Challenge budget question....repairs to B&S C4 ENGINE

A quick question about repairs and challenge budget. In the course of running the 2016 challenge, engine developed a bottom end noise. Sounds like a wrist pin problem. In the course of repairing this issue that arose after car was originally built are any non performance-enhancing parts to repair excluded from the budget? If while in there if I replace bearings etc are they excluded? What about gaskets needed to reassemble? Excluded? Understanding that non of replacement parts are performance enhacing....

So like I tried to suggest you can get a complete rebuild Kit for 100.00 Bucks or less, No you cannot Have a red ryder BB gun you will shoot your eye out. any way I thought all you had to do was Tighten or replace(if cracked and they do) the Flex plate since that is what the Banging Noise was.

Lol....you didn't tell me about flex plate. REALLY....????? Could it be a flex plate. Tell me more

It could be, my dad pulled a 350 for a "rod knock" and the flex plate was cracked around the crank hub

yep, they sound just like rod knock. They either crack at the torque converter bolt holes or around the crank hub, mine did both. It's the First thing I would check, $26 Pioneer replacement fixed my truck right up.

I would argue that replacement gaskets, bearings, and all do improve performance as they keep the engine running. If they don't count I imagine a lot of the engine work on my budget could be taken off.

Tripp, I want to belive that Gaskets and bearings DO NOT improve performance, Machine work Can but not always, Example; Hone cyl, square head or Square Block, seat valves,no

Mill Heads, Bore block past .030 or any size really past stock(requires pistons) Deck block, Larger Valves than Stock,those things do help performance, I can get these things done for next to free so not a big hit to me but they are performance enhancing.

just to keep it from Blowing up on track and causeing an Oil down should not be a budget hit.this could cause an uproar but lots of Folks here are using their cars after the Challenge and saftey items should also be exempt, when the Vette arrives it won't be towed In and I hope not towed out.

In reply to GTXVette:

I am not opposed to that being in the rules but close to half my budget was spent to build a reliable motor much of the same work that you said should not count. I am not opposed to that but it is a very different understanding than I had of the rules.

As for improved performance I have seen more than 1 challange car that would have improved performance by not having blown an engine. Just saying a car that runs is generally faster.

The big difference I see is being a part challange car getting it back to the condition it ran in before. However this can be stretched easily. I would then ask if I were to rebuild my trans with stock parts to help ensure that it actually shifts would that count?

I spoke to my Laywer about this,I belive we agree to Disagree.

When I was young,I raised enuff He-- at My Track about some Issues that they finally did see it my way. Just Because I won the Championship Race had little to do with it, By then everyone was doin' it. I was Outed for a distrubitor issue (Really)

I would think that the GRM staff would make an exception if you are doing just enough to bring a past challange car back but cannot speak on their behalf.

However not counting the basic gaskets machine work and bearings for rebuilding the engine I doubt would be allowed as a general practice.

If I am wrong I am happy to be another instance of following your lead because that will be a substantial change in my available budget to make tweaks to my challange car

As a point of reference...I had a part fail, asked if I could replace with a used piece that added no performance increase, and was told the repair had to be counted. I had to take other parts off to stay under budget. The rational given to me was that the original part was cheap because of its condition, and if it were in better condition (read - not about to break), it would have cost more. That was not the case, but the answer was I had to count it. Hope you make out better than I did. My hand was forced at the time because the event was too close to source cheaper parts.

Tripp, Yea I guess you know my 2017 deal, 2018 will be the year of the vette. and Honstly it's built mostly from used parts,I paid a grand for the vette and drove it home where most sane people would have called triple A,My little brother and I once pulled a corvair from Coconut Grove to Smyrna Ga. with a 20 foot logging chain,so that's who you are dealing with. I am a CHEAP SKATE and have lots of Junk and not much Money.

so I fix junk to work like I want with what I have, now I do have a grand in My engine but paid only 400.00 for the Long block that was supposed to be blown up( you all in water states know how Boat People can be). when you see what Isn't on the car you'll know how I recouped.

Wheels,  see I would have been all about your using a like part, that's being Thrifty not Cheating. If I blow a tire, I have Spares would that count against me. don't think I do not understand the Spirit of the event, but I want to be Proud of my car as well as Competitive. at the Moment But for the cost of 1 head Gasket I will be in at almost the 1000.00 class for 2017 by buying a former challenge car,Aka Easy Button

I kinda let the cat out of the bag here but for All concerned I would like to use the Number 9 If it Hasn't been assigned yet, But first I have to pay for the Car,then entry fee's, Thank's... John

