So, the dealer's offer is to pay off the body shop ($11k?) and give you a $7k trade in value on a new truck? It's a bummer, but that sounds like a decent offer.
So, the dealer's offer is to pay off the body shop ($11k?) and give you a $7k trade in value on a new truck? It's a bummer, but that sounds like a decent offer.
2002maniac wrote: So, the dealer's offer is to pay off the body shop ($11k?) and give you a $7k trade in value on a new truck? It's a bummer, but that sounds like a decent offer.
Not quite...
The dealer is offering to pay off the remainder of my loan (I just looked it up and it is 17K yikes!). They will take the truck as is in trade.
Geico is paying for the work already completed....
Sooo, the dealer is essentially offering me 13K for the truck as is and the difference in my loan gets rolled into the new loan....
Check to see if the truck was certified pre owned. But I'd just take the deal front the dealership. Negotiate with them and get a good deal but I think the more you invest in this situation the more it becomes poop.
Take the money and run honestly. The dealership offering to pay off the loan is as much as you will ever get out of them, being in the automotive industry for over 10 years, that's about as much as anyone will ever offer without a lawyer getting involved and even then, in the dealers eye's they're standing tall on this deal.
wvumtnbkr wrote: Sooo, the dealer is essentially offering me 13K for the truck as is and the difference in my loan gets rolled into the new loan....
Which isn't such a sweet deal after all. It's just a typical trade-in and loan roll over.
But, am I correct that you no longer really want this truck and just want shut of the whole thing? In that case, perhaps taking the deal and getting another vehicle isn't a bad way to go. Especially since you previously mentioned not wanting lawyers and apparently the whole fight scene.
In a nut shell, as I'm reading it:
Geico isn't totaling or otherwise legally condeming your truck, so you still legally own it and can take it back.
The shop performing the work (which isn't Geico, but is a preferred Geico shop) is entitled to be paid for the work performed so far. That said, the repair shop can hold the truck if Geico doesn't pay them (messy, rather unusual, but this is a messy situation).
You might be able to get some bit of cash from Geico for repair work not completed related to this latest accident. Though I strongly suspect this would be a hard fight and would only gain you pennies on the dollar.
Geico is not obligated to fix the previous damage that was not a result of this latest accident. A very common thing with older cars. The older the car the more common the issue.
I'd wondered about your early post about it being in a Geico shop. I've seen some direct insurance shops, but they are darn rare.
A major dealership body shop with a geico rep on site.
The shop won't release the truck to me because it is unsafe.
That setup sounds questionable at best. On-site GEICO rep says they won't pay the shop to fix the truck because of preexisting damage, shop won't release the truck because it's unsafe (seems like it was unsafe when they sold it to you by their logic) but the Dealer who owns the shop (who sold you the truck) says he'll cut you a "deal"? Am I way off base here? Really sounds shady but you may not have any recourse other than to take the deal and eat 4K+ in negative equity. Sucky deal all the way around.
Can they legally hold the truck because they say it I unsafe? I don't think they can do that. You will however have to release them from any liability in writing. If they have not been paid is also a interesting issue. If the insurance co authorized the work and not you I am not sure they can legally hold it either. Does not mean they will not try to but I think they would loose that one if an officer was to accompany you when you go to pick up your truck.
I am not sure of any of this. I would be interested to hear from Klayfish on this.
Klayfish??????
How did they plow that much money into it without seeing this? Something stinx. Onsite adjuster smoking krak? Payola.
I would be tempted to accuse the on-site Geico rep of working for the dealer for kickback... I feel that there is almost certainly a coordinated effort to screw you going on here.
06HHR wrote: That setup sounds questionable at best. On-site GEICO rep says they won't pay the shop to fix the truck because of preexisting damage, shop won't release the truck because it's unsafe (seems like it was unsafe when they sold it to you by their logic) but the Dealer who owns the shop (who sold you the truck) says he'll cut you a "deal"? Am I way off base here? Really sounds shady but you may not have any recourse other than to take the deal and eat 4K+ in negative equity. Sucky deal all the way around.
Did I miss something?
The dealer who sold you the truck owns the body shop that is now claiming the truck had pre-existing damage before they sold it to you?
That can't be right. 06HHR, I'm pretty sure you missed on that one. That would change everything.
2 different dealers.
No conspiracy to screw you going on, that I can assure you of. GEICO is responsible to pay for the damages related to your ice accident. Nothing more. As for why the other damage wasn't discovered earlier, it happens. If neither the GEICO rep nor the shop had any reason to suspect poorly done prior repairs, they're not going to crawl all over it on initial inspection. They're both going to write for the damage they can see and maybe check for things they might suspect from this accident, not necessarily try to find any old unrepaired/poorly repaired damage. It's sometimes found this way.
It's a GEICO recommended shop, yes, and they have a rep there. But the shop is still an independent shop. They probably also have a contract with State Farm, Nationwide and Allstate for network shop programs. There's no conspiracy.
The one thing that doesn't make sense to me is the shop saying they won't release it because it's not safe. It's not their truck. They can absolutely hold it for payment, and they can even refuse to work on it further due to the old damage. I'd have no issues with that. I can even go along with them wanting you to sign an acknowledgement that you're taking it "as is" and understand it has prior damage. But once they're paid for what they have invested in it, they have no rights to hold it. I would lean on both the shop and GEICO on that part. GEICO should pay you for the actual estimated damage from this recent accident. You can then pay the shop for the work they've done to date and drag it on out of there.
wvumtnbkr wrote:2002maniac wrote: So, the dealer's offer is to pay off the body shop ($11k?) and give you a $7k trade in value on a new truck? It's a bummer, but that sounds like a decent offer.Not quite... The dealer is offering to pay off the remainder of my loan (I just looked it up and it is 17K yikes!). They will take the truck as is in trade. Geico is paying for the work already completed.... Sooo, the dealer is essentially offering me 13K for the truck as is and the difference in my loan gets rolled into the new loan....
