Audi info?

93celicaGT2 wrote: Turns out this car is in fact a 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20v. Asking price is $900, owner claims it runs well, no rust, the only glaring exterior flaw is that it's missing the grill. (No big deal.) Now, he says that a shifter cable is snapped/disconnected. What are the chances that this is the case and the transmission is still good?

Well, it's hydraulic clutch and rod shift linkage, so you be the judge.

93celicaGT2 wrote: Anecdote of when the car failed the owner: Does this in fact sound like a shifter cable to everyone?

seller said: ya i drove it up to gas station put it in 1st and went in to store came back out and started it up and went to put into reverse and the shifter had tons of slop in it

The 200 has rods, not a cable. As far as I can tell, the 90 doesn't have a cable either.

Knurled wrote:

93celicaGT2 wrote: Turns out this car is in fact a 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20v. Asking price is $900, owner claims it runs well, no rust, the only glaring exterior flaw is that it's missing the grill. (No big deal.) Now, he says that a shifter cable is snapped/disconnected. What are the chances that this is the case and the transmission is still good?

Well, it's hydraulic clutch and rod shift linkage, so you be the judge.

Ah didn't know that... So the transmission is either borked, which can't have sounded good, or the rod is disconnected somewhere?

I'm not a great wrench, so i may be missing the mark entirely. Luckily, i've only ever had one transmission/shifting issue on any car i've ever owned, and that was the escort. Tranny was toast, dumped in a new one.

Not entirely sure i'd want to go through that on an Audi Quattro.

What do you more-learned guys think it would be, then? If this isn't something i can fix in a couple hours in the guy's backyard if i have to, then i won't buy it. The aparment complex was already kindof unhappy about the Celica just sitting out there all winter.

93celicaGT2 wrote: Run dont' walk?

I'd be much more interested in that 20v turbo you've been talking about in the classifieds. TURBO. I guess the 90 is lighter, but TURBO.

Or put the two together, sell what's left.

angusmf wrote:

93celicaGT2 wrote: Run dont' walk?

I'd be much more interested in that 20v turbo you've been talking about in the classifieds. TURBO. I guess the 90 is lighter, but TURBO.

Yeah... i hear you. No way i can get out to the 200 for at least a couple weeks, though, and right this very instant it's slightly rich for my blood unless i could lowball the hell out of him. I already sent him an email for more details and pictures so we'll see what happens there.

This 90 is 30 minutes away, potentially an easy fix, is the car i want to start with, and i could probably walk away with it for $700 or less. At the very least, i'd like to look at it.

Plus, even if i get it and the 200 goes away, i still have the 20v, and there's still plenty of ways to make power with it from what i've seen.

I'm cool with starting with either car, much as i hate land barges, but the 90 is more attainable right this instant, and it's SURPRISINGLY light... just a smidge over 3000lbs.

I don't know all of the differences between the turbo and n/a 20v motors, but I know the turbo motors are getting scarce. At a minimum I bet the pistons and exhaust valves are different, plus aaaaall the intake and exhaust stuff. You'll probably spend less on that whole car than you would getting much out of the n/a 20v.

---edit---

AND, the other drivetrain parts from the 20v turbo cars are desirable.

Arg, you're killin' me! I can't pick up the 200 right now, nor do i QUITE have the money. This whole scenario is kindof damned if i do, damned if i don't. 20vt cars are hard to find, and so are decently clean 90 20v Quattros. I do understand all of your points, and as dumb as this sounds, if the 200 were a Turbo Quattro Wagon 20v, i'd sell my body on the way home tonite and take tomorrow off from work.

I'll make a more final decision when the owner of the 200 gets back to me, but in the meantime, what are all the possible culprits of the shifting issue on the 90, and which would be the most likely?

angusmf wrote: I don't know all of the differences between the turbo and n/a 20v motors, but I know the turbo motors are getting scarce. At a minimum I bet the pistons and exhaust valves are different, plus aaaaall the intake and exhaust stuff. You'll probably spend less on that whole car than you would getting much out of the n/a 20v.