GTXVette wrote: Tripp, Yea I guess you know my 2017 deal, 2018 will be the year of the vette. and Honstly it's built mostly from used parts,I paid a grand for the vette and drove it home where most sane people would have called triple A,My little brother and I once pulled a corvair from Coconut Grove to Smyrna Ga. with a 20 foot logging chain,so that's who you are dealing with. I am a CHEAP SKATE and have lots of Junk and not much Money. so I fix junk to work like I want with what I have, now I do have a grand in My engine but paid only 400.00 for the Long block that was supposed to be blown up( you all in water states know how Boat People can be). when you see what Isn't on the car you'll know how I recouped. Wheels, see I would have been all about your using a like part, that's being Thrifty not Cheating. If I blow a tire, I have Spares would that count against me. don't think I do not understand the Spirit of the event, but I want to be Proud of my car as well as Competitive. at the Moment But for the cost of 1 head Gasket I will be in at almost the 1000.00 class for 2017 by buying a former challenge car,Aka Easy Button

If you have a Gen 1 SBC, contact me. I probably have a dozen 7 series head gaskets. I have to use the 10 series.

Looking forward to seeing the vette at the challange.

My car I dragged out of someone's back yard and spent 4 years building it. Last few have been spent building up the family but hoping the Morris returns this year. I understand the blood sweat and tears that go into the challange cars.

Wheels, Thank you so much for the offer, this engine is a 3.4 6cyl, I will be Buying Jeremy''s(Pimpn3) Fiero for the 2017 challenge,that Hopefully only needs a head gasket and a tune. Ironicly his challenge number was 9 that year and mine was 9 when I raced,so that is what my request is about. see what you can do to help MOFO if you like, I have 75% of a set I can Gift him but the Head Gaskets are for a 305. the vette has a TD 454 BOAT Motor. MOFO hasn't asked but I am prepared to Pay it Forward, But I may Have to stop telling Folks how to make 'em turn, It took Many years and mucho money to figure out some stuff.

Tripp I have been working on the Vette for 2 years And the Engine is almost Done, the Body work Is the Hard Part for me with no help at all( Not even a body to hold stuff in Place) and if you saw Pics there are Lots of Mods and Molding Going on, Never Give Up.

Ya know I just realized How Badly I Jacked Jim's Thread, Sorry dude.

I blew up my freshly built engine 3 weeks before the 2016 Challenge. By pulling it and slapping in a cheap stock junkyard equivalent, I actually ADDED money to the budget, since the rebuild kit, cam, and other supporting mods were no longer on the car.

I agree with wheels777 here. It's cheap because of its condition. However if you had already rebuilt the engine and included it in the budget, blew it up, and replaced the rebuild kit with another rebuild kit, there is still just one rebuild kit on the car, so no budget change.

Thanks for the input guys. I have plenty of room in my budget to cover reasonably anticipated repairs. What scares me is if I get in there I'm running to the unforeseen problems. Guess I'll have to count repairs and cross the bridge of the unexpected when I get to it.

Like machineblau this years iteration of the Bolus & Snopes Corvette is going to allow me to take a few bucks out of the budget for what I'm removing from last year's entry. We're hoping to come back with a much more minimalist version. Interpret that anyway you like. LOL

In reply to Ovid_and_Flem:

Still betcha a certain Japanese 4 door beats you in the drags.

Stampie wrote: In reply to Ovid_and_Flem: Still betcha a certain Japanese 4 door beats you in the drags.

ARRRRRRGGGGHHHH.....MY ARCH NEMESIS HAS RETURNED!

maschinenbau wrote: I blew up my freshly built engine 3 weeks before the 2016 Challenge. By pulling it and slapping in a cheap stock junkyard equivalent, I actually ADDED money to the budget, since the rebuild kit, cam, and other supporting mods were no longer on the car. I agree with wheels777 here. It's cheap because of its condition. However if you had already rebuilt the engine and included it in the budget, blew it up, and replaced the rebuild kit with another rebuild kit, there is still just one rebuild kit on the car, so no budget change.

I don't necessarily agree with and/or endorse what happened to me. GRM has to rule on that and time remaining before the Challenge has to be considered. I only stated what happened so that the OP knows there is a little history to a similar situation, but in my case with far less time to recover.

Fortunately I think I have enough room in my budget to make necessary repairs barring running into something extremely major. The impetus behind my question was to hopefully free up a little money to deal with the Cosmetic side rather than the performance side. If push comes to shove I'll take performance over Cosmetics any day of the week.

In any event I don't have enough money in my budget to go to a 383 stroker motor which is what I really wanted.

there was poolside talk by some competitors of "hey if the HG blows the week after i buy it, the repairs aren't in my budget because i'm just returning it to 'as purchased' condition" or other similar situations.

i'm not sure i agree or disagree but coming from someone who has broken their challenge car not at the challenge and had to totally rethink it, i would err on the side of budgeting things. i blew HG at local autocross and in turn cracked both heads because i decided i was getting all my runs in. by the above reasoning new HG and heads and the associated hardware wouldn't be included because i was returning my engine to "as purchased condition" - but maybe that HG was on its way out already when i bought the engine. i chose to yoink the drivetrain, remove it from budget, and start over with new timeline and receipts(much like maschienbau).