Honda brake job questions

My wife drives a 2001 Accord sedan, and when the car was in the shop a few weeks ago for A/C work the shop noted that we needed front and rear brakes. I made a mental note to change them, but put them off w/ the crazy work schedule that I've had lately. Today, we drove her car out of town and the brakes were bad enough for me to feel uncomfortable about her and my son being in the car. On the way back home I stopped by the AZ and got Duralast gold ceramic pads for the front and rear. My plan was to change them tonight and drive her car to church tomorrow am.

The old pads were just starting to make noise, and the rear ones were the worst by far. They make aloud moan when u back up w/ your foot on the brakes. Rotors, front and rear were felt smooth w/ no noticiable grooves in them, only a slight lip on the edge. While changing one side of the front, I accidentally loosened the brake line bolt enough for a few drop of brake fluid to come out. I closed it immediately, but it scared me so I pressed the pedal to see if any more fluid would come out. It went down alittle more than it should have on the first pump, but the rest of them got harder and harder. I assumed that it was soft b/c I had one caliper off of the pads, and no more fluid came out so I finished the fronts.

I wound up only getting the fronts done and on my drive to bed the pads, the car stops better than it did before. But the pedal is soft. Again, it got harder during the test drive but its still softer than what I'm used to.

Could anyone give me an idea of what to look for? Do I need to bleed the brakes, and if so how do I bleed an abs system? I also only did 5 - 35-10mph stops, so maybe the brakes just need to be bed more? My wife has an appointment on Mon and this puts us to only having one car for awhile. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks................And please overlook my spelling and grammar. Its late and Im very tired.

I doubt you got any air in the caliper, but I'd bleed it just in case. Do you know how to do that (sorry, I don't know what your knowledge level is). Here's a note though. Brakes NEVER feel great at first. I can't tell you how many customers came back or called that first day saying the brakes felt "funny". Then I started bedding the pads in before I hand over the keys. Complaints down to 0. Give it a day or two, they'll feel better.
If you're not cure though, bleed them.

Plus one on bedding the pads. The pad is riding on the 'lip' you mentioned and the pad will need to wear to conform. Once that's done, the brakes will feel much better.

On the newer ABS cars like yours brake bleeding is done like any other non-ABS system, you don't have to do anything goofy.

I have a 2001 Accord Sedan as well. At best the pedal feel is like stepping on a marshmallow. The pedal feel seems to have no real correlation to the braking force applied. The brakes are over boosted. Great if you're an old lady. Bad if you want to feel like something is happening when you press the brake pedal. I think you're fine.

cheap maintenance/insurance: buy a big bottle of brake fluid when you get new pads. then, when you replace pads