But seriously, why *can’t* we have the windows up?

Could it be due to many vehicles especially at track days have no external kill switch?  Newer cars automatically locks doors but I know the window down rule preceded many of those cars.  This I think it's more to disable the ignition and power source rather than having to break a window first.  And even with proper tools a window is hard to shatter and can leave shards that can cut anyone trying to reach in or out the car.  Plus the speeds capable of many newer street cars are much higher than they were even 20 years ago.  Then buffeting wasn't as big an issue when you are hitting 80-100 versus 150+.  Just my thoughts ....

This screenshot came to me via PM, but Misha Charoudin weighed in as well.

Completely agree with all your thoughts in the article. Have been wondering this for years. Let's get this changed!

Something else to consider here: We may come to the conclusion that windows up is the greatest thing since chocolate covered bananas, but if the underwriters insuring these events say "Windows down because reasons" then it's windows down forever. 

zm2 said:

Completely agree with all your thoughts in the article. Have been wondering this for years. Let's get this changed!

How would change be best attempted? Each event organizer would have to make the change, independently, right? And to JG's point below, are the event organizers even concerned with it beyond what their insurance says/requires? 

I like using hand signals for giving pass signals, it is typically clear and easy to understand. Turn signal controls these days aren't what the used to be, some cars it's a single flash, some 3 flashes, some are hard to cancel without giving a signal on the other side. On top of that like mentioned in the article there are disagreements about which side you should signal on, where you are going or where you want them to go. I also like the extra airflow I get in the car with the windows down as it keeps me and the passenger cooler (no A/C, my car flows significantly more air through the vents with a window cracked).

Having said all of that in a rollover having them down does not seem safer. Even if they do blow to pieces as expected when the car goes on its side at least up until that point they have kept your arms/head inside, I would argue that having them cracked an inch would still accomplish that. I can also see the opposite though in a situation where the car doesn't roll but the doors will not open, not a place you want to be if a fire starts.

There's never going to be a perfect solution when taking a street car on the track, what makes it better in one situation could make it a death trap in another. It's important to think about and review these policies though rather than just doing it a certain way like it has always been done.

In reply to JG Pasterjak :

The Ring has its own rules...and I believe they are different depending on whether the road is being used in its open to the public condition or closed to the public but open for true track day driving. In public road mode, traffic is supposed to follow standard road rules, i.e. stay right unless passing...that was the rule I was expected to follow when I was there.

In reply to Spearfishin :

Yeah, seems like it'd have to get phased in at the org/event level to gain momentum. Are we sure that US track event insurance companies require windows down, or is the req just some legacy thing bc "it's always been done that way"?

All this said, when I've raced in NLS at the Ring in the summer, it can get quite toasty in the race cars w/o AC bc windows up are a requirement. You can have them down during the formation lap and after the checkers (helps to be waving to the fans) and you can get away with them cracked a little during the race, but they're supposed to be up. 

In reply to zm2 :

Windows down is much more likely legacy than the underwriters. When I was involved with event organization, the underwriters let the organizers set the rules. This info now 15 years old. The legacy reason dating back to the oldest SCCA GCR/PCS that I  have seen is ventilation. I may still have it, I'll dig the archive later.

My wife who knows little about such things asked me about that when we were watching a track event together on tv, all my SCCA experiences were a long time ago so I dont know what they are doing now, but then it was at drivers discretion. Up if it was raining and down with the heat on which was the most common. Oddly my first drivers school was at charlotte with the first day in a driving rain...and then managing track conditions as the sun came out and slowly dried the track was a treat. :)

I started racing in little British cars that didn't even have side windows (except the ones that were removable called side curtains) so not an issue for those. In either a closed or open car, if you want  a safe cockpit, you have to have a roll cage, not just a roll bar, and attach a side net to it to keep your arms and other bits inside despite doing cartwheels etc., or you need to be OK with wearing arm restraints.  I'd think that either of those would be OK with the organizers, though having never worn the restraints myself, I don't know to what degree they would inhibit pointing to pass etc.

wspohn said:

...though having never worn the restraints myself, I don't know to what degree they would inhibit pointing to pass etc.

No more so than a window net.