GRM LS-Swaps a 350Z in 3 Days

Re: Vette vs 350lsz... It would seem the magazine is about to have a great opportunity for a head to head....

noddaz said:

But my big question...

Is GRM going to test the LS350Z with the stock brakes?  The "we can accelerate much faster, but can't slow down worth a damn" should be epic.  

Just don't get hurt during the test.

The tires stop the car, typically if the brake system was good enough to lock the tires or trigger ABS before the swap, it will be the same after the swap.  IF you're running into brake fade on the street, either your braking system is complete garbage and/or worn out, or you are simply driving too damned fast.

Sorry this whole upgraded brake thing seems to have really caught on with the 944 swaps because everyone wants Turbo brakes on their cars, never mind the Spec 944 guys have no problems with their single piston brakes on shaved 205/50's.  Put good pads and fluid in it, make sure everything is moving properly and that the tires aren't 10-year old hard-rocks.

The drift guys do this around here all the time so it cannot be to difficut as they seem to all have two left thumbs at least the ones that I know.

Ed Higginbotham said:

Ahhhhh
Ahhhhhh
Ahhhh-CHOOOOO!

Goodness. I seem to have blowed my node off.

tuna55 said:

Keith Tanner said:

So either the LS3 is heavier than the LS1 or the accessories and oil weighs 85 lbs My shipping notes say that the CTS-V accessory package we use runs 52.3 lbs shipping weight including the AC compressor.

Yeah, that is a big difference. The LS3 and LS1 are virtually identical in terms of weight. I suppose accessories and brackets may make up some of that. How were those weights obtained?

 

What about the outgoing powerplant?

 

 

How did each of you weigh those?

The engine weight would have been done on a single cornerweight scale. The accessory drive weight was done on a shipping scale.

So....say 485 for motor, fairly complete, plus 135 for that manual trans.....620 pounds for an aluminum block LS.  The infallible Interwebz say the iron block adds another 60 pounds......almost 700 pounds of engine and trans makes my goal for my next Challenge car a real challenge. Aptly named contest, I guess. It's about time to borrow some scales and weigh my 'Rolla roller.

tuna55 said:

Keith Tanner said:

So either the LS3 is heavier than the LS1 or the accessories and oil weighs 85 lbs My shipping notes say that the CTS-V accessory package we use runs 52.3 lbs shipping weight including the AC compressor.

Yeah, that is a big difference. The LS3 and LS1 are virtually identical in terms of weight. I suppose accessories and brackets may make up some of that. How were those weights obtained?

 

What about the outgoing powerplant?

 

 

How did each of you weigh those?

Weights were taken with a digital crane scale. Except the new transmission. It was weighed on a regular digital scale. We’ll post all the weights when we sit down with our notes this evening. 

And we’re in!

Proverbial hot-dog down a hallway that is!

So uh...what are you putting that VQ in? 

maschinenbau said:

So uh...what are you putting that VQ in? 

Ooo, I like this question. The circle of life.

I propose either a (big) Mini or a Corvette.

Something was missing from that picture.

So I am reading this right that the LS is actually heavier than the VQ? Quoted weights for the VQ35DE seems to be 312 lbs.

I always forget how compact LS motors are.

Put the VQ in the BMW project...

VQ's are known to be pretty light.. 3/4 the cylinder count, all aluminum, and with a tighter V angle. On the other hand, it has 4 cams, but each is only 3 cylinders long. I'd bet the VQ is lighter.

In reply to Stefan :

Because a Spec 944 makes 138rwhp and my old LS1 made 385rwhp?  You really think the stock brakes are a good idea when you've added another 250rwhp?  Really?

Are you going to make everything compatible/work with the canbus system? Meaning oem  gauges, ac, etc, with no check engine lights?

docwyte said:

In reply to Stefan :

Because a Spec 944 makes 138rwhp and my old LS1 made 385rwhp?  You really think the stock brakes are a good idea when you've added another 250rwhp?  Really?

I see and you're using the brakes to keep the tires from spinning?  Were you able to lock the tires up before the engine swap?  If so, then more HP won't impact that other than making the skid marks longer due to higher potential velocity.

As I said, if you're getting brake fade due to track events, then you could use some work in the brake area.  If the tires are locking up then your actual brakes are working well, your tires or brake balance may be an issue.  If you want more brake feel or the ability to brake more closely to the theshold of friction of the tires, then larger and stiffer calipers/rotors can make a nice difference along with increasing the width of the tires and their tire compound.

Keep in mind that the load on brakes goes up with the square of speed. So if you're playing with the new engine to squirt between corners and driving at a reasonable rate around them, you definitely are working the brakes harder.

The whole "tires are the limit" argument only applies to single stop braking distances.

Accessories are on. 

docwyte said:

In reply to Stefan :

Because a Spec 944 makes 138rwhp and my old LS1 made 385rwhp?  You really think the stock brakes are a good idea when you've added another 250rwhp?  Really?

add in that didn't the 350Z have issues with brake fade stock to start with?

Fantastic progress so far guys! I could get used to this watching progress happen without getting my hands dirty!

I’ll post all the weights tonight with and without accessories and such. 

But, spoiler alert: we aren’t gaining or losing more than a few pounds during this swap. 

Tim Suddard said:

Fantastic progress so far guys! I could get used to this watching progress happen without getting my hands dirty!

Seriously, watching what took me months to do happen in a matter of hours 

Furious_E said:

Tim Suddard said:

Fantastic progress so far guys! I could get used to this watching progress happen without getting my hands dirty!

Seriously, watching what took me months to do happen in a matter of hours 

This is what happens when you do a "boring" swap that's been thoroughly engineered by pros!

Looks great guys. Hmmm. I could go all LS for my fleet. LS Xterra, LS G37, and LS Miata. I'm really interested in seeing the wiring integration. That is the fun stuff.