Can this be true? (M3 content)

The CBC reports that a, well, let's say "enthusiastic" motorist got stopped by the RCMP in Alberta for driving his M3 (year not given) down the highway south of Edmonton at 248 km/h (154 mph). The guy is 44, too, so not a punk kid (although arguably old enough to know better.)

Here's the thing: the CBC report quotes Wikipedia to the effect that "The BMW M3 is the only car ever to have earned more racing titles than the venerable Porsche 911 in Motorsport and the most successful touring, and grand touring car ever to have participated in racing." I checked W. myself, and that's indeed pretty much what it says.

But can this possibly be true? I mean, doesn't the 911 have about a 30-year head start, not to mention (i) high production numbers and (ii) very competition-oriented owners?

What says the hive?

The E30 and E36 M3s were dominant for two decades and are certainly the most successful touring cars ever raced but I have a hard time buying the 911 angle too. I mean, the 911 has won practically everything and often.

Quoting Wikipedia for anything is not what I would consider a reliable source. Now, if it lists sources for information, that's at least a step in the right direction. Check the footnotes and go from there. If it doesn't have any citations, well, that may offer some insight as to its validity.

Pretty low journalistic standards for a major news organization, if you ask me.

if it's an all 911 series does that count to the model's win?

Its got to be a specific style of racing. Other than stuff powered by, say, a small block Chev V8, its hard to imagine anything ever built that's won more races (in general) than a 911...or at least what we generally consider to be a 911.

Hmmm. I bet if you dug deep enough, there's been a metric assload of short track stock car races won by Camaros.

Streetwiseguy wrote: Hmmm. I bet if you dug deep enough, there's been a metric assload of short track stock car races won by Camaros.

I would be beside myself with joy if it turned out dirt trackers had made the Pinto the winningest racecar of all time.

Streetwiseguy wrote: Its got to be a specific style of racing. Other than stuff powered by, say, a small block Chev V8, its hard to imagine anything ever built that's won more races (in general) than a 911...or at least what we generally consider to be a 911. Hmmm. I bet if you dug deep enough, there's been a metric assload of short track stock car races won by Camaros.

And I bet there've been twice as many metric assloads of drag races won by either Mustangs or Camaros. :)

For things like this, one needs to define one's terms carefully.

Yeah, I checked Wikipedia for footnootes on that paragraph and there aren't any. We may be in the grip of whatever the Bavarian is for "fanboi." The CBC, to its credit, is indeed a reputable news organization, but I think we can all agree it's asking a lot for yer basic reporter to know what an M3 is, and going to Wikipedia is, or ought to be, a reasonable first step on the path to enlightenment. Just not this time.

I love the Camaro/Pinto angle on this, BTW!

i've never heard it stated so inclusively, but i've heard and read that numerous times as 'the winningest touring car of all time'

codrus wrote:

Streetwiseguy wrote: Its got to be a specific style of racing. Other than stuff powered by, say, a small block Chev V8, its hard to imagine anything ever built that's won more races (in general) than a 911...or at least what we generally consider to be a 911. Hmmm. I bet if you dug deep enough, there's been a metric assload of short track stock car races won by Camaros.

And I bet there've been twice as many metric assloads of drag races won by either Mustangs or Camaros. :)

Hell yes. I hadn't considered straight line stuff.

It wasn't that many years ago that Chevrolet passed Hudson as the winningest Nascar stocker of all time.

How many winning 911's are actually listed under body variation instead of 911. Carrera, GT3, 996, 997, 991, etc...
Would make it appear to be less than actually is.

codrus wrote:

Streetwiseguy wrote: Its got to be a specific style of racing. Other than stuff powered by, say, a small block Chev V8, its hard to imagine anything ever built that's won more races (in general) than a 911...or at least what we generally consider to be a 911. Hmmm. I bet if you dug deep enough, there's been a metric assload of short track stock car races won by Camaros.

And I bet there've been twice as many metric assloads of drag races won by either Mustangs or Camaros. :) For things like this, one needs to define one's terms carefully.

I don't believe Mustangs or Camaros measure their assloads using the metric system. I expect they are SAE assloads.

I bet the new ones are metric assloads

They're not winning circle track races!

Keith Tanner wrote: They're not winning circle track races!

Richmond is a circle.... (isn't everything NASCRAP runs on???)

.... and according to the sanctioning body... this is a Mustang....

As stated, it's pretty obviously some form of half truth being parroted without the appropriate context.

I like it when people say "...of all time". It's like saying "Hey, we went to the future and checked. The BMW M3 is the winningest touring car of all time".

I reminded of something Angry Corvair said on this forum a few years ago when someone quoted Wikipedia regarding an automotive topic. "This is good example of why Wikipedia is not substitute for actual knowledge on a subject"