I am taking some training at work and my teacher was the quality engineer for Fiero project at GM.
She mentioned it was the highest quality vehicle GM had ever produced up to that point.
I asked her what the definition of quality was...
She laughed
I am taking some training at work and my teacher was the quality engineer for Fiero project at GM.
She mentioned it was the highest quality vehicle GM had ever produced up to that point.
I asked her what the definition of quality was...
She laughed
I liked my 88 GT shrugs
Remember the Top Gear eposode when they filled the three cars with water? The Fiero held the water the best so that's gotta mean something......right?
But the Roadmaster still won.
i'm sure the fiero was pretty high quality at the time. by then they had put those chevette parts into just about everything and practice makes perfect!
Yeah, I thought all the problems with the Fiero came from marketing and management, and that by the time the got the car built the way they originally intended it, GM killed it because it was within striking distance of outperforming the Corvette (and would've with the engines slated for the 2nd gen).
Typical nameplate protection, just like Porsche does with the 911 and Ford does with the Mustang.
The Fiero could have been almost an exotic if they did it right. Makes me sad that GM killed it just when they could have got it altogether. Typical GM. No wonder they needed a bail out.
can't overshadow the top dog...
TR8owner wrote: The Fiero could have been almost an exotic if they did it right. Makes me sad that GM killed it just when they could have got it altogether. Typical GM. No wonder they needed a bail out.
Agreed... even the base 2nd gen Fiero with the Quad-4 motor would've been a kickass little car.
ReverendDexter wrote:TR8owner wrote: The Fiero could have been almost an exotic if they did it right. Makes me sad that GM killed it just when they could have got it altogether. Typical GM. No wonder they needed a bail out.Agreed... even the base 2nd gen Fiero with the Quad-4 motor would've been a kickass little car.
I second this motion.
I've bench built a Fiero with an early quad four before, but I always remember the build quality, and the fact that you look like a tool driving one.
My boss was almost killed in one, and when he hears mention of one, he calls them "fire-eros" since he was trapped in one on fire for about 30 minutes plus.
itsarebuild wrote: i'm sure the fiero was pretty high quality at the time. by then they had put those chevette parts into just about everything and practice makes perfect!
that was only the front suspension- the rear suspension was the front suspension from a Citation..
world class stuff..
Definition of quality
"built to design specification."
hence the laugh, because it was built to spec, but the spec was E36 M3.
The car was originally designed to be a cheap commuter car, then someone saw it and said "hey that is a sports car." then came the pushing and the rest is history.
She said they got all the bugs out of it, the year before they killed it.
Typical GM.
actually it started out as a world class car sports car and only made it to production because it was sold to GM management as a econo car by Pontiac.. It was the only way GM would let them build the car..
That car really has some interesting history....
http://yellowfiero.com/thefiero/index.php
The Commuter Sports Car
In 1978, Pontiac's Advanced Engineering group, headed by Turkish-born Hulki Aldikacti, again proposed an inexpensive plastic-bodied sports car, analogous to the long-defunct Banshee concept. The proposal added a new wrinkle: a mid-engine drivetrain, something that was becoming virtually de rigueur for serious sports cars.
New general manager Robert Stempel and chief engineer Robert Dorn, an ex-racer, both liked the idea, but they were not confident about its prospects. The corporation had previously rejected proposals for a mid-engine Corvette, and with ever-increasing federal emissions and Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) standards, new sports cars were not on the menu. Bob Dorn pointed out, however, that if the two-seater could be built cheaply, with a fuel-efficient four-cylinder engine, it could help Pontiac meet its CAFE targets.
Late that year, Stempel and Dorn presented the idea to senior management, presenting it not as a sports car, but as a cheap, two-seat commuter vehicle capable of up to 50 miles to the gallon (4.7 L/100 km). The stratagem worked, and the project, known as the P-car, received preliminary approval — ironically, from Pete Estes, who had become president of General Motors in September 1974. Bob Dorn assigned Hulki Aldikacti as the P-car's project manager and chief engineer, and told him to proceed.
