Calming the Beast ... Making Suspension More Livable

As some of you guys might have read, I'm having some issues with suspension. It's a bit harsh and the car is a bit skiddish.

With that said, I do have entry-level coilovers on the car, so that could be the cause. But honestly the car was a bit skiddish from the beginning (Gen Coupe 10).

The only thing I can think of that would mitigate the harshness and skiddishness w/o switching back to my stock suspension is switching tires or playing with air pressure. The coliovers are almost on full soft (any lower and the car is bouncey and less predictable)

I'm wondering if you guys have any tips on what I can do to get it a bit more amiable...

Finding the right shock absorbers will go a long way towards fixing your issue. I'd bet that some Bilsteins or Konis ,combined with a quality spring would transform the car.

Are you sure it is your dampener settings and not your actual suspension settings? If your alignment is off or not optimal, it can lead to skittishness. Toe out or even no toe can make the steering feel darty and if the rears toe out, the car will want to rotate at any oppertunity

@DeadSkunk: I'm in Korea were aftermarket parts are 2-3 times more expensive than the states, I'd like to try to keep the coilovers because it was a pain to get them here

@MegaDork: I got an alignment to factory specs, wondering if I should play around with the Toe...

Keep it coming guys

Yeah, really hard suspension will cause the car to skip over rough roads causing generally poor traction, but if you're getting any kind of directional instability it's more likely an alignment problem. Too much/unequal toe, unequal camber or caster or a combination of those can cause nasty tramlining and imprecise steering.

Edit: How recently did you get an alignment to factory specs, and have you made any suspension changes since?

Another idea: Since this problem apparently started with the coilovers, did switching to coilovers also mean going to a lower ride height? Maybe you're having bump steer problems, which is possible even with good springs, damping and alignment. You'd have to alter the suspension geometry to fix it.

Since you have the coilovers, you might be able to have them "dyno'd" and revolves to suit your car & driving style. That would likely go a long way to resolving damping issues. Look for shock dyno or rebuilding services in your area and you might save a little money over buying yet more parts.

I second the bumpsteer concern. Hard to check without specialized equipment though. Easy to verify if OE geometry isn't too far off by checking how close the control arms are to parallel to the ground at the desired ride height. If not, balljoint spacers might be available to correct the geometry and help restore OE geometry.

If the suspension or shocks are bottoming out, the spring rate goes to infinity and when that happens the car will get skittish. So softening the shocks and/or springs could make that problem worse. Some zip ties around the shock shafts can be a good indicator of how much shock travel is being used. If they are bottoming out, then raise the height, using the adjustable spring perches, a 1/4" at a time until they stop bottoming out.

Taller, softer tire sidewalls can help soak up bumps and reduce the skittish feelings.

Worst case you may have to go back to OE suspension to get away from the problems.

Too little information. Why did you put the coilovers on in the first place? Stance? What coilovers, what spring rates? What wheels, what tires? What is ride height? The word you are looking for is skittish. There is no "skiddish" in the dictionary, although maybe there should be.

Not to be harsh, but you put crappy coilovers on your car and then complain about the ride. When someone says put good shocks on, you say no... Tires and air pressure won't fix your issue. Sounds like you are on the bump stops and the car is skipping around. I doubt anything short of putting on a good suspension will make the car ride well. Otherwise, go back to stock. You didn't throw the stock dampers away, did you? If you have them, get better shocks as suggested and re-install.

Sounds like bumpsteer issues to me. Raise it if you can to test, then maybe ball joint spacers as was mentioned. Entry level coilovers aren't known for their awesome valving, so a revalve may help as well.

maj75 wrote: Too little information. Why did you put the coilovers on in the first place? Stance? What coilovers, what spring rates? What wheels, what tires? What is ride height? The word you are looking for is skittish. There is no "skiddish" in the dictionary, although maybe there should be. Not to be harsh.....

Please take it easy on the newbie. This isn't Honda-Tech. We all had to learn some this stuff somewhere. As you point out, there is not enough information to make a definitive judgment about what is or is not happening with the suspension of his car.

We have given the original poster a lot to think about. Lets let him digest it and see where it leads.

If your coilovers aren't crap, one issue may be that the tires don't give a good ride, making stiff suspensions even more intolerable. Don't buy new parts until you can verify that the coilovers, tires, bumpstop, or other issues give your car a harsh ride.

maj75 wrote: Too little information. Why did you put the coilovers on in the first place? Stance? What coilovers, what spring rates? What wheels, what tires? What is ride height? The word you are looking for is skittish. There is no "skiddish" in the dictionary, although maybe there should be. Not to be harsh, but you put crappy coilovers on your car and then complain about the ride. When someone says put good shocks on, you say no... Tires and air pressure won't fix your issue. Sounds like you are on the bump stops and the car is skipping around. I doubt anything short of putting on a good suspension will make the car ride well. Otherwise, go back to stock. You didn't throw the stock dampers away, did you? If you have them, get better shocks as suggested and re-install.

