E46 M3 vs. E39 M5 vs. Cayman

I'm not a Porsche guy, so I wholly endorse an E39 M5 or (any) M3.

If I were a Porsche guy, I would certainly love to spend quality time with a Cayman. They certainly look nice.

Also, I'm told there is no substitute. Just try to keep it dry...

Tom Heath wrote: If I were a Porsche guy, I would certainly love to spend quality time with a Cayman. They certainly look nice.

See, I don't even think they look that nice. I just like the idea of a modern, mid engine Porsche with a solid roof.

Even the base model comes with better brakes than 99% of the cars on the market today.

I no longer desire a convertible, otherwise I'd save a lot of cash and get any one of the zillion Boxster S's on the market.

I have not driven either of the BMW's, but after driving a Cayman S, I cannot imagine either one comparing...

Keith wrote:

BigD wrote:

joepaluch wrote: I have an E39 530. No M5, but it is really a sedan. Sporty yes, but not a sports car by any means.

FWIW, don't judge the M5 by any other E39. Everything up to and including a 540 with any kind of sport package feels like a soft wallowy barge. The M5 is on a different planet.

This is true. I had a chance to spend significant time in an E39 540i Sport 6-speed before driving the M5. The 540i was deemed an "old man's car" by my wife, who loves her M5.

Certainly a M5 is faster and "hairy chested", but my 530 has the sport suspension and with 6 cyl gets rack and pinion steering. This means is very well balanced and quite sporting in the turns. Sure it will lack in hp and ultimate grip, but still shows how strong the basic chassis is. Still it is a 4 door 4 person car. Hp can mask weight under acceleration, but not during braking or cornering.

If you need a 4 door "sensible sedan" with wild side the M5 is great. My little 6 cyl is a "sensible sedan" with a "sweet balance".

A cayman is proper sports car with enough space and comfort to be used daily. Every old Porsche should end up being a track car. That is where Porsche's belong.

BMW are steet cars that unlike most cars can take track duty. The E39 M5 is made for 150 mph Autobahn runs and the occasional back road drive.

Cayman S is on my bucket list. There is something so right about a midengined hatchback

I've driven two base Caymans. I would be perfectly satisfied with one of those.

Woody wrote:

Tom Heath wrote: If I were a Porsche guy, I would certainly love to spend quality time with a Cayman. They certainly look nice.

See, I don't even think they look that nice. I just like the idea of a modern, mid engine Porsche with a solid roof. Even the base model comes with better brakes than 99% of the cars on the market today. I no longer desire a convertible, otherwise I'd save a lot of cash and get any one of the zillion Boxster S's on the market.

Woody, don't rule-out a Boxster if these are still available:

http://www.porscheplayground.com/files/9df5f1a944c4d3c649f485d2decef746-13.html

Ooops, a quick search suggests that company may be OOB.

Oh, I know about Zeintops, in fact I think I've started two threads here on them. There are a few available for about three grand. But since most of my street cars eventually become track cars, I'd like to start with a stiffer Cayman.

Plus, you have to paint and ship the Zeintop, though a black one would probably transfer nicely onto any color Boxster.

I love the boxster, but don't like convertables. It is one reason I will not replace my 944 Turbo S with one. I would really love a boxster spyder, but I can't afford one and I know would grow to hate the open topped aspect pretty quick. So for my Cayman R is nicer... Stil no money to buy one so no dice.

Old boxsters are in nice price range, but despite how nice the chassis I just don't like open topped cars. So I keep may be one day I will consider Cayman S, but right now they are still to pricey for me. A base Cayman is aood car, but since my Turbo has 250 hp right now I don't know how much I would feel the 245 hp of the 2.7L cayman. Probably not like it so I am waiting for a Cayman S one day. Then again I have a 5 year old and I falling in love again with the 2+2 aspect of my rear seats. Useless for adults, but perfect for "little people". Hmm might be keeping my Turbo S for 10 more years. As by 15 I will figure she will out grow my rear seats and an Porsche rear seats so a 2 seater might be perfect then. Plus I could probably fined a Cayman old enough that I could afford it.

pigeon wrote: Re the M5 - give yourself 9 minutes and enjoy this: The Hire - Star

Thank you.

I vote Cayman S. What's cooler than driving around a car named after something that's night quite an Alligator and not quite a Crocodile?

I spent last week with a Boxster Spyder--kinda like a Cayman S with a soft top. Wow. Amazing autocrosser, too. Best I can describe it is like a big Miata. I have run both the regular Cayman and Cayman S on track. This probably sounds silly, but there was something nice about the "base," five-speed Cayman. I wouldn't kick an S out of bed, but the regular car was just nice, and I mean that in a good way. A good friend has a Cayman S and just loves it.

E46 M3? Also love it, but it's a bigger, heavier car than the Cayman. On track that engine wails, and the E46 3 series might be just the right size for daily use. The issue that's in the mail right now also has some M3 track setup tips courtesy of James Clay. And yes, he addresses the engine bearing issue. It seems like all great cars have that one lurking problem. Do you let it eat you up or just enjoy life?

