DSM'S???

Seems like I used to see a lot of DSM's around, but see very few anymore. I know they are an "older vehicle" but I don't see them at shows or at races or autocrosses or in magazines much.

Has their popularity died down a bunch or what?

Just curious.

Chris

every 19 year old kid has one around here still.

half are running at any given time.

I still want a 1st gen, awd

belteshazzar wrote: half are running at any given time.

I'd call that generous...

They are still fairly popular around here, my brother has 2 actually. I hate those cars. Great motors, but they get so hot it just destroys everything else under the hood.

You do still see them occasionally in this area (Memphis) but I'm beginning to think that the whole "tuner/ricer" car ....thing(?) has started to die. Mitsu didn't help things when they "lost the plot" with the current Eclipse.

neon4891 wrote: I still want a 1st gen, awd

My brother might be selling his, if you're serious. It has a rebuilt engine, trans, and a new driveshaft, FMIC, big 16g, and a few other goodies.

chronic, constant timing belt problems. I wish I had a nickel for every one of those we have had through the shop in the past year. Even with the timing belt tensioned as tight as you can make it, they flop around like a low E on a string bass.

I will never own one. Never. Ever. Let's just say I don't even have to look up prices to quote DSM customers for a new engine or head.

Just hoe bad are the timing belt issues? I know the vast majority of people dont take timing belt replacement seriously, but then there are cars that have issues anyway (alfa 24v for example). Do they still break if they are replaced properly every 60k miles or whatever the recomended interval is?

The timing belt is a hard job to do right for most newbs ... so alot fail after they screw it up, and it's a major interference engine.

Keep them stock and they can be very reliable ... hoon them and you'll eventually do the tranny. Mod them and you'll eventually do the motor. Not to sound like an alfa guy but, damn when they are running well they are sweet, fast and fun!

.... I'm missing mine now!!

curtis73 wrote: I will never own one. Never. Ever.

the more associated you've been with their care the more likely you are to say something like that.

In 11 years of car sales, I can not think of a common vehicle that is more likely to have random catastrophic mechanical failure.

I've never noticed the timing belt failures to be excessively common. Regular maintenance and proper installation and they are fine. Don't get me wrong, I hate those cars, but it's not the timing belt.

Other belts, hoses, wiring, anything underhood is brittle by now. The turbo coolant lines run very near the manifold & turbo, as do the coolant lines for the oil cooler. They just have too many weak points, not just one major one.

Take my brothers latest DSM. The engine crankwalked, so he rebuilt it. 100 miles later the transmission shelled, so he rebuilt it, 500 miles after that the driveshaft carrier bearings went out, so he replaced that. Now the injector clips & underhood wiring is falling apart and it randomly won't start. He's had the car over 2 years, and still hasn't even hit the first oil change interval. He's not your typical slacker DSM owner either.

I have known a lot of people to have problems with these cars.

...also have a local friend who has been trying to get his DSM back on the road for about two years.

And he's been anal about owning it and was the original owner.

Chris

littleturquoiseb wrote: The timing belt is a hard job to do right for most newbs ... so alot fail after they screw it up, and it's a major interference engine. .... I'm missing mine now!!

haha bud of mine let the dealer do his T-belt... they clocked it 180 the wrong way... got a new top end out of it... apparently then they didn't get the HG on right... so they did the head another time... then engine still had problems... brought it back and they gave him a new bottomend... got a new engine for the cost of a t-belt job...

It has nothing to do with the proficiency of the timing belt installer, the factory hydraulic tensioner is super weak. I have tried to disable the tensioner and just set tension with the rotation of the pulley, but the angle is such that you can't get enough tension on it that way either.

In 94 they revised the tensioner mounting so that it eliminated a chronic oil leaking issue, but the internal design of the tensioner didn't change. Same old weak piston.

At high RPMs the short span between the cam pulleys gets as much as 1/2 - 3/4" vibe in it as the cams push back and forth on the belt. Take the top timing cover off and try it. Rev it up to 4k and watch that belt fly all around the place. Even when brand new they did that. Without enough tension on it they like to click a tooth one way or the other. Usually its the intake cam that retards one tooth, but thats only if you're lucky like a 4-leaf clover. Usually it just ends up chewing the teeth off the belt, then next thing you know - the crank pulley shears the teeth off and its done.

I have nothing against them, but there were made over here in Bloomington Illinois, so they are like a rash across Central Illinois.

Let's not forget balancer belts breaking and taking out the main timing belt. BUT I have one with 265K and one with 196K so it CAN be done.

EricM wrote: http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo152/43577/dsmdumpster.jpg I have nothing against them, but there were made over here in Bloomington Illinois, so they are like a rash across Central Illinois.

Lol, AMS. They're all over in Iowa too. I think they were popular around here because AWD/snow.

Now my brother has repaired all the disintegrating plugs and it starts but then stalls out in a few seconds. Looks like I get to spend my Saturday helping him diagnosing it.

I know the timing belts move around a lot, but I've never seen one break before it was due.

Here's another neat one from the area, a friend and I converted it from FWD to AWD after he blew up the diff at the drag strip. We got it done, and he took it to an auto-x, and the AWD tranny died on the way home. Too bad, it was quick, and it drew a good crowd at the auto-x.

.020 over stock rebuild, AMS GT35R kit, etc... after this last trans problem he wants to sell/part it and build an LS1 Miata.

Repost, but it's so funny I have to do it. This picture kills me.

I know nothing about DSMs, but they are getting kinda scarce around here too. And this is the sort of area where bad ideas go to die.

so did they cure the timing belt vibration in the Evo?

In reply to mad_machine:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but im pretty sure the 4g63 in the evo's are a bit different. right?

I know it is turned around from that in the original eclipse..

Keith wrote: Repost, but it's so funny I have to do it. This picture kills me. I know nothing about DSMs, but they are getting kinda scarce around here too. And this is the sort of area where bad ideas go to die.

I have a new backround pic now, thank you.

I had one, 1st gen awd with the 6-bolt...had it for about 300 miles before the Tbelt skipped and the pistons and the valves played patty cake

never again

EricM wrote: I have nothing against them, but there were made over here in Bloomington Illinois, so they are like a rash across Central Illinois.

So thats why I see them all the time. One of those cars I think is really cool, and would never want in my driveway