Civic Type R "Market Adjustments"

I was recently at a Honda dealer picking up some parts for my S2000 in the greater Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex. As I was waiting for the painfully slow parts guy to search for the parts I took a liking to the Championship White Type R sitting in the show room. I asked if I could climb around while I was waiting and they were more than happy to oblige. I really enjoyed the seats, interior feel, etc. I think they did an exceptional job compared to the Focus RS interior. Exterior looks are another thing. 

Anywho I wanted to play the numbers game at that point. They offered me well over what I paid on my S2000 which was a surprise for a potential trade-in. But then they presented a $15,000 "Market Adjustment." I said I'd give them MSRP and that was it. I was told all 12 Honda dealers in the DFW area are in an agreement to sell these with the same mark-up. 

I was told the timing chain tensioner was at another dealer down the road after that so I made my way over there where they had a CTR as well! Not as pretty in teh gray but still a beautiful car. Played the game with them (wife/kids aren't with me and I was bored). Same deal, they came down $10k on their market adjustment. 

What I'm getting at is I just don't get it. It's been a year now since it's released. Honda is steadily sending 400 units a month to the states and it's not like its a magical unicorn. I mean if I'm gonna pay $50k for a Honda it's going to have an Acura badge on it lol. Which they are heavily discounted the NSX right now. 

I remember when I was working for Honda 10 years ago and the CR S2000 came out. The dealer I worked for did the same thing and those CRs. $10k over MSRP. They sat on the lot for months (one for almost a year) before they finally slashed the price like $5k below MSRP and got them out of the showroom. 

Luckily having no car payments at the moment is really helping me keep my head on straight. 

/rant

From the dealer's perspective it probably makes sense. If they stand to make $2k (wild guess?) on a CTR sold at MSRP, selling even one at $15k over MSRP is worth a try, even if they then sell 5 more for $1k under MSRP.

A S2K CR came out late in the slow selling car's life cycle and wasn't a complete game changer. It kind of makes sense that they wouldn't sell well when over priced.

As long as foolish people are willing to pay these market adjustments, dealers will continue to try and get as much money as they can.

For what it's worth, you made the right call to walk.

No way in Hell would I trade an S2000 for a Type R, in any capacity. Those cars do nothing for me.

DirtyBird222 said:

I was told all 12 Honda dealers in the DFW area are in an agreement to sell these with the same mark-up. 

Isn't this collusion? I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

Will said:

DirtyBird222 said:

I was told all 12 Honda dealers in the DFW area are in an agreement to sell these with the same mark-up. 

 

Isn't this collusion? I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

Same thought over here.  Sounds like price fixing. Get him on camera then send to Honda. Get free car!!!

I can think of a lot better things to do with $50K.  Like, buy 200,000 gumballs.  

1. The dealer I bought my Pilot from told me they sold their first type R for sticker.  Even I asked them why not a $1000 or $2000 over?   

2. On the big car website a local dealer recently had one for sale at sticker so I sent them a note about it and I asked again on pricing. They added a few items like locking nuts and mud flaps.  Each item had a $2500 cost adding an extra $10,000 to the sticker.   Clowns  

Same junk that killed the Focus RS. 

Probably enough Honda fanbois to weather the storm on this though.

Unfortunately it's a cycle. Step 1, manufacturer decides to bring a vehicle people have been demanding to market. Step 2, dealership tries to charge 10k or more over MSRP, at the expense of sales. Step 3, manufacturer stops building said vehicle because it didn't sell good enough. Repeat. 

Lots of Focus RS' on dealer lots for less than MSRP near me now.  Not that long ago they were asking a premium...  Guess that didn't work out too well for them...

docwyte said:

Lots of Focus RS' on dealer lots for less than MSRP near me now.  Not that long ago they were asking a premium...  Guess that didn't work out too well for them...

There are here now as well. But I'm not plunking down that kind of money for something I can't test drive. 

When I test drove the SS 1LE back in December, I showed up helmet in hand and said I want to see if I fit with a helmet and I want to drive one. I will not be making a purchase today, and I'll be driving some other vehicles as well. Including an STi down the street.

They promptly got me the keys and off we went.

When VW brought the TDI Jetta back state-side in '09 after a brief hiatus, I ran into the market adjustment BS.  I found dealers firm on sticker, and/or adding ~$2500 to the sticker, and not budging.  I just cast a larger net, contacted every dealer within 300 miles of me, and started a bidding war for my business.  Wound up with the car $600 below invoice and free Bluetooth (used to be a dealer installed accessory).

I'm sure it had little impact on the salesman/dealership pulling the market adjustment line on me, but after I bought the car elsewhere, they got a stern letter from me, calling out the dealership's slimy practices, and loss of my business.  Made me feel better anyway.  I've bought 2 other VWs since then, and haven't even given them a chance for my business.  I tell everyone I know in the market for a VW to steer clear of them too. 

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine :

You beat me to it.  It is price fixing and I worked for a company once that got sued for it. 

My wife's co-worker's son bought one of the first ones here in CT.  He bought it from a Honda-owned dealership, and they couldn't sell it for more than MSRP.  They added every possible accessory, but they couldn't mark it up.  So if you're serious, I'd look for a corporate-owned dealership.

For fun per dollar I'd seriously look at an Si (WANT). It is a little down on power compared to the R, but it is also down on weight. And it is much less.... overstyled..... than the R. Also half the money, or less if you count the "market adjustment".

Just need to be willing to travel. Plenty of new type R's online for sale at sticker price. 

MazdaFace said:

Unfortunately it's a cycle. Step 1, manufacturer decides to bring a vehicle people have been demanding to market. Step 2, dealership tries to charge 10k or more over MSRP, at the expense of sales. Step 3, manufacturer stops building said vehicle because it didn't sell good enough. Repeat. 

I would ask our GRM hosts to print this out and hand copies to every industry rep they see at insider events... 

I stopped at a dealer when the PT Cruiser first came out and the one they had carried a market adjustment sticker.  

Yeah, that happened. 

dj06482 said:

My wife's co-worker's son bought one of the first ones here in CT.  He bought it from a Honda-owned dealership, and they couldn't sell it for more than MSRP.  They added every possible accessory, but they couldn't mark it up.  So if you're serious, I'd look for a corporate-owned dealership.

Which Connecticut dealership is owned by Honda?

Ian F said:

MazdaFace said:

Unfortunately it's a cycle. Step 1, manufacturer decides to bring a vehicle people have been demanding to market. Step 2, dealership tries to charge 10k or more over MSRP, at the expense of sales. Step 3, manufacturer stops building said vehicle because it didn't sell good enough. Repeat. 

I would ask our GRM hosts to print this out and hand copies to every industry rep they see at insider events... 

and also given to any dealership principles.  I mean if they wonder why people view them with suspicion and dread....

Dealers still aren't allowing test drives of the Focus RS'?  Really?  They're not new cars anymore.

I won't buy something without driving it first.  Back in '08 the Evo X was new and I was in the market.  Dealer wouldn't let me test drive one, despite me telling them no deal without it.  Their solution was for me to sign the sales contract, then drive the car.  Supposedly if I didn't like it, they'd rip up the contact.

I politely declined....

I ran into the no test drive issue when S2000s first came out.  Not sure that ever works to anyone's advantage.  I'd never buy a car without a test drive.

spitfirebill said:

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine :

You beat me to it.  It is price fixing and I worked for a company once that got sued for it. 

Sure, but I wouldn’t put much stock in something a random car salesman told you.