@maj75 Calm down ... And thanks for correcting my spelling I appreciate it

I put on the coilovers because they gave a lot of adjustability. I do drive spiritedly every once in a while. This is my weekend car so I thought I'd go a bit stiffer with the suspension.

These are Stance Super Street w/ 7kg F and 8kg R. The front is lowered about 14 mm and the rear is lowered 22mm (this is the highest setting, although I did order taller springs I just haven't put them in). Wheels are the base 18inchers. Tires are some cheap Nexens (stock size) that the previous owner put on. I'm not on bump stops. I always keep my stock parts in case I have revert.

So with this new information, do you have anything constructive to say? If I wanted to get flamed I probably wouldn't have come here.

With that said, I think I'll be raise the height a tad , get some new tires, and follow it up with an alignment after the new springs settle. I'm hoping this will help maybe...

hmm.. I wonder if those tyres are past their sell by date?

When is it "skiddish"? On a long sweeper like an onramp, or quick turns? Or both? When you are on the throttle? Does the car try and follow its own path? Can you try to describe the conditions & symptoms better?

I know your F/R motion ratios are different... but what does the wheel rate work out to with that setup? May consider swapping the springs front to rear (if possible). Could improve comfort as well.

Are your bars stock? Any bind anywhere to speak of?

And I'll add to that, have you smacked any potholes or anything that could have knocked you out of alignment? Unlike most budget coilovers, I've actually heard decent things about the Stance products, at least on Subarus.

When I read "Skiddish" I took it to mean that the car lost traction as in sudden under or oversteer.

If what you mean is that the car feels "nervous" with the tendency to change direction quickly, is that not a good thing?

Does this bother you most on straight roads or mostly on bumpy corners?

The other thing to consider is that once you abandon factory suspension parts, there is a good chance you also abandon factory alignment settings. How knowledgeable is your suspension aligner? Very little skill left in today's computerized alignment world; based on the model of car, the computer tells the operator to do something and the operator does so.

In reply to Nis14: Before buying anything, try to ride with someone with a Genesis Coupe with coilovers to see how theirs rides and handles and ask them what their setup is on their car.

He's in Korea. He might be the only guy there with a modded genesis. Lol. He didn't specify WHICH Korea... God I hope it's south....

Maybe you should start over and explain precisely... walk us through your favorite curve where your car scares you and explain in detail. Most of us are semi-professional story tellers anyways. If anyone can help you resolve your issue its the guys on this forum

"Stance" is the problem.

For nearly every platform, you have to approach $1500+ per set for ride-height and damping adjustable decent coilover.

@ProDarwin: It's not the corners that bother me. Actually when I'm either on the gas or cornering the car is pretty smooth. It's when I'm going straight at cruising speed that bothers me.

The problem is the new suspension setup creates a bit of vertical jarring. The roads here in SOUTH Korea are a medley of good and bad, some are really smooth, while others are absolute crap. The bumps aren't too bad, it's just a bit uncomfortable. The other part is the car feels like it'll change direction on me whenever I hit a bump or a dip. It's never really done that so far, but the car feels like it's going to.

I read your comments on bumpsteer and tires. So I'm going to have the car raised a bit and get some decent tires. Alignment will be done later the new springs settle in (and suggestions on what I should look to tweak in the alignment department?)

@NOHOME the car scene here is really in it's inception. I haven't found that many alignment guys who really know what they are doing, mostly they're just going by what the computer says. But then again, I haven't really actively searched.

z31maniac wrote: "Stance" is the problem. For nearly every platform, you have to approach $1500+ per set for ride-height and damping adjustable decent coilover.

I would not go that far.. my old BMW 318ti has the Bilstein PSS9 coil overs on it.. I think I spent about $800 for the set

Did you upgrade suspension bushings to urethane or solid? Sometimes people go too far with bushing stiffness. In a race-only car, the more solid the better. You can let the shocks and geometry do their job and let the driver deal with track conditions. But, depending on the rest of the setup, adding a little cushion on the bushings is a cheap way to soften things. The initial "hit" is absorbed by the bushing before the shocks have a chance to force the tires into submission.

Tires are another huge factor; rubber compound, sidewall height, etc. I put 20" chrome wheels on my Impala SS that originally had 17". The tiniest bump in a turn would upset it. It had very little sidewall to absorb the impact.

Also agree with the alignment aspect.

Hes got stock sized wheels and tires he said, I doubt thats the issue. If its not slammed just get an alignment and ask for the printout to be sure. Also it wouldnt hurt to go back over the bolts to make sure they are tight. Sounds like bump steer to me.

Edit, is it painful if you hit a bump or dip at speed? Ie hitting bumpstops

Sounds like a combination of bump-steer and toe. Both can be caused by simply lowering the car and neglecting to compensate for these two items.

Not my words, but a reasonable explanation:

With toe out the car will oversteer at speed. The wheel will be constantly needing input to track in a straight line. Any bias to one side or the other sends the car in that direction.

With toe in you're plowing. This can be interpretted as under steer at speed. You'll still go where the wheel is pointed ..but at a reduced reponse to the amount of wheel input. http://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=563089