaif is available for $1,300 here but I’ve seen it for less than $1,000 in the UK so I may buy it there. Let’s call it less than $2,000 with installation in the box, I would assume checking and replacing any wear items like syncros and forks while in there. The last piece would be new seats. Either replacing the stock ones, getting the bolster repaired or even replacing them with Focus ST Recaros that can be had with seat heaters for less than $2K. As you can see there’s a lot of leeway in here, but depending what I do for somewhere between $5-10K I could have a quicker, better handling, better looking, more protected and more comfortable C30 that outperforms a Focus ST, although still far short of an RS while looking better than any other car in this long saga.

Conclusion I’ve been absolutely convinced that each of these is the perfect only way to go and nothing else should be considered at least a dozen times. I’ve vacillated back and forth as I’ve types this lot our in spare time over the last week. If I were forced to make a decision right now it would be in order:

1. Focus RS
2. $10K to update and refresh the C30 for another 5 years plus $10K for a Boxster
3. New S550 Mustang GT Convertible
4. $20K+ for a nice Boxster S and keep the C30 as is
5. Used S197 GT plus keep the Saab

Have at it world.

Assuming you've been in all the new-ish Mustangs, and because they're on your list, I want to instantly derail your thread to ask about your run of the mill Mustang GT (which is on your list) vs. the new GT350 (which totally should be except for cost, right?). I've been in a bunch of S550 Mustangs at autocrosses as an instructor. I like them. I kind of want one. Then last weekend I got a ride in a GT350, the first one I've seen in the flesh. It was fast. Two seconds on a 60 second course faster than the V Wagon and it wasn't being thrashed like we were doing with the V Wagon. But here's the thing, there was all of those great gobs of speed but basically no drama. The whole experience was rather sterile. It reminded me of the FiST the first time I drove one in that the car was going very fast, but some of that speed was the car making the world better despite what I was doing.
I guess my point is that the GT350 initially felt like it exists safely inside an envelope that is way beyond what normal people can really explore, where as the GT will more happily swap ends and laugh at your death, which makes it more smile inducing.
How does that sort of thing factor into your decision making?

Been hearing through the grape vine that you can get one of these sub 55K now a days.

2014 v6 S with a warranty and sub say 20K miles.

The GT350 is sex on wheels. It's Natalie Portman and Audrey Hepburn wrapped in silk waiting for me on Christmas morning. The thing is even if you skip the 'R' and get the 'base' GT350 you need to add the magna ride shocks which are part of a $7,500 package pushing the price up to close to $57K. That and even for 2017 model years no one is even talking MSRP, we're still talking at least a $10K 'market adjustment' and suddenly we're talking a $67,000 car plus tax etc. That's just not even on the horizon. I'm not sure I want to afford $40K, I know I don't want to afford pushing $70K. It's just not doable. Honestly if I had that money I'd buy another rental house and use the profits to fun an Aston Vantage instead at this point.

In reply to wearymicrobe:

Just too much cheddar, I really don't want to spend that much money. I may well flake on the prospect of $40K for a GT or RS

333hp, 6 speed, sublime seats, 24mpg mixed... somewhere between 12 and 20k depending on condition.

Used to be a Ford... and is soft core car porn and really - a distinguished 47yr old limey bastard shouldn't rock anything else. Get the Carmax extended warranty though.

I wonder if the Focus RS has a similar personality to the FoST, just amplified? My car is a wonderful jack of all trades. But it's definitely a frat boy partier 24/7, I wonder how the RS feels in comparison? If it's not too high strung for every day use, I'd say it would be a solid choice.

Do you want to "build" your daily or just put gas in it? As we all know, "built" often comes with more maintinence and project creep

10K will buy a needy Boxster. You'll spend another 3-5 inside a year.

Sell the Volvo (how much could you get for it?) and get a 981 as a daily. They do fine with proper snow tires. Porsche even sells rubber floor mats for them.... Keep the Saab as a project/toy and bring it to the Challenge.

I say Jag.

Adrian_Thompson wrote: In reply to wearymicrobe: Just too much cheddar, I really don't want to spend that much money. I may well flake on the prospect of $40K for a GT or RS

Fair enough. If I find a V6 for 42-45K though with a warranty I am sending it your way.

I think having a Targa spec NC is the way to go, really.

What about a variation on option #1?

A) Keep the Volvo as the rainy day/ winter car.

B) Fiat Spider Abarth - you are smitten, and this could be a nice three season car. Fun, convertible, and warranty.

I don't know about you, but I find driving to be more enjoyable that working on a vehicle. There is the short term satisfaction of a job well done, but it's short lived compared to a vehicle that can put a smile on your face everytime you look at it or take it for a drive, and even better if it can make you smile even on your drive to work.

C) Sell Saab - now or wait until your daughter is ready to drive and replace with good starter appliance. Remember, happy wife, happy life.

D) When you feel the urge to tinker, or are performing maintenance/repairs, upgrade the Volvo with small but impactful changes that don't negatively affect reliability. You want to be driving the Abarth, not repairing the Volvo.

Adrian -

I'm glad to know that someone else (besides my wife) understands the thought that goes into potential vehicle purchases!

I'd keep the Volvo - sounds like you enjoy it and could use it in poor weather or for your daughter. Known quantity and all that, and some subtle upgrades could give it a new lease on life.

My vote would be for something fun. In ten years when you look back at your purchase, what car would you regret not taking a swing at?

My '15 GS MX-5, with suspension package (LSD) and a soft top, was about $24k last year with 7k mi and a CPO warranty. I would have liked an ND, but this was when they were just getting on dealer lots, and they commanded ridiculous markups. I really like having both an LSD and heated leather seats, which the ND doesn't offer yet. I'm happy as a clam, and as I have stated so many times here, I love the soft top for its accessibility and aesthetics.

I was cross shopping it mostly with the BRZ/FRS and base model Caymans. The Frisbees were not as fun to drive, and the Caymans couldn't quite meet the price/newness intersection I was looking for. In the end, I got exactly what I wanted for a note that I could comfortably afford, with a warranty that will outlast the loan.

Given your options, I would look hard at an ND, or if you want to save a few bucks, an NC. I haven't driven an ND, because having recently picked up my NC, I would rather be blissfully ignorant. Having sat inside a few NCs at car shows, the fabric top is a big improvement over the NC's excellent design. Having seen the new Fiat, I still think that the ND looks better, especially better than the Abarth.

You've driven plenty of Mustangs. Have you driven the Focus RS? Or the ND? If not I think I'd take a long day and do back-to-back drives to see which one speaks to me, assuming you are really considering going with a new car. Even if you can't drive the ND RF yet, a soft top will give you a feel for the car. See if you can find a Boxster on a lot somewhere on the same day.

At this point you've so thoroughly though it all out that the biggest question is whether you want one car or two. Two cars is nice in Michigan, but if you garage a 'nice' car in the winter, who are you saving it for? If you'll keep it for 10-15 years, sure, but if it'll be gone within five or so then the starting corrosion it will pick up during that time isn't really relatent.
If one car, I vote convertible Mustang GT. It ticks whole heaps of boxes at once. If two cars then keep the Volvo because the devil you know is better than the devil you don't, and pick up an Abarth when they become available. Switching cars with the seasons will keep them fresh and exciting longer. Driving the Volvo in the fall will be like putting on an old pair of shoes and uncovering the Abarth in spring will be like meeting a cute girl at the park all over again.