This is a versus thread but not like you would think
The new beetle and 500 both share something very much in common other than retro.
The originals the engines were in the rear of the car and rear wheel drive. The new ones are front engined front wheel drives. Given the mass market packaging of FWD, why would they nor just put the stuff in the back? Similar to how GM did the Fiero. Lotus did it well with their new lineup. It also leaves that front as a massive cargo area.
Ideas, comments, agreements?
Handling and commonality with other platforms. One is a Golf, the other is a Punto.
The average driver is used to a FWD car these days, while RWD was most common when the originals were out. Though it's certainly not impossible to take a FWD drivetrain and put it in the back of another car. The Fiero, as pres589 said, or the MR2. I was always amused whenever I'd open the engine lid of my AW11 and see the "Toyota 1600" printed on the valve cover "upside down." It was meant to be read from the front of a FWD car.
If VW or Fiat were intending the Beetle or 500 to be sports cars, the MR arrangement would be worth considering. But most people interested in cute looking retro daily drivers aren't looking for zippy handling response you can only get in a car that doesn't have the engine in front.
It also complicates cooling, either running lines all the way to the front of car and back to a radiator or putting silly scoops in the side of the car to direct cooling air into the middle of the car, and stuff like the brake booster still has to go up front. And I know an MR2 has electric power steering to eliminate having to run power steering lines all the way up front...
I don't see how most of these issue really complicate anything
Cooling is the maybe.
electric power steering & water pumps (for scale-able size and to compensate for the extra piping) and power break assist are all very common now. Nothing but off the shelf parts would be needed.
I think (dangerous I know) the big issue is common platforms. Neither are unique. Sad really. With the high hp/weight packages we are getting now in FWD cars a new MR2/Fiero/SHOgun would just be a hoot.
SVreX
UltimaDork
3/31/12 7:48 p.m.
Common platform.
VW didn't design the FWD water cooled bug to be anything. They designed the Golf to be a continued FWD offering, then forced the Beetle shape onto it.
also remember the fiat used a small 2 cylinder and the bug was an aircooled flat 4.. both lightweight and light HP engines...
now take a heavy watercooled engine with some real HP and drop it into the back.. it would oversteer right to the nearest lawyers office.
I remember a few years ago on a Hyundai forum.. there was a kid who bought a rear drive car.. a couple of weeks later he was back saying how RWD should be illegal after he spun it in the rain. He was adament that RWD was dangerous
mad_machine wrote:
also remember the fiat used a small 2 cylinder and the bug was an aircooled flat 4.. both lightweight and light HP engines...
now take a heavy watercooled engine with some real HP and drop it into the back.. it would oversteer right to the nearest lawyers office.
I remember a few years ago on a Hyundai forum.. there was a kid who bought a rear drive car.. a couple of weeks later he was back saying how RWD should be illegal after he spun it in the rain. He was adament that RWD was dangerous
Reminds me of this.
I get the cost/common platform thing. Handling not so much. I know about the idiots out there.
When I worked at Carmax I told a fellow associate not to sell a car to some people for their kid. The parents bought a Terminator Stang for their 17 year old son.
Two weeks later he was on the front page, dead. I firmly blame the parents. The sales consultant took a week off and sought counseling.
You can't fix stupid. BMW, Ford, Chevy, Lotus, Porsche, Hyundai, Dodge,Nissan, now Toyota (again) and finally (in the US market, they have had them for a long time in Japan) Subaru. all have rear drive cars. Just takes some work tuning them for safe handling.
In the end I know my answer is $, and that's a shame. I guess we will just have to see if more interesting cars come to market by companies willing to take a risk.
