If I was writing the rules, I'd make a blanket statement that any onboard computer or computer connected wirelessly to the car while on track needs to be in budget.
There is a thin line between a computer that data logs a car, and one that controls a car, and I don't think the staff is gonna want to police it.
If this is opened, I may be one if the first ones to abuse it (Tom, Rick and JG know what I am building). I'm just saying... 
Nope. Dongles are totally a fair loophole. But by the time you figure out a wireless link that will work on the autocross course, you’re going to wish you’d just bought a $25 computer.
Yes, that is a challenge.
Why not just make all computers free? Because that would effectively make all aftermarket ECUs free, because any modern laptop can run an engine if you’re talented enough. If the laptop is in the car on track, it’s in budget.
Robbie said:sleepyhead said:is hptuners the only way to datalog? are there other ways to grab the data onto usb/sd (arduino?) in csv/db and then suck into hptuners?
Just run saab t5/t7... datalog/tuning software is opensource!
I guess the question would be: "does the t5/t7 datalog format the output in a way that is easily converted to be readable by hptuners"
I don't know the answer to that question... what does a t5/t7 datalog look like? what about an hptuners log?
sorry Tom, if this is "off topic"... maybe V8kid should start a thread?
Tom Suddard said:Nope. Dongles are totally a fair loophole. But by the time you figure out a wireless link that will work on the autocross course, you’re going to wish you’d just bought a $25 computer.
Yes, that is a challenge.
Why not just make all computers free? Because that would effectively make all aftermarket ECUs free, because any modern laptop can run an engine if you’re talented enough. If the laptop is in the car on track, it’s in budget.
I agree. That's pretty clear.
And yes, I accept the challenge. 
Point of order...are concours judges going to be reviewing budget spreadsheets?
If so, expect one particular judge (who shall remain nameless) to be real busy.
I was actually planning to go the on board obd2 datalogging route before you guys even mentioned it. I just can't fit it in the budget.
I was planning to use one of these.
http://freematics.com/products/freematics-one/
I already own one and everything. Great minds think alike I guess.
It even has a 3 axis accelerometer.
Nope. Dongles are totally a fair loophole. But by the time you figure out a wireless link that will work on the autocross course, you’re going to wish you’d just bought a $25 computer.
Yes, that is a challenge.
Why not just make all computers free? Because that would effectively make all aftermarket ECUs free, because any modern laptop can run an engine if you’re talented enough. If the laptop is in the car on track, it’s in budget.
Damn, my dongle was in the budget last year.
But if he did it last week it would have been a tool, correct?
I just read through the Spec sheet? about the Dongle, I guess I must be Pretty Stupid because I only saw 1 or2 things I have Even heard of. I'm Old and guess I had best stick to a Carb and reading the plugs. ON THE OTHER HAND ,The Fiero I will bring next year Has a Mega Squirt W/ a Turbo so I'll Have a year to learn. I am Not Going to whine to get a more Level Field I'm just going to Climb up there with Ya'll
GTXVette said:
I just read through the Spec sheet? about the Dongle, I guess I must be Pretty Stupid because I only saw 1 or2 things I have Even heard of. I'm Old and guess I had best stick to a Carb and reading the plugs. ON THE OTHER HAND ,The Fiero I will bring next year Has a Mega Squirt W/ a Turbo so I'll Have a year to learn. I am Not Going to whine to get a more Level Field I'm just going to Climb up there with Ya'll
You need to spend an hour in our garage.....Fuzzy is teaching PaPa Old Dog new tricks......it hurts......I love me carbs....
Tom Suddard said:This is different from "haul it away and its yours" because he's explicitly trading unrelated labor for the car. It's no different from me owning a shed removal company, removing a shed, then buying a car off the property with the money I charged.
Maybe I should have been clearer in my original question. It is related because the lean to prevents the cars from being removed. As I was looking at the cars I gestured towards to the lean to and said that'll have to come out. That's when she said she wanted it out anyway ... that make it free labor?
Stampie said:Tom Suddard said:This is different from "haul it away and its yours" because he's explicitly trading unrelated labor for the car. It's no different from me owning a shed removal company, removing a shed, then buying a car off the property with the money I charged.