We borrowed an E39 M5 while out in Denver--this is when the cars were brand-new. Holy cow, it did nearly everything. It could storm up a mountain road and also carry the whole crew around. It is a big car, though. I'm not saying that's good or bad, but it's not like the Cayman--or even the E46. It's like a German Impala SS, and I also mean that in a good way.

Honestly, all three are great cars, but you have to drive them. I'm also in the car research/shopping mode. If it were my money

oldsaw wrote:

Woody wrote:

Tom Heath wrote: If I were a Porsche guy, I would certainly love to spend quality time with a Cayman. They certainly look nice.

See, I don't even think they look that nice. I just like the idea of a modern, mid engine Porsche with a solid roof. Even the base model comes with better brakes than 99% of the cars on the market today. I no longer desire a convertible, otherwise I'd save a lot of cash and get any one of the zillion Boxster S's on the market.

Woody, don't rule-out a Boxster if these are still available: http://www.porscheplayground.com/files/9df5f1a944c4d3c649f485d2decef746-13.html Ooops, a quick search suggests that company may be OOB.

There was one recently on Ebay

Zeintop on Ebay

David S. Wallens wrote: I have run both the regular Cayman and Cayman S on track. This probably sounds silly, but there was something nice about the "base," five-speed Cayman. I wouldn't kick an S out of bed, but the regular car was just nice, and I mean that in a good way.

I agree with this, and not just because I'm cheap. I'm just drawn to the base car for some reason. Maybe it's because I have an aversion to in dash navigation systems, which all S's seem to be cursed with, or maybe it's the proper black faced gauges, as opposed to the S model's tacky white gauge faces.

White faced gauges were seriously cool on the 1990 Maxima SE, but it's over, all right? It's like having loud pipes on your Harley in 1988; you were a total badass for about a year, now it's just annoying. And besides, your an accountant...

David S. Wallens wrote: Honestly, all three are great cars, but you have to drive them. I'm also in the car research/shopping mode. If it were my money

Seriously, you're going to leave all of us hanging like that?!

When will the latest issue hit newsstands? I'm ashamed to admit that my subscription isn't current

Just to confuse you further, the G8 GXP is supposed to be comparable to an M5, and I mean the E60 M5

http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2009/04/il-track-tested-2009-bmw-m3-sedan-vs-2009-pontiac-g8-gxp.html

Just saying

A Zeintopp Boxster sounds like fun to me, but you are right about the stiffness thing. The Boxster is stiffer than a 997 Cabrio...but the Cayman is TWICE as stiff as a Boxster. Does that mean a Cayman is stiffer than a 997 carrera?

A bit pricey, but it will smoke a 997...

What's a reasonable price for a Cayman in the states? All over 36K up north. The M5 has held my interest for a very long time.

Woody wrote: White faced gauges were seriously cool on the 1990 Maxima SE, but it's over, all right? It's like having loud pipes on your Harley in 1988; you were a total badass for about a year, now it's just annoying. And besides, your an accountant...

Ha! My parents had one of those early-'90s Maximas--back when 190 horsepower was a ton of power. It even had the 4DSC stickers on the rear quarter windows.

I wish I could put my finger on what appealed to me so much about the base Cayman, but that car definitely left an impression. Maybe it was the simplicity.

I admit that the other two on your list are cool, too. I think it comes down to your needs. Do you have to carry stuff? Carry people? Or are you looking for a hardtop alternative to a Miata?

And the Zeintop Boxster is neat, but I have only seen one in person. It's like a 986 Cayman.

What's funny is that I'm usually all for the convertible. With the Cayman/Boxster, I might go for the hardtop. Might....

If you need 4 doors, an E36 M3 sedan punches a lot of tickets. I'm very close to selling my '92 S4 in favor of a '98 M3 sedan...

aussiesmg wrote: Just to confuse you further, the G8 GXP is supposed to be comparable to an M5, and I mean the E60 M5

Yeah, but you have to find one first.

pigeon wrote:

David S. Wallens wrote: Honestly, all three are great cars, but you have to drive them. I'm also in the car research/shopping mode. If it were my money

Seriously, you're going to leave all of us hanging like that?! When will the latest issue hit newsstands? I'm ashamed to admit that my subscription isn't current

Life's too short to live in shame.

Tom Heath wrote:

pigeon wrote:

David S. Wallens wrote: Honestly, all three are great cars, but you have to drive them. I'm also in the car research/shopping mode. If it were my money

Seriously, you're going to leave all of us hanging like that?! When will the latest issue hit newsstands? I'm ashamed to admit that my subscription isn't current

Life's too short to live in shame.

cough....T shirt promo code...cough

In reply to Woody:

Just make it two years or longer and the T-shirt is F-R-E-E. That spells free.