First Track Day: Summer Street Tires?

Hello everyone! 

I'm planning on attending a two day lapping introduction session at a local track. I've got an FK8 Civic Type R, with the factory 20" wheels,no mods.  I need to replace the summer tires this season. I figure I won't entirely destroy the tires and be able to use them for the rest of summer. It's on winter tires up here in Canada (18x8 ET40 wheel) right now, OE Sport Contact 6's are at the wear bars. 

From my research it seems newbies are advised to use a street tire (300tw+) for their first few session to avoid masking issues with "cheater tires". Considering I've never driven the car on track before, would it be advisable to get a relatively affordable summer "street" tire and use it for my first track experience? The Tires I had in mind are either the 

1. Falken Azenis FK510 255/40 R20 (~300 CAD/tire)
2. Extreme Contact Sport 02 255/35 R20 (~465 CAD/tire). 
3. FireHawk Indy 500 mounted on winter wheels 245/40 R18 (~270 CAD/tire)

If I get bit the bug big time I'd get a set of 18x9 wheels along with a dedicated 265/35 R18 track tire. But I figure its best to try out the sport before committing early and spending $$$$$. 

I am huge advocate for the ECS, but less so at those Canadian prices. Holy E46, I am pretty sure I got a full set for that price two years ago. 

Still, those and the FireHawks ( I don't have firsthand experience with the Falkens) are great first-time track tires. If you aren't over-driving the car, they won't get greasy on you, they'll warm up quickly and have plenty of grip as they do, and you won't be hosed if it rains. That last point is the big one - you can't pick the weather for a track day. With the ECS, I got caught in a downpour and had a great session. They also wear decently well and tolerate cold mornings well. 

The Firehawk Indy 500 is a great tire to start out on, it can handle the track easily but also makes a great street tire. For the price up here they are very hard to beat in their category. The comparable Michelin/Conti will be better in the wet but those tires will not hold up as well in the dry.

What track/group are you running with?

If the tires you have have enough meat to make it through a track day just use those.

Please don't take this the wrong way but you aren't going to be going fast enough to worry about the tires. At this point concentrate on the fundamentals.

Things like learning to look far enough ahead, lines, throttle steering and trail braking are what you will focusing on so you won't be going 10/10ths.

You could finish off your current tires at this event before putting on new ones, although you'd be gambling with the weather on near-slick tires.

Of the new tires, the Firehawk 500s are the best deal, they're the cheater tire of the 300TWs so their grip is closer to a non-cheaty 200TW. Do keep an eye on the classifieds for deals on used tires, you can save massive amounts of money that way. I got myself a set of lightly used PS4Ses for $500CAD a couple years ago, and I have a set of half-used Firehawk 500s I got for $200CAD as a backup right now.

Tom is absolutely right. Racing is to street driving like  cooking a fine meal is to opening a can of soup.  
 

 Assuming  you feel  almost ready to go formula 1 racing  anybody with 1 season under their belt is going to be lapping you.  
 

 I had a SCCA national license that expired following my return from Vietnam.   Less than 4 years later I was racing again and  just that much of a lay-off cost me 10 seconds a lap my first time back on the track and a year later with the same car on the same track.  
   Those skills aren't something you can freshen up on the street.    It has almost nothing to do with pushing the throttle pedal down. 
   Racing gets real expensive real fast  so learn to save money any way you can. Don't let a lot of time go between sessions. 

Thanks for the advice fellas. I'll try to make the existing tires into slicks by the end of the track day - depending on the weather forecast. If the forecast isn't clear I'll pick up a set of summer tires, and those should be more than sufficient for a Newbie. 

To be clear I know I will not be fast. The plan for this is to start learning! I haven't made a purchase yet but this is the event in question. https://calabogiemotorsports.com/products/aisa-racing-school

Update: I just went out to the shed and checked the tread depths of my OE SportContact 6's. They actually aren't as bald as I remember.

The most worn section i could find was still a hair above 3/32nds. Obviously this isn't good to use in a rainstorm - but considering its my first time on track, and if the weather will be Dry I think I'll just grind these ones down. I'll post back in May with results fellas! 

3/32nds is a bit lower than I'd be comfortable with going into a track day (even a very first track day), and probably lower than the tech sheet that you'll have to fill out will specify.  That's not to say it's unsafe -- most people do not drive that hard their first time out, and as long as you're paying attention, checking the tires between sessions, and willing to bail out of the event based on those results then it should be fine.  OTOH, you might have to fib a little bit on your signed-off tech sheet, and if this is with an organization that requires that you get the car teched by an outside shop (BMWCCA, for example) then they might not be willing to do that signoff.

