Weigh it however you want, just be really really descriptive of what it is, what was on it, whats in it, and how you weighed it.
Weigh it however you want, just be really really descriptive of what it is, what was on it, whats in it, and how you weighed it.
Mikey52_1 wrote: You COULD weigh the iron ore before it gets milled, but there's a lotta stuff needed to make it go zoom. I vote for ready-to run, minus A/C.
When I'm interested in a swap... or building a race car - I don't care if it has a XXX amp alternator.
If wanted to know how much the alternator weighed I would ask "Say, pal... how much does that alternator weigh". If he said... "well its 470lbs including the engine onna conna its useless without it" I'd imagine myself punching him in the throat over and over and over again.
You guys are illustrating really well why it's so hard to find a good engine weight database.
And it ALSO illustrates how the description of the weighed engine should read. But yeah, it's ....ummm...hard to find reliable numbers. Best one I ever saw was in a Kennedy Engineered Prodoucts brochure. THAT was concise! But can I find it NOW??? Nooo! That would be too simple.
i'd be happy with an engine pulled from a running car with trans and accessories removed. so for me:
with water pump, valve covers, intake (often few aftermarket options), throttle body, fuel rail/injectors, onboard thermostat, stock balancer/pulley, probably starter, even flywheel/flexplate (so long as its specified which, usually its weight is available info seperately)
withoutPS pump, alternator, a/c garbage, exhaust manifolds (often lots of aftermarket options but i'd forgo losing this one for ease of measurement, especially w/turbo) remote oil parts, radiator hoses, carburetor if equipped, anything before the throttle body
Well, if a reputable magazine were to compile a database, no reason you can't have three columns: block only, dressed block (waterpump, valve covers, intake, etc), full dress (include p/s, a/c, etc). Since you'd most likely turni it loose for the Internet to fill in, no reason not to have all the options. :D
Weights should be as ready to run on a dyno, completely DRY. You don't need alternators, power steering pumps, AC compressors, flexplates/flywheels, starters, etc. If it has to be bolted on extra, it shouldn't be included, this includes headers/exhaust manifolds. Basically, if it can end in personal preference not required to run, it isn't included in the weight.
Brian
The reason I excluded the items I did is because you can get ones that weigh less than stock.
a small block chevy motor came from the factory with at least 40 different alternators, different intake manifolds, different exhaust manifolds, different flywheels, different starters, harmonic balancers, etc.. all with different weights.
internetautomart wrote: The reason I excluded the items I did is because you can get ones that weigh less than stock.
So you can get light weight spark plugs and plug wires?!? I'd say to even omit things like oil pans and other covers is kind of silly, those are almost always negligible weight compared to the longblock. If you're getting lightweight oil pans, you're running out of lightness to add to a vehicle. About all that's left at that point is going without socks and underwear when you drive.
Bryce
internetautomart wrote: The reason I excluded the items I did is because you can get ones that weigh less than stock. a small block chevy motor came from the factory with at least 40 different alternators, different intake manifolds, different exhaust manifolds, different flywheels, different starters, harmonic balancers, etc.. all with different weights.
And as I pointed out:
Not everyone is looking for a SBC, BBC, SBF, BBF, SBM, or BBM. People might want a Toyota V8, or a BMW 6, maybe a Jaguar 12. Many of which, don't have nearly the same aftermarket, especially for things like oil pans and valve covers. When weighing an engine with aftermarket parts like those, it'd be easier to just cite it, and then people know how much a SBC 350 with aluminum heads from this manufacturer, with ARP studs, and special valve covers weighs. Thus you then have a much more direct comparison to say, a stock Toyota 1UZ-FE
No exhaust manifolds is stupid. What are you supposed to do with a factory turbo motor?
FYI, there's an "industry standard" in the military. It's everything needed to get that motor to run. So:
Note that there's nothing north of the throttle inlet or aft of the manifolds and there's no flywheel, PS pump, alternator,or A/C.
The idea is this engine can be put in place of another engine, hook up the wires and fluids and power transfer (transmission, generator, whatever) and it will magically start up.
Some sort of flywheel is essential. Starting and on some timing.
I can understand why you'd take off the factory exhaust manifolds - in almost every engine conversion, you'll change those for either a (lighter) tubular setup or for something different in order to make it fit.
On a car with a serpentine belt, you probably can't install the belt without the PS pump, alternator and possibly AC compressor.
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