Maybe I should have been clearer in my original question. It is related because the lean to prevents the cars from being removed. As I was looking at the cars I gestured towards to the lean to and said that'll have to come out. That's when she said she wanted it out anyway ... that make it free labor?
Um, submit video of you removing a lean-to that is balanced precariously on a rusty Jeep and I will submit $20 to your challenge effort.
In reply to Stampie :
You're still wording it badly.
In your first post, you said "She implied that she would take removing it as trade towards the vehicles but if I were buying the vehicles I'd remove it anyway".
Therefore, they are unrelated.
"Mam, I'll give you $300 for those 2 cars." Period. Later, as a friend, you can volunteer to pull down the lean to. Perhaps in trade for a dinner for 2.
Come on, Stampie You know how to negotiate better than that! Lol!
FIRST, you offer to pay to haul her trash. THEN you come here and instead of giving us all the salicious details of your first date, somehow manage to twist the entire opportunity into a discussion of FMV for your own labor. Labor which SHOULD have been effectively applied to land your first date with the lady.
I am SO disappointed!
Alright, back to the exhaust firewall. This is was I was able to chop together tonight.
I'll be right up front, it is not air tight. All the Edges have at least some gaps as it is a *very* awkward area to work with. I could probably tighten the gaps up a little further with this piece if needed, but I don't think airtight is real feasible.
Also, are fire extinguishers required? Or just a good idea?
I thought I saw somewhere that if one is in, it needs to be in a metal mount, not plastic, but I can't find where I saw that.
In reply to SVreX :
I suck at negotiating. I even paid full asking price for my Challenge car.
Just for Fun .............. What IF Someone PAID You to Take a Car.
Stampie said:In reply to SVreX :
I suck at negotiating. I even paid full asking price for my Challenge car.
Umm... It was a $50 car!
Negotiating down from that (with a GRM member) would put you DEEP into "Shiny Happy Person" territory!!
I think it may have gotten lost a bit with the discussion of removing lean-to's and budgeting for laptops, so:
Does each line on the budget sheet need to be one individual part? Or should multiple part orders be a line and either list all the parts in the 'Item' field or just refer to the receipt?
For orders of multiple parts, how should the shipping costs be handled on the budget sheet? Proportional to the cost of the item ( {cost of item/total cost of order} * shipping cost )? Divided equally between all of the items in the order ( Shipping cost / # of items in order )? Asking because there were items in several orders that I won't end up using.
Thanks!
That firewall looks ok to me.
In reply to Stampie :
I'm so, so confused. I think there's a way to word the deal so it's a free car (or FMV if it's not a public offer). Try that and see how it feels.
And to clarify, dongles should be in budget, but only what's in the car during competition.
Ashyukun said:I think it may have gotten lost a bit with the discussion of removing lean-to's and budgeting for laptops, so:
Does each line on the budget sheet need to be one individual part? Or should multiple part orders be a line and either list all the parts in the 'Item' field or just refer to the receipt?
For orders of multiple parts, how should the shipping costs be handled on the budget sheet? Proportional to the cost of the item ( {cost of item/total cost of order} * shipping cost )? Divided equally between all of the items in the order ( Shipping cost / # of items in order )? Asking because there were items in several orders that I won't end up using.
Thanks!
I'm not sure if this is the approved way, but if multiple parts were in an order, I put it all on one line. In instances where I used some stuff from an order, but didn't use others, I distributed shipping costs and any discounts (yay Rock auto 5% coupon) based on the price of the items.
Since I'll be needing to take care of this shortly:
Are heavy-duty zip-ties an acceptable battery tie-down mechanism? Battery in question is not a full-size car battery, it's a smaller lawn tractor battery.
Ashyukun said:Since I'll be needing to take care of this shortly:
Are heavy-duty zip-ties an acceptable battery tie-down mechanism? Battery in question is not a full-size car battery, it's a smaller lawn tractor battery.
Ultimately, it's a judgement call on the part of the inspector. I've never seen an inspector OK with zip ties.
Technically, NHRA requires 3/8" threaded rod (I think). That would exceed any OEM setup, so obviously, they have some leeway.
I would not use zip ties. Or bungees, ratchet straps, string, coat hangers, vines, etc. It's too easy a problem to solve with a little bit of all-thread.
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