EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 3:53 p.m.

I have a friends 2010 evo X here. I am trying to avoid towing it up to his house so I would like to get it started. 

It was at a rallycross and died after hitting a bump, now it won't crank. When the key is turned to crank it the dash lights dim. 

It will not push/bump start. I towed it behind my truck and the engine will turn over when dumping the clutch but it will not fire. 

The battery is good, there is (good) power to the distribution box under the hood and the starter does have power (I have not measured the voltage at the starter). 

The fan runs with the ignition on (the defrost and A/C is turned off). 

The wires for the O2 sensor under the car are ripped off and bare but have been like that for a long time. One forum post (on the evo forums) suggested that the bare wires can short and the O2 circuit is not fused so it can fry the ECU. That is a possibility but they have been like that for at least a year. There was no resolution to that thread. 

All fuses test good. 

 

Anyone versed in mitsubishi/evo things to suggest what to try next?

 

Knurled.
Knurled. GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 4:31 p.m.

There was a rallycross?

 

--

 

If the dash lights dim, that means the starter is trying to do something and failing at it.  Check the voltage when cranking, that needs to stay over 9 volts minimum.  Don't check the voltage at the battery, check the voltage on the starter and engine block, or fuse box and engine block.  A bad cable will also do this.

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 4:37 p.m.

It was the Fort Wayne Brian special event. 

Voltage at the battery positive junction box thingy under the hood is 11.3ish while trying to crank. I did not check it at the starter because it is a pain to get at. I stopped checking bad cables to the starter after it failed to start while pulling it behind my truck thinking there is something else amiss. 

Someone on an unhelpful Evo forum said that if the fan is running with ignition on then the ECU is bad. I have not found anything to substantiate this claim. 

cmcgregor
cmcgregor Dork
11/24/19 4:41 p.m.

Far from an expert but do these have a rollover sensor?

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 4:43 p.m.

In reply to cmcgregor :

Another Evo friend suggested that a crash sensor had triggered. I have not found anything with a quick search indicating that they have anything that would cause it to not start due to a suspected collision but haven't dug too far into it yet. 

Knurled.
Knurled. GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 4:57 p.m.

Does the Check Engine light come on key on/engine off?  If it does not, get your towin' shoes on.

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 4:59 p.m.

It does, along with pretty much every other service reminder imaginable. 

I need to find my OBD2 scanner to see what codes it has. I imagine it will overheat as all the stored trouble codes try to escape. 

Knurled.
Knurled. GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/24/19 5:07 p.m.

That's either a good sign, because it means the computer is powering up and booting up to some degree, or it's a bad sign, because it's not something as easy to fix as a loose PCM ground or something.

 

 

Vigo
Vigo MegaDork
11/24/19 9:04 p.m.

If voltage is dropping from normal (~12.6v)  all the way to 11.3 during cranking, that means the solenoid is engaging and the motor itself is just failing to turn.  Have you tried to turn the motor by hand? Turning the engine through the clutch just means it's easier to turn than the clutch is strong, which on an evo might be 400+ lb ft. It doesn't mean it's ok! If a socket on the crank reveals that the engine turns ok, I would just put a starter in it and diagnose the no-start from there. Trying to diagnose a no-start while ALSO not being able to crank is just extremely inefficient. If the solenoid is engaging and the motor itself is pulling enough current to drop a good battery to 11.3 that's a pretty good sign that the 3 things the starter needs to be ok (small + wire, big + wire, big - wire) are well enough hooked up to at least pass hundreds of amps of current, which suggests it's just a bad starter. 

eastsideTim
eastsideTim UberDork
11/24/19 9:11 p.m.

Starter relay get knocked a bit loose from it's socket in the fuse box?

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
11/24/19 9:52 p.m.

Take the belts off and make sure you haven't jammed the alternator or A/C compressor solid.

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/25/19 6:50 a.m.
Vigo said:

If voltage is dropping from normal (~12.6v)  all the way to 11.3 during cranking, that means the solenoid is engaging and the motor itself is just failing to turn.  Have you tried to turn the motor by hand? Turning the engine through the clutch just means it's easier to turn than the clutch is strong, which on an evo might be 400+ lb ft. It doesn't mean it's ok! If a socket on the crank reveals that the engine turns ok, I would just put a starter in it and diagnose the no-start from there. Trying to diagnose a no-start while ALSO not being able to crank is just extremely inefficient. If the solenoid is engaging and the motor itself is pulling enough current to drop a good battery to 11.3 that's a pretty good sign that the 3 things the starter needs to be ok (small + wire, big + wire, big - wire) are well enough hooked up to at least pass hundreds of amps of current, which suggests it's just a bad starter. 

I did get the starter to spin jumping the terminals on the solenoid with a screwdriver but it did not kick out. 

I have not tried turning the engine by hand yet. 

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/25/19 6:50 a.m.
eastsideTim said:

Starter relay get knocked a bit loose from it's socket in the fuse box?

I switched the relays around and made sure they were seated but no change. 

Knurled.
Knurled. GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/25/19 7:03 a.m.
Streetwiseguy said:

Take the belts off and make sure you haven't jammed the alternator or A/C compressor solid.

Have seen this a couple times, too.  Starter won't turn the engine, just sort of lug.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
11/25/19 7:09 a.m.
EvanB said:

In reply to cmcgregor :

Another Evo friend suggested that a crash sensor had triggered. I have not found anything with a quick search indicating that they have anything that would cause it to not start due to a suspected collision but haven't dug too far into it yet. 

Is there a fail-safe that kills the fuel pump in an impact? 

I know my '89 Escort GT I had at 16 had this. I got into an accident, the impact tripped the breaker for the fuel pump so the car wouldn't start. I reset the switch on the top of the fuel pump and it fired right up.

Vigo
Vigo MegaDork
11/25/19 10:55 a.m.

I did get the starter to spin jumping the terminals on the solenoid with a screwdriver but it did not kick out. 

I have not tried turning the engine by hand yet. 

Most starters use the physical movement of the solenoid to both electrically connect the motor AND lever out the gear, so if you jumped across the two big terminals you bypassed the solenoid without activating it, which means spinning motor but no gear popout. 

EvanB
EvanB GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/25/19 4:34 p.m.

Today I verified that the engine turns with a ratchet on the crank. 

I tried two different OBD scanners and neither will connect. I think this one is getting towed home soon. 

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