First gen Legacy Outback: imbibe me your knowledge

Hey guys,

I've been looking at Legacy Outbacks, Grand Marquis( which all seem to be low-spec GSs) W124 Benzes, and the occasional Park Avenue to replace my now-dead LHS. (it did give me 20k trouble-free miles!) I really have my eyes set on a Legacy Outback, but alas, I know very little about them. What do I need to know about these? This would be a strict daily/winter driver, as I have no intention of running my Caprice through the salt of a NE Ohio winter because I broke an Outback hooning it.

Thanks for any help!

Any pre-97 with the 2.2 is non-interference and nearly indestructible. Newer ones are interference but not much worse. Avoid the DOHC 2.5s. They rust a little, but not badly if maintained. Coming from an LHS, an Outback will feel like a Ferrari.

Admittedly I chuckled a little when I read you were sacrificing a Subaru to save a Caprice.

Rust, rust, and rust! Rear subframes in particular.

Most of the DOHC 2.5's have had the head gaskets done by now and if they are fixed right they are fine.

I had a 97 and mine had 412k kms (over 250k miles) on it when I sold it. It's still running, as I see it around town on a regular basis. I only sold it to buy my WRX.

I beat on that car pretty good (rally-X and running roads for volunteering at rallies) and the car always came back for more.

Similar to most Subaru's mileage is never great. Get a manual one.

SlickDizzy wrote: Any pre-97 with the 2.2 is non-interference and nearly indestructible. Newer ones are interference but not much worse. Avoid the DOHC 2.5s. They rust a little, but not badly if maintained. Coming from an LHS, an Outback will feel like a Ferrari. Admittedly I chuckled a little when I read you were sacrificing a Subaru to save a Caprice.

Unfortunately, the two that have popped up for sale near me are both `97s. I assume this means the DOHC 2.5. I have heard that they have HG issues, but the one with 110k on it says in the ad that the issued had been addressed. To add further insult, I haven't found one that isn't an automatic. I am quite certain that NE Ohio is the capital of the automatic.

Here's the ad for the aforementioned Outback: http://ashtabula.craigslist.org/cto/3466222166.html

And yes, I know I am crazy for potentially sacrificing an Outback for a Caprice wagon. I just can't bring myself to ruin it!

Also, LHSs don't handle that badly...

I just laughed when I read drink me your knowledge. Imbue, impart? But imbibe?

Spinout007 wrote: I just laughed when I read drink me your knowledge. Imbue, impart? But imbibe?

I am using it as a transitive verb

All I know is that my brother and his wife put roughly a billion miles one theirs (a 5-speed no less) and when it finally died last week, they just bought a new one. (also with a 5-speed). They are kinda tree-hugging and granola-crunching hippies from the Bay Area, but that only influenced their decision a little bit.

Late to the party as usual, but:

+insertsomenumbershere on DOHC 2.5s if the head gaskets have been done recently. Beware that timing belt kits and tune up bits cost a substantial bit more than they will for their 2.2/SOHC 2.5 kin.

Check for rumbly rear wheel bearings as well, they're a hassle/pricey to fix up.

Ensure that the gas gauge works, there are two in tank senders to fail, and it's a pile of money to replace the pair. Subarupartsforyou.com has the factory pair of senders for $148+shipping, I need them for my '95.

If it's only going to be a winter beater, I'd honestly just recommend a 2.2 Legacy. 15+% better mileage, much tougher engine, better clutch, and a bit lighter in the nose. Get a stick and you won't much miss the power of the 2.5.

In reply to ValuePack: I would love to, but nothing of that ilk is for sale yet. Thanks for the heads-up on the rear wheels bearings and gas gauge. One of the ones for sale locally does not have a working gas gauge, and now I know why!

My dad has one, its mostly pretty reliable, although when parts need replacing they arent very cheap. After the original alternator died, it went though 5 kragens alternators until getting a good one that has lasted a while. Changing front cv joints, wheel bearings, etc can get expensive because its common (even in california on a car that hasnt been driven in anything worse than occasional rain more than just a couple times), the cv joints will seize in the hubs and be nearly impossible to get out, so you have to replace everything. As long as you dont mind buying expensive dealer parts, or replacing parts store stuff every 6 months or so its a good car though.

Been a bad accident in a 97 Legacy wagon (same chassis), want to get another one. (heavy impact and rollover, I walked away. only bruised my knees because I sit too close)

The 2.2 with the automatic is pretty slow, but not horribly slow. Just not "sporting" fast.

