Close encounter with a Corvette

Got up close and personal with a corvette at the last track event (watch the bottom right corner) - *edit this is the advanced run group: open-passing, point-by optional
 

Here's a non-corvette smooshing lap, though still a bit slow.
 

Just from the limited amount of visibility of the Corvette there, I'm thinking he kinda made a late/divebomb-ish move for a trackday, right?

In reply to slowbird :

MMmm, I'd say it was probably 70-30 his fault to my fault. Maybe 60-40? I saw him coming up quick, but expected the pass after we'd apexed that corner and was concentrating on my line. It was a touch aggressive for an HPDE environment. We talked after, he said it was his fault, but I think I could've avoided the situation with a bit better awareness. 

In reply to accordionfolder :

That sounds like a fair assessment on both parts. Glad there wasn't any serious contact 

It's surprising how fast some of those guys close with you. There was a track prepped Viper at one of the TTs I ran this spring. I would would see him come around a corner a full straight behind me and the next time I checked the mirror he would be tucked in on my back bumper. Crazy fast. 

Track day passing should never be done without the lead car pointing first. I didn't see you point, so I'd put it entirely on the Vette driver.

In reply to DeadSkunk (Warren) :

This is the advanced group - open passing, no point by required with this particular organization. Most people wait for a point by and I give them readily, but this was just one of those times.

Open passing or not, it's his responsibility to make it by safely.  Fender to fender at the apex isn't making it by safely....

Even with our 'open passing' run groups, the expectation is that you will complete your pass before the braking markers, or at least before turn-in.

In reply to Rodan :

lol - if I had fenders or any body work we would have hit - he was between my wheels. Chalk one up for open wheel cars?

The corner worker came over during lunch and asked what color my pants were after that. 

Toyman01 said:

It's surprising how fast some of those guys close with you. There was a track prepped Viper at one of the TTs I ran this spring. I would would see him come around a corner a full straight behind me and the next time I checked the mirror he would be tucked in on my back bumper. Crazy fast. 

This. 

When I tracked at Hallett in my 1.6 Miata, I was always in the advanced group. The way Vette's/BOSS 302/Viper and other such vehicles can close on you is truly astounding. I never was dive bombed though. They knew they were blasting past me on exit.

I remember one particular time we were running Hallett backwards, going into the bus stop, I probably gained 6-7 car lengths under braking (very slow corner), right up on his bumper (my passenger was scared E36 M3less) I said, "Don't worry, he will be gone before you know it." And that he was.

That is awfully adult of you to accept responsibility like you are.   Although I’d put more than 60% on him.  But it sounds like a honest lapse of judgment and he is also taking responsibility.  

Good all around, especially since there was no contact!

In reply to z31maniac :

This group is really good usually - he was on a screamer of a lap and the red mist descended, it happens - so long as it's not a common occurrence I don't get too worked up.

No WAY do you take any blame for that. Open passing in an HPDE does NOT mean you can stick your nose in wherever the heck you feel like it. If you can complete a pass safely, then you can take it. That means you dont run inside someone's apex to force them off line for gosh sakes.

I think I know the org and have run a few times with them at Putnam. Everyone in my group was exceedingly accommodating taking passes on track out, or getting a door by before the end of the braking zone. It's an HPDE and dive bombing should be a strictly enforced NONO at "open lapping" HPDE days considering the difference in skill levels and car abilities.

In reply to accordionfolder :

If I were running the event, I'd understand that but I'd still have the guy sit a session out or bounce him to a lower group to show he understands what he SHOUOD do.

Olemiss540 said:

No WAY do you take any blame for that. Open passing in an HPDE does NOT mean you can stick your nose in wherever the heck you feel like it. If you can complete a pass safely, then you can take it. That means you dont run inside someone's apex to force them off line for gosh sakes.

I think I know the org and have run a few times with them at Putnam. Everyone in my group was exceedingly accommodating taking passes on track out, or getting a door by before the end of the braking zone. It's an HPDE and dive bombing should be a strictly enforced NONO at "open lapping" HPDE days considering the difference in skill levels and car abilities.

Hmm, I see what you guys are getting at, but I always view things like this in the light of: "wrecked is wrecked, no matter who's fault." So I think he probably shouldn't have dove in there, but if we'd hit - it being his fault would be a moot point. I suppose that's more what I'm driving at - I think I could've avoided the turn in with better awareness. Though I appreciate the backup on "primary fault." 

As for teleporting fast cars - ain't that the troof. He was putting down 550 whp and was on slicks, he might have as well been in a different dimension. I like driving with mixed traffic and open passing - it's like being in a 24 hour race or something.

accordionfolder said:

Hmm, I see what you guys are getting at, but I always view things like this in the light of: "wrecked is wrecked, no matter who's fault." So I think he probably shouldn't have dove in there, but if we'd hit - it being his fault would be a moot point. I suppose that's more what I'm driving at - I think I could've avoided the turn in with better awareness. Though I appreciate the backup on "primary fault." 

Certainly I agree that being aware of what's going on and reacting to prevent the idiots around you from causing damage to your car is a good thing.

That said, I'd agree that this was 100% his fault.  You just don't makes passes in open passing track day groups like that, at least not without a point-by so that you know for sure the guy you're passing has seen you.

Not gonna lie, there were a few frames where I saw a blue Corvette about to bonehole you and thought to myself "please dont be me please don't be me please don't be me."

In reply to JG Pasterjak :

Mr. Pasterjak, it would be an honor to be punted off the track by your big blue corvette.

....

Wait.

JG Pasterjak said:

Not gonna lie, there were a few frames where I saw a blue Corvette about to bonehole you and thought to myself "please dont be me please don't be me please don't be me."

You owe me a new phone and a refill on this coke.

accordionfolder said:

In reply to z31maniac :

This group is really good usually - he was on a screamer of a lap and the red mist descended, it happens - so long as it's not a common occurrence I don't get too worked up.

But, you can't win HPDE, or do we need to bring back the "I drive flat out" videos.

I just don't see the point and agree with others that is 100% on him for dive bombing at an HPDE. Open passing or not.

z31maniac said:

Toyman01 said:

It's surprising how fast some of those guys close with you. There was a track prepped Viper at one of the TTs I ran this spring. I would would see him come around a corner a full straight behind me and the next time I checked the mirror he would be tucked in on my back bumper. Crazy fast. 

This. 

When I tracked at Hallett in my 1.6 Miata, I was always in the advanced group. The way Vette's/BOSS 302/Viper and other such vehicles can close on you is truly astounding. I never was dive bombed though. They knew they were blasting past me on exit.

I remember one particular time we were running Hallett backwards, going into the bus stop, I probably gained 6-7 car lengths under braking (very slow corner), right up on his bumper (my passenger was scared E36 M3less) I said, "Don't worry, he will be gone before you know it." And that he was.

I assume that is turn 2 at Hallett?  I've been there several times, but never heard it referred to as the "bus stop."  But the way traffic can back up into a parade there, I would guess that's it.