The difference between turbo and non turbo heads is the cams. And people use the non turbo cams as an upgrade for the turbo.

Well, I'm from Motorgeek, so I can probably answer some of your questions (and give some recommendations). First: I would get a B3 (1988-92) chassis 80 or 90 quattro, which I think you are already considering anyway. The B4 (1993-1995) chassis only came with the 12v V6, and it is much harder to swap a 20vt into it. Second: for a 20vt, I would recommend making one, rather than buying a 200 20v for the motor swap. These cars are getting rarer and rarer, and those "in the know" and those who think they are tend to charge a lot for them. The procedure for a ghetto 20vt, as they are called, involves using a 10v n/a stock bottom end (B3 chassis), and a 7A (20v n/a) head. You then merely bolt the 7a head onto the bottom end, and you have about 8.5:1 compression ratio. The bottom end is safe to about 400 crank HP, and after that rods tend to bend. The 7A's cams are superior (similar to RS2), and the 7A heads tend to be in better shape than the 20vt heads.

angusmf wrote:

93celicaGT2 wrote: Anecdote of when the car failed the owner: Does this in fact sound like a shifter cable to everyone?

seller said: ya i drove it up to gas station put it in 1st and went in to store came back out and started it up and went to put into reverse and the shifter had tons of slop in it

The 200 has rods, not a cable. As far as I can tell, the 90 doesn't have a cable either.

Nope, it's probably bad syncros. The 01A (the transmission that B3/4/5s use) is notorious for the 2nd and 3rd syncros going out. It could be that it needs new bushings, and it could need adjustment, but likely the syncros are grinding unless it is a low mileage model. By the way, these transmissions are good to about 400 crank HP, much like the stock bottom ends. They do not, however, interchange between the B3 and B4/5, due to the fact that the B3s are 4.11:1 R&P ratio, and the B4/5s are 3.89:1. For a turbocharger, I would recommend a Holset HX-35, for the intake, you want the intake found on the 200 20v, engine code 3B. Many people use stock 20vt exhaust manifolds, but you need to check for cracks, and they become a restriction around ~ 350 crank HP. If you have any more questions, feel free to ask me

grab something without a turbo and slap one one it....

Andrew

frank_the_quattro_tank wrote:

angusmf wrote:

93celicaGT2 wrote: Anecdote of when the car failed the owner: Does this in fact sound like a shifter cable to everyone?

seller said: ya i drove it up to gas station put it in 1st and went in to store came back out and started it up and went to put into reverse and the shifter had tons of slop in it

The 200 has rods, not a cable. As far as I can tell, the 90 doesn't have a cable either.

Nope, it's probably bad syncros. The 01A (the transmission that B3/4/5s use) is notorious for the 2nd and 3rd syncros going out. It could be that it needs new bushings, and it could need adjustment, but likely the syncros are grinding unless it is a low mileage model. By the way, these transmissions are good to about 400 crank HP, much like the stock bottom ends. They do not, however, interchange between the B3 and B4/5, due to the fact that the B3s are 4.11:1 R&P ratio, and the B4/5s are 3.89:1. For a turbocharger, I would recommend a Holset HX-35, for the intake, you want the intake found on the 200 20v, engine code 3B. Many people use stock 20vt exhaust manifolds, but you need to check for cracks, and they become a restriction around ~ 350 crank HP. If you have any more questions, feel free to ask me

So you think the synchros just spontaneously combusted while he was in the gas station? He said that the shifter felt completely different when he started the car again and went to put it in reverse vs. what it felt like when he drove it TO the gas station, and that he can't even find any gears right now.

Thanks you and everyone else for the rest of the info. I'm crossing my fingers that this 90 is as decent as the owner says it is, and that i can find out what's wrong with the tranny, without it BEING the tranny.

That being said, are you going to go look at it?

Andrew

In reply to 93celicaGT2:

Yeah, a bushing probably went out. They used a lot of plastic in the bushings, and 20+ years later is not easy on them.

