Big cars are out, narrowing down the players for 5 replacement

Junkyard_Dog wrote: Re-reading this post, I've noticed talk of small cars being too small and big cars being to big/boring/thirsty. What about the Goldilocks approach? Would a mid-sizer like a 4MT Fusion make sense? Same chassis as the Mazda6 but a bit bigger iirc. V6 MT Accord? Maybe one of those hideous hatchback versions? The Legacy is in this category, but why is it the only one you're looking at? It seems you might be passing over the exact cars you need.

Don't forget the price equation.

6 wagon, do it doit!

EDIT: Here is an oddball offer, X-type wagon.

icaneat50eggs wrote: Have you ever tried offroading? I can't imagine anything more exciting that you can do in a vehicle.

Unless "offroading" is a code word for another person/s, your imagination is invalid.

Have you tried a Saab 9-3 2006-2011 Sportcombi. You really should give the 2.0T a test before ruling it out. Bigger than the 3er, more reliable too. Very cheap to buy, fuel and maintain.

Flight Service wrote: The SVT Focus non-hooned would be great. of what you listed I would go with the 6 wagon.

Thanks for the 2 cents! So it looks like although the SVT is a good car, it's probably not what I'm looking for. Honestly though, the Scooby mileage isn't that bad.

2002maniac wrote: Seriously. Why Javelin is interested in Volvos and Saabs, but fears BMW is beyond me.

Um, I am? I just haven't found a single one for sale in WA/OR for under $13K.

Junkyard_Dog wrote: Why is the Forester not on the list again?

It is.

Junkyard_Dog wrote: Re-reading this post, I've noticed talk of small cars being too small and big cars being to big/boring/thirsty. What about the Goldilocks approach? Would a mid-sizer like a 4MT Fusion make sense?

Mid-size is exactly where I want to be, the problem is WAGON. Sedans are useless when you have small children. Seriously, where do you change a diaper? Have a 2 year old use their potty? Super-duper easy in the back of a hatch/wagon, unpossible in a trunk.

turboswede wrote: A BMW wagon or a decent Minivan would solve the problem at hand in two different ways. Neither of which is appealing to you for some reason. So we're all going to mentally masturbate without any sort of decent climax.

BMW wagon would solve it, now find an 02+ one, with a stick, for under $13K, that has less than 150K miles on it. And we had a minivan. It worked great except the 3rd row is admittedly pretty useless when you have kids in carseats, and equally as bad for adults, so a 3-across in the 2nd row makes more sense.

So just for a refresh, here are the requirements:

• 2002 - present
• $13,000ish or less (much prefer under $10K)
• 5-door wagon/hatch with seating for 5
• Manual transmission

The ideal matches are the Legacy / Outback wagons, the Mazda6 wagon, BMW 5-series, and the V70 R/T5 as they are all mid-size, along with the SAAB 9-5 SportCombi. The Mazda3, Focus, BMW 3-series, and the Impreza/9-2X could all be in the game depending on the back seat room. The Forester is the only SUV-ish thing in the mix, but only in XT guise, so it's pretty unicorinsh. I don't think there's really anything else, but I'm willing to hear it.

And NO, SUV's/crossovers/cute-utes won't do it, so forget XTerra/Pathfinder/Soul.

Thanks for putting up with me.

I think mazda6 is the winner. The hatchback version might work for you too.

You can buy 2002+ BMW 325XiTs all day long in the 7-12k price range. Hell... I'll sell you my wife's '05 for $10k with 119k on it tomorrow. New cooling system, pulleys, PS pump, all fluids... needs a new front axle due to a boot tear ... probably needs a couple other things when it warms up enough to look at it. Make it 9k. Other than the stick thing... it's a ZF 5 speed auto.

(she just said "I think I need a bigger car to haul the equipment in" at dinner ;) )

In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:

No stick, no deal. That's the problem I'm having with BMW wagons.

turboswede wrote:

belteshazzar wrote: what do you think of toyota highlanders?

I have one and can confirm they are boring as dirt. Great rigs though. Not as easy to get people and stuff into and out of compared to a Minivan. Have a friend with a newer Rav-4, which is about the same size as our 01 Highlander (the newer Highlanders are larger) but it is much noisier inside the cabin and it feels cheaper. Our 01 2.4 2WD gets pretty decent mileage for a CUV, 22-24mpg mixed and it gets much better on the highway. The 2.4 loves abuse and the VVT is a nice little surge of power. It really needs a limited slip differential to be of any use in slippery conditions, but once its moving it gets along just fine in ice/snow.