Timing belt maintenice? (I cannot remember the interval on them)

One of the first things to check, throttle cable adjustment. I eventually found out that full throttle was only 7/8ths on ours.

Travis_K wrote: After the original alternator died, it went though 5 kragens alternators until getting a good one that has lasted a while.

+1. Parts store rebuilds are terrible for that alternator, for some reason. The factory electricals are usually still good, it's typically the bearings that wear out first. I plan to do bearings in mine shortly, we'll see how it is to get replacements.

Apexcarver:

Timing belt interval on the 2.2 is 60k.

What is the timing belt interval on the 2.5 DOHC?

In reply to Hoop:

Also 60k. Their only flat four with a longer interval, as near as I'm aware, is the single cam EJ25, at 105k.

Just to be nitpicky, you are actually talking about Gen II Legacies - 2004-2009. Gen I had the optional 2.2l turbo but are extremely rare. You will have difficulty finding a good 2.2l or 2.5l manual wagon for sale because it is the PERFECT winter beater and only a fool would sell a good one to a stranger. You may have better luck if you expand your search to include Imprezas 1993 - 2001. Both Legacies and Imprezas rust in the hind quarters because the oil leaks from the engine do not travel back there to offer passive rusty inhibiting. You ideally want a Legacy wagon with the 2.2l, 1996+ Outbacks and Legacy GTs all had the 2.5l which is a pretty crappy motor. The 96 2.5l is especially crappy (less power, premium gas, bad gaskets). They can be OK, IF the headgasket was replaced before any bearing damage was done and if there is not too much piston slap. They all slap a little. Good Luck!

Little update, I am looking at this car, even though it's not an Outback but a GT: http://cleveland.craigslist.org/cto/3487039135.html

1999 Subaru Outback GT - Rio Red 153,xxx miles

This is a very clean, well-kept Subaru Legacy GT. I had a lot of work done when I first bought it (in the last year) and the engine is ready to go to 250k. It has the sportier GT wheels and the rare Rio Red paint. I am selling this car because we recently moved to the area and only need one car.

Features: 4 spd automatic 2.5-L engine Power windows/locks/mirrors and keyless entry AC (recharged in September) Cruise Control Airbags Power Sunroof CD/tape player

Replaced the following during engine overhaul when purchased a year ago (documentation can be provided): front crank oil seal, all four cam seals, valve cover set, timing belt, belt tensioner assembly, upper/lower idle pulleys, oil pressure switch, and power steering pump. replaced front rotors at 148k AC recharged in September Head gaskets replaced by previous owner at 124k (biggest issue with these engines, which has been fixed)

Issues: Antenna motor broken Rear wiper motor broken Some rust on driver-side door from previous owner accident with deer - have carfax to show accident

What concerns me the most is the driver's side door. It looks like it will need replaced.

What say ye?

Not a bad car. The GT's are nice and not as common IMO.

If you go look at it, insist that the car be cold and not driven until you get there. Start it cold and listen for any piston slap or rod knock. I don't care if he rebuilt it.

Also, when it's cold and you shift from P to D, there should be no delay in engagement.

Doors are easy to replace with junk yard units so I wouldn't let that deter you (just use it to negotiate the price). The trick will be finding a red door!

That GT wagon is hot! The price is fairly reasonable, maybe just a little high. The door is an easy score from most scrappers, as is an antenna and wiper motor. I don't even hate that it's a slushbox. Jump on it!

Chances are the wiper motor is not done.

Pull the wiper out of the rear window (carefully!!!), apply anti-seize and re-install. Try again.

They all seize and if the PO kept trying it then it may burn out the motor.

Thanks for the extra info, guys. I will make sure to check for piston slap. I will set-up a time to go see it this week!

Also, keep in mind Subarus are kinda quirky assembly wise, nothing like Toyhondabishi type cars, so forget trying to fix one with the same mentality.

Kenny_McCormic wrote: Also, keep in mind Subarus are kinda quirky assembly wise, nothing like Toyhondabishi type cars, so forget trying to fix one with the same mentality.

Well, I am quite familiar with Volvos. Will this help me?

240 ownership will best prepare you for 70s/80s BMWs, and maybe early watercooled VWs. Most Subaru service is like "Playskool's My First Modern Japanese Car."