Just throwing in my hearty approval of all things 5 cylinder and quattro, especially turbo

In high school one of my friend's older brother had a 90 quattro and a URQ. He let me drive both

He's still got the URQ and has gone through a 200 TQ sedan and Avant and is now dd'ing a C4 A6 Avant.

frank_the_quattro_tank wrote: In reply to 93celicaGT2: Yeah, a bushing probably went out. They used a lot of plastic in the bushings, and 20+ years later is not easy on them.

That's what i'm hoping. If that's the case, cheap, easy, quick fix.

digdug18 wrote: That being said, are you going to go look at it? Andrew

Yep. Saturday after i get out of work.

Do you have room for all these cars? Or as another one comes does one need to be put to pasture?

Andrew

digdug18 wrote: Do you have room for all these cars? Or as another one comes does one need to be put to pasture? Andrew

Yeah, i've got the room, just no consistent place to work on them. If things really get out of hand, i have access to free storage for two inside, unlimited outside about an hour from my place.

Yes... i live in an apartment.

It is a bit of a weird situation, though...

The Celica is my main "toy," and is completely un-dd-able. The Escort is my girlfriend's current DD, but that'll change, because we're making a bit of a project out of it. (Familia GTR motor, paint, finish suspension.) Then that'll be her toy, and she'll need a DD. Probably an SUV of some kind. The MX6 is my DD, believe it or not. And also my GRM Challenger. The Audi would just be a "whatever" car. Fast car, nice interior, looks nice. Just a fun car for whatever use.

If it displaces anything, it'll be the MX6, but that'll have to be after the challenge, and i'd just as soon keep the MX6 around for an all out drags attempt later on in life. It doesn't owe me anything, it's a $900 car.

Basically, the Audi would be my first foray in a long while of a car that would actually be worth a E36 M3 to anyone other than GRMers.

I'm sure if i wasn't so ADD about all this, and saved for a year or something, i could turn everything into two very nice cars. E36 M3 and an MR2 Turbo maybe? I just can't give up my Celica under any circumstances, and it's the only one that might be worth any significant amount at this point. I'd be lucky to get $1500 out of the Escort, and probably $2000 out of the MX6.

It's complicated. But i don't think i'm alone here... i know some of you have over a dozen cars.

Yes, some people on here do have a dozen cars, and an ex wife or two because of the dozen cars as well. i'm gonna get 1 extra car to work on at a time, because otherwise my fiancee would kick my ass.

Andrew

Ehhh... as long as we both get to work, mine doesn't really care. She's got the bug in a way, too, just not quite on the scale as me. She likes to stay focused, so she won't even entertain the idea of herself looking for another fun car until her Escort is done.

Though... she REALLY wants a Festiva or an Omni. Wut.

So if an omni or festiva just happens to show up on christmas then she's cool, lol.

Mine's looking ahead for her next car, and the long list of things that she MUST have in the car. Seat warmers, moon roof, trunk, awd, variable wipers, the list goes on.....

Andrew

digdug18 wrote: So if an omni or festiva just happens to show up on christmas then she's cool, lol. Mine's looking ahead for her next car, and the long list of things that she MUST have in the car. Seat warmers, moon roof, trunk, awd, variable wipers, the list goes on..... Andrew

Well... the Escort showed up on Xmas last year... If we get a Festy, it'll probably take the place of the Escort.

Not sure what the Omni would be all about.

That list sounds like suck. I like cloth, heat, maybe a sunroof in a nice daily, and manual everything. Oh, and a nice stereo, but i can do that myself.

Actually you could do the heat and sunroof yourself as well.

http://evansville.craigslist.org/cto/1611799015.html $650 Festiva

http://milwaukee.craigslist.org/cto/1610472352.html $400 Festiva

http://westky.craigslist.org/pts/1597713409.html $250 Festive

http://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/1618649017.html $600 Omni

http://cincinnati.craigslist.org/cto/1611617246.html $800 Omni

Or you could get all of these for the price of a audi and swapped in motor, lol... Sorry, I'm a bad bad man!

Andrew