My advice would be to replace the tires now but just get whatever tires you would normally get, ignoring the question of the track day.  Whatever they are they'll be fine for your first few events, and if you decide you want to jump into this pit of economic despair that we call a hobby in the long term, well, you can make that decision with more info. :)

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

My advice would be to replace the tires now but just get whatever tires you would normally get, ignoring the question of the track day.  Whatever they are they'll be fine for your first few events, and if you decide you want to jump into this pit of economic despair that we call a hobby in the long term, well, you can make that decision with more info. :)

Sounds good - thank you for the advice :) 

I wouldn't particular suggest the ECS on a stock CTR...

the CTR has a pretty low profile tire, and the ECS is real well known to "tucking", especially on FWD cars.  If you can dial in some camber (2-3deg), than I'd be more ok with it.  Otherwise, I'd suggest something that's stiffer.

Arent the Indy 500's the old Bridgestone RE003 tire?

What track?  What club?  I'd expect that if it is a multi-day event, and you are a new driver you will have an awful lot of time with an instructor.  I wouldn't sweat the tires, other than to make sure they are in good condition.  At the beginning of the learning curve, "fast" comes with instruction and practice, not tires.

My first year of endurance racing I was shaving all seaon tires down to 3/32" to get rid of tread squirm and excessive heating. I was able to get a full 14.5 hour race out of a set, no problem, but they were scary in the rain.

kevinatfms said:

Arent the Indy 500's the old Bridgestone RE003 tire?

That's what it is sold as outside of North America

I did my first track day on some 14 year old Costco specials that were dry rotted.  I do not recommend this. But I didny die and I had fun. So I did another with better tires. 

I am also a track beginner and I'm really satisfied with the Conti ECS on my Miata. I DD on them and don't have to worry about weather on track days. I have heard the ECS is commonly used a "rain tire" for track and autocross. For a beginner like me, its grip limits are plenty high enough while I focus on getting better.

I'll have to take a deeper dive to see if we have any tests on the three tires you mentioned, I'll also point to our tire buyer's guide if and when you decide to get more track-focused tires:

Ultimate track tire guide | 200tw, 100tw, street-legal track and R-comps

cyow5 said:

I am huge advocate for the ECS, but less so at those Canadian prices. Holy E46, I am pretty sure I got a full set for that price two years ago. 

 

Still, those and the FireHawks ( I don't have firsthand experience with the Falkens) are great first-time track tires. If you aren't over-driving the car, they won't get greasy on you, they'll warm up quickly and have plenty of grip as they do, and you won't be hosed if it rains. That last point is the big one - you can't pick the weather for a track day. With the ECS, I got caught in a downpour and had a great session. They also wear decently well and tolerate cold mornings well. 

How long ago did you buy the ECS? I just got a set in December, 245/35/18, $249.99 a tire from Tire Rack here in the US. Looks like now they are down to $244.99 and the ECS 2 is coming out at the same price. 

In reply to z31maniac :

For my Elise, 111USD/ea for 205/50R15 and 124USD for 225/50R16 on August '20. Looks like these are now $150/$165. 

For my E91, 162USD/ea for 235/45R17 on Feb '20.

So the size and currency both play in. Still, I was a bit shocked to see his price per tire when my latest set (Elise) was 470USD total. 

cyow5 said:

In reply to z31maniac :

For my Elise, 111USD/ea for 205/50R15 and 124USD for 225/50R16 on August '20. Looks like these are now $150/$165. 

For my E91, 162USD/ea for 235/45R17 on Feb '20.

So the size and currency both play in. Still, I was a bit shocked to see his price per tire when my latest set (Elise) was 470USD total. 

 

 

Oh I thought you were talking about his size, comparing prices for different sizes is kind of pointless.

Whoa! Thanks for all the replies and advice- much appreciated. 

I'm going to get either a set of ExtremeContact Sport 02's or Falken Azenis FK510 in the 255/30 R20 size. These should be good for me (beginner) + to drive around for the rest of summer. I'm going to compare prices when Spring arrives, as stock is pretty barren right now during winter up (in Canada). I figure going from the OE 245's to 255's might get me a tad bit more heat tolerance. 

Assuming I get bit by the bug and improve my skill, I'll get a dedicated set of wheels/tires next year. As per this guide: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/track-tire-buyers-guide/

To be continued in May! 

ZOO (Forum Supporter) said:

What track?  What club?  I'd expect that if it is a multi-day event, and you are a new driver you will have an awful lot of time with an instructor.  I wouldn't sweat the tires, other than to make sure they are in good condition.  At the beginning of the learning curve, "fast" comes with instruction and practice, not tires.

Calabogie Motorsport Park in Ontario, Canada!

https://calabogiemotorsports.com/products/aisa-racing-school

sleepyhead the buffalo said:

I wouldn't particular suggest the ECS on a stock CTR..

Noted!

In reply to NorthernCTR :

Fantastic track (I'm an instructor there), and that's a great club to learn with!