Grassroots S10 Engine Swap

What abundant and inexpensive engine would be a good swap candidate for an old two wheel drive S10?

The truck is an '85 (I think), it's rust-free and I'm getting it later this month for it's scrap value. The current owners were going to scrap it because it's on it's third (!) 2.8L V6 in only 98K miles of use. No word on what is actually going wrong with these 2.8s, but the one installed currently "shakes violently" and was described as "bad" by their trusted mechanic.

Assuming the engine is, indeed, "bad", what's a good old carbureted engine that can be swapped in on the cheap?

small block chevy

/thread

Not what your after but I'd love to see a supercharged 3.8 backed by a 5spd in one. So I say do that;)

arent the 3.1 or 3.4 basically just evolved versions of the 2.8? i know most are transversely mounted, but what about pre3.8 camaros? more power and i heard they got a lot better than the old 2.8s.

WilberM3 wrote: arent the 3.1 or 3.4 basically just evolved versions of the 2.8? i know most are transversely mounted, but what about pre3.8 camaros? more power and i heard they got a lot better than the old 2.8s.

Way back in a past life I worked for a company that did the EPA testing on this swap. Basically GM didn't want to build several variations of the same engine and wanted the 3.1(?) certified as a direct bolt in for a 2.8. Unfortunately I left before the project was completed so I don't know if it was ever approved. The 2.8 eventually evolved into the 3.7 iirc.

Then again if you're going through all that work anyway just put in a V8. I've done a few and they aren't hard at all. Google JTR and buy the book even if you don't use their parts. Its a lifesaver.

I'll also chime in suggesting the SBC swap. Would be interesting to see a 3.4 swap, though, if you're just looking for a litle more oomph.

lsx

My vote goes for a Vortec V-6. Very overlooked and underappreciated engine that will bolt right in. Many are rated around 300 hp right from the factory.

actually, +1 on the vortec. ive heard theyre like lsxs minus 2 holes

Just as a warning, there are 3 generations of 60* V6s. The only one you can use is the first gen with iron heads as the 2nd and 3rd gen have the oilpan that won't fit because of it's size and it's used to make the bttom end stronger. I have a 3.1 that I wanted to drop into my 96, that's how I found out. The 3.4 for the F-cars will bolt in since it's made for RWD. I suggest those since they are really less labor intensive than even the SBC.

ncjay wrote: My vote goes for a Vortec V-6. Very overlooked and underappreciated engine that will bolt right in. Many are rated around 300 hp right from the factory.

No Vortec V6 made near 300hp.... but Vortec inline six does.

Vortec V6 = 4.3l.

Still a good engine, though.

ncjay wrote: My vote goes for a Vortec V-6. Very overlooked and underappreciated engine that will bolt right in. Many are rated around 300 hp right from the factory.

The highest rating the Vortec V6 had was 210HP, and that was in the C/K series truck. The same 262c.i. in the S-truck was rated @ 190HP, which is all in the computer.

Also, I only suggested the narrow V6 so that he didn't need to swap in a different transmission, since the 90* V6 has the SBC trans pattern.

For a cheap 'weekend swap' for a utility vehicle I'd do the 3.4 as well. For hot rodding: the SBC swap has been done to death, the Vortec 4.3 was available in later versions of it from the factory so that's boring, but the SC 3800/5speed... now we're talkin'!

ncjay wrote: My vote goes for a Vortec V-6. Very overlooked and underappreciated engine that will bolt right in. Many are rated around 300 hp right from the factory.

Not entirely true. The 60* V6, which the 2.8 is, has different transmission mounting holes than 4.3 and SBC. 4.3 and SBC share same mounting holes.

I really like the idea of a bolt-in 3.4L from an F-body car.

In what year F-bodies can I find a 3.4?

4th-gens pre-3.8 would be your best bet. I think it was '93-97.

You know what also bolts up to a 60degV6 bolt pattern? Northstars.

I'd go with the 4.3 even though it means a trans swap. Heck, because it means a trans swap. How were those engines failing? Was it due to a fault in the transmission causing excessive thrust loads, killing the thrust bearing and sending a bunch of crap through the engine? (See this about once a year)

Also, what do they mean by "bad"? I've seen people swap engines because of a poor carburetor, or bad plug wires. The 2.8 was a dog but it was at least a durable dog.

Knurled wrote: Also, what do they mean by "bad"? I've seen people swap engines because of a poor carburetor, or bad plug wires. The 2.8 was a dog but it was at least a durable dog.

Yeah - as bad as the 2.8 was, I'd hate to see a bunch of cash doles out because the guy kept using the same oil pump for each engine or something.

you can pick up a 5.3 out of a late model truck for around $400..

I wouldn't do anything less than a sbc. I've done the sbc swap, and I was barely sure it was worth the (relatively minor) effort. I'm trying to imagine doing that job for an even less impressive result, and I'm losing interest.

Knurled wrote: You know what also bolts up to a 60degV6 bolt pattern? Northstars.

You can also use the newer LS engine from the FWD Bonnie, Malibu Maxx SS, and Monte SS.

Also, the N* swap has crossed my mind. Been looking at them in the salvage yard to see if the top half of the intake can be turned around so the intake isn't against the firewall.

patgizz wrote: small block chevy /thread

GRUNT GRUNT

AquaHusky wrote:

Knurled wrote: You know what also bolts up to a 60degV6 bolt pattern? Northstars.

You can also use the newer LS engine from the FWD Bonnie, Malibu Maxx SS, and Monte SS. Also, the N* swap has crossed my mind. Been looking at them in the salvage yard to see if the top half of the intake can be turned around so the intake isn't against the firewall.

the Malibu never got a V8- you are thinking of the Impala.

and i think there would be a lot of problems with using the fwd 5.3 in a rwd application- you can't just bolt on rwd LS engine accessories to the front of the engine thanks to the different crank snout, and you can't just change the crank due to the different flexplate mounting flange offset. i think they made a bunch of other small and large changes to the engine for fwd packaging.

not saying it couldn't be done, but it would be easier to find a trans with the proper SBC/LS bellhousing than it would be to put a fwd 5.3 in a rwd vehicle..

one engine that i don't think has been mentioned yet is the 3.8 that was in the 98-02 Camaros and Firebirds. it has the smaller fwd bellhousing pattern and has everything in the right place for rwd. plus, it is a really strong and smooth running engine that is capable of taking massive amounts of boost on the stock long block.

Get a Duramax. 650 torks. Some guy on the internet said it bolts right in.

In reply to M030:

93-95 did. 95 had the 3.8 as an option, 96 it became standard. check the bolt pattern on the 3.8 it might match the tranny.

In reply to Knurled:

The obvious first step is to get it back to my shop and try to diagnose the vibration. From their description, it sounds like a misfire. If we can't fix it, I'm gonna stick a 3.4 in it.

Will the 2.8 intake, carburetor, oil pan & exhaust manifolds bolt up to the 3.4?