Flat out worst vehicle I have ever had the misfortune to own. Bought new in and at 100K miles it was falling apart. Minor E36 M3 like rear wheel bearings, drive shaft center bearing, steering column intermediate shaft, brake master cylinder. You know, nothing important. Also the HVAC control unit took a E36 M3 and would randomly blow full hot then full cold. Paint was so thin and scratched so easily I think it had a negative thickness. Headlights melted, yes seriously they melted. when we took it in to the dealer they tried to tell us we had put more powerful bulbs in (we hadn't) my wife read the service manager the riot act on that, it was quite funny to see a grown man stepping backwards, visibly shaken. The floor mats wore through in less than a year. Plastic bits falling off and the 'soft touch' covering on the dash started wearing out and getting sticky. It was a complete steaming pile of dog diarrhea with a side serving of cat puke. It was also the most boring uninspiring vehicle we've ever owned. It was so bland at times I would get confused after going shopping and find myself taking things out of the refrigerator and putting them back in the Tyurdbota Scumlander it was such an appliance. Run, don't walk, run like hell away from one. And to think I was pushing for an A4 wagon when we got that POS.

Also no manual so Jav can't consider such a woeful affront to the automotive enthusiast.

But how do you really feel about it?

If you are willing to fly and drive. Utah's only a day away...

Outback XT

Legacy GT

V70R high miles

07 Mazda 5 low miles

Teh E36 M3 wrote: But how do you really *feel* about it?

Trust me, I was being polite and restrained.

In reply to Javelin:

They are out there.

My friend sold his recently (325iT so RWD, 5sp... ) for $5500 with something a little less than the mileage you want. His son used it all thru college as a band equipment hauler though so the beat up interior took away some in value.

They are becoming something of a cult car so people seem to keep them until they die. Check estate sales :)

Worth a trip to so cal

Serious Q, why the absolute on no auto? I know we all love manuals, and my DD is a manual. But modern auto’s are great and you’ve just bought a P71 as a stop gap. Why not check out a more readily available auto Wagons?. I mentioned in my fully justifiable rant above about the Turdbota Scumlander that I had been pulling for an A4 Avant when we got that POS, but my wife didn’t like it as much as the E46 wagon. If BMW had made an 330ix E46 wagon with an auto instead of only the 325 I think we would have had one, but the smaller engine plus the weight and drag of the auto, wagon and AWD meant it was too slug like. It was after ruling that out she went on the SUV kick and got that thing I cannot name. Really, modern auto’s with NA engines are great.

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

Teh E36 M3 wrote: But how do you really *feel* about it?

Trust me, I was being polite and restrained.

You got an absolute lemon. Our 01 Base model has been great and has about 180K on it. What we thought as a dying auto was just overfilled and abused transmission fluid, changing that helped a lot. A relative has an 02 V6 top of the line and it has about 140K on it and has been dead nuts reliable as well. Both look nearly new (when cleaned up).

Now the 2nd gen has some issues apparently and the hybrid model doesn't really help that much with economy and the 3rd gen is just way too big and ugly, IMO.

Meanwhile my Dad bought an A4 V6 wagon and its been an utter POS and for the duration of the 5-year loan its been in the garage off and on for about 4.5 years. Its still there today because there is an EGR issue (requires pulling the heads to fix at this point) and a vacuum pump problem, both causing a CEL so it won't pass emissions testing. Also the auto is on its way out as the shift from 1st to 2nd comes with a huge amount of flare. So needless to say he's been rocking the reliable old Caravan or his wife's Corolla.

In reply to Adrian_Thompson:

I can count on one hand the number of automatics I consider to actually drive well, and none of them were available past about 1975, with the exception of PDK. When I select a gear, I want it for a reason dammit, stop trying to do your own thing (Ford, Audi, Subaru all spring immediately to mind). You can at least reprogram a P71's trans to not be idiotic, but I still longed for a T45 swap every day I owned that car.

In reply to Adrian_Thompson:

Glad to see I am not the only anti-Yota fan here. Seems like your experience was worse than mine!

Storz wrote: Saab 9-5 wagon. They are dirt cheap, reliable, can be had with a manual and make awesome power with the 2.3t and a reflash.

+1

clutchsmoke wrote:

Storz wrote: Saab 9-5 wagon. They are dirt cheap, reliable, can be had with a manual and make awesome power with the 2.3t and a reflash.

+1

9-5 is on the list! Just have to find one to drive.

IS300 sportcross if you dont mind an auto/tiptronic.

Flight Service wrote: EDIT: Here is an oddball offer, X-type wagon.

Good luck finding a manual. Also not Jags finest moment.

Why not another Mazda 5?

Also Scion xB?

93EXCivic wrote:

Flight Service wrote: EDIT: Here is an oddball offer, X-type wagon.

Good luck finding a manual. Also not Jags finest moment.

Just checked autotrader, exactly zero manual X type wagons for sale Nationally, only 56 manual sedans.

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

93EXCivic wrote:

Flight Service wrote: EDIT: Here is an oddball offer, X-type wagon.

Good luck finding a manual. Also not Jags finest moment.

Just checked autotrader, exactly zero manual X type wagons for sale Nationally, only 56 manual sedans.