The Art of Compromise
Effective as it was, the sleight of hand involved in the P-car's approval was something of a devil's bargain. The total budget for the program was set at only $410 million, including plant retooling, a very modest sum for an all-new model, even then.
With such a limited budget, Aldikacti decided his best bet was to sequester the P-car from the normal Pontiac organization. Most of the engineering development was done at an outside firm, Engineering Technology Ltd. (ENTECH) of Troy, Michigan. The design of the P-car, meanwhile, went not to John Schinella's Pontiac Two studio, but to the Advanced Design Three studio, run by Ron Hill. Keeping the P-car out of the normal development channels allowed Aldikacti to control costs and limit bureaucratic delays and interference. Less happily, it also reflected the project's marginal status within the division.
The budget quickly squelched any ambitions Aldikacti had of making the P-car America's answer to the Ferrari Dino. Developing a unique engine, for example, would have exceeded the project's total budget, as well as pushing the P-car over its target price. Aldikacti had little choice but to use existing components, drawn from GM's parts bin.
The corporation's principal objection to mid-engine design was that it required a rear transaxle and independent rear suspension, both of which were expensive. In 1978, however, GM was readying a new crop of low-cost, front-wheel-drive X-cars (the Chevy Citation/Pontiac Phoenix, et al) for the 1980 model year. Aldikacti and the engineers at ENTECH realized that if they rotated the MacPherson strut front suspension and transaxle from the X-cars 180 degrees, they could use them in the rear of the P-car with fairly minor modifications. The P-car's front suspension, meanwhile, was borrowed from the subcompact Chevrolet Chevette. This kludge of existing pieces was cheap, but far from ideal.
Aldikacti had dreams of a high-revving, all-aluminum V6, but the budget and the ambitious fuel economy target made that impossible. Early on, the P-car was intended to have a 1.8 L (112 cu. in.) four, probably the GM 122 engine later used in the 1982 J-cars (Chevrolet Cavalier/Cadillac Cimarron/et al). Later, when the project budget shrank even further, the fuel economy target was relaxed, and the 1.8 L was replaced by the familiar 2.5 L (151 cu. in.) Iron Duke, a rather rustic pushrod four, derived from Pontiac's venerable V8. The Iron Duke was slow revving, heavy, noisy, and underpowered, but, like the hodgepodge suspension, it was cheap and available.
You ever notice the little chunk of dash thats always missing where the drivers knee crashes into it getting into the car?
Bench Racer (BowtieBandit) wrote: ... but I always remember the build quality, and the fact that you look like a tool driving one.
??
I can relate to the build quality, but the "tool" part is a bit puzzling.
Too bad they didnt use the turbo sunbird motor that was available from 84-up. If they had lived to 1990, the quad4 and even the turbo 3.1 would have totally changed the way these cars were viewed. Its sad and ironic that these 'better' (for 80s gm) motors ended up in sunbirds, calais', beretta and grand prix. Hell a few years later even the freaking Achieva got the motor that the Fiero didnt. Holy hell.
he was trapped in one on fire for about 30 minutes plus.
Too fat to fit through the window or too limp-wristed to break it? Extra points for both. 
In reply to ronholm:
Funny how different people from different perspectives remember things in different order... That's history for you.
Neat write up though. I always thought the Fiero was the ACLU of cars.
Great idea, horrible execution.
I always liked the Fiero.. I think a modern engine or even making one into an electric car would be great fun.
mad_machine wrote: can't overshadow the top dog...
Words to live by in the auto industry. Porsche hamstrung the 944 Turbo for this reason. Supposedly the SHO taurus was detuned a bit for the same reason. The list could go on.
Bench Racer (BowtieBandit) wrote: you look like a tool driving one.
You are wrong...unequivocally. Please avoid such inaccuracies in the future.
Clean Fieros are bringing good money these days. I'll take an 88 Formula please.
Cotton wrote: Clean Fieros are bringing good money these days. I'll take an 88 Formula please.
QFT
I prefer the looks of the early cars.. cleaner. Need to combine the body of an early car with the running gear of a late one
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