Ew, so you have to roll $17k into the new truck loan? That's horrid.
wvumtnbkr wrote: A major dealership body shop with a geico rep on site. The shop won't release the truck to me because it is unsafe.
Geico can keep it, it they total it and pay you for it. That is legal.
A body shop cannot simply keep it because they think it's unsafe. That is the crime of theft, and something police are well familiar with at dealerships.
Personally, I strongly recommend you document your records of events to date.
Then, with a witness and cell phone go get your truck. When they refuse, call 911 in front of them and report they are holding your truck.
Next, contact your state insurance commissioner. A Geico rep,having an office on site at this dealership, stinks of collusion and fraud.
In a nut shell, get your truck out of there and have it looked at by someone else.
You guys are really over blowing the Geico rep thing.
A "Rep" could be nothing more than an employee of the shop who has been trained in the Geico process. Or, it could be a Geico employee who does part time office hours at several body shops for customer service.
That part could be a normal business practice, not necessarily collusion.
Declaring the truck "unsafe" and refusing to release it is a different issue.
I also don't believe they have incurred $11K worth of expenses to date.
They may have been authorized to do $11K worth of work before discovering the previous damage. But they did not incur $11K worth of expenses by simply removing the bed and bumper and looking at the frame.
If Geico will not repair the truck, putting it back the way it was should be a simple remove and replace- Well less than $2K. No parts, no paint.
What was the quote for the work before they started?
GEICO rep is likely an employee of GEICO, one of their appraisers. Not uncommon.
In reply to Klayfish:
What do you think of the idea of just showing up and saying I'd like to pick up my truck? Would that help or hurt and how so?
Stampie wrote: In reply to Klayfish: What do you think of the idea of just showing up and saying I'd like to pick up my truck? Would that help or hurt and how so?
I did that. Geico basically said that the crash damage is fixed... go get somebody to put it together.
I'm not really interested in doing that. The truck value goes to nothing because it has 95k in it and will have a major accident on carfax.
Plus it needs tires. Plus it needs the drivetrain serviced.
I'm just trading it.
P.s. I had a post that got lost.
6k or 7k on new bed and paint. A couple k in the paint for the side.
In reply to Stampie:
As long as he pays the shop for what they have in it I don't think it would be an issue. I worked at a shop where this has happened a few times and the customer paid us for what we did and either picked up the pieces and took them away. Sometimes things go wrong and owners have to go a different direction.
One suggestion on a possible way to go. In some areas there are shops that specialize in heavy frame work and often just straighten and repair heavy hits for other shops. If you decide to take the truck home it might be worth finding one of these shops and seeing if they can make something out of your chassis and then find a cheap shop to reassemble the truck for cash.
How much would it be to go ahead and fix the frame? I feel like if it's less than the amount of negative equity you are rolling into the new truck it may be worth doing. At least get that quoted, so you know what your BATNA (best alternative to no agreement) is.
The 17K rolled in to the new loan is the really bad part of this deal. The interest on this means it is more like 19K depending on the loan terms. Also if none of this had happened you were going to do the maintenance and get new tires yes? Also so what if the truck is worth zero you are not incurring new debt so in reality it is actually saving you the amount financed on a new truck PLUS the finance charges on the 17K of debt on the current truck will not get rolled over into a longer note so you will be starting over paying the interest again on the 17K where as now you have paid most of the interest on the 17k and from now forward you are paying principal. Even if you paid the dealer cost on a new vehicle rolling in the 17K and paying the interest on it and the cost of the new truck they will make money. Lots of money. That does not seem like a good deal at all.
I would look at getting the truck fixed or put back together by another shop. Then do the maintenance and keep on rolling for another 10 years. So what if you truck has a branded title or car fax said it has frame damage. IF you run it in to the ground or until it's value is so so low the car fax report will not matter.
It kind of sounds like you don't want to be in a vehicle that has a bad car fax? Who cares what car fax says. Increasing your debt and paying interest 2X on the 17K sounds like a REALLY bad deal.
We could always have a gathering and put it back together. Your only 12 hours away. I'd try my best to make it with enough heads up.
SVreX wrote:06HHR wrote: That setup sounds questionable at best. On-site GEICO rep says they won't pay the shop to fix the truck because of preexisting damage, shop won't release the truck because it's unsafe (seems like it was unsafe when they sold it to you by their logic) but the Dealer who owns the shop (who sold you the truck) says he'll cut you a "deal"? Am I way off base here? Really sounds shady but you may not have any recourse other than to take the deal and eat 4K+ in negative equity. Sucky deal all the way around.Did I miss something? The dealer who sold you the truck owns the body shop that is now claiming the truck had pre-existing damage before they sold it to you? That can't be right. 06HHR, I'm pretty sure you missed on that one. That would change everything.
Looks like I did, I stand corrected. Frankly, I agree with dean1484, if you can get someone to put the truck back together I don't see why you can't just drive it with the frame damage. I mean you were driving it just fine until the accident happened. Dealer is giving you a deal because that's instant sale for him, and he will just wholesale it or salvage it. With you rolling in the negative equity on your old loan into the new note he's making money on the deal anyway, can't fault him for that. If you just have to have another truck then take the deal, what you lose is the cost of doing business in your situation (trading in a wrecked vehicle). Otherwise I think i'd just patch it back together and run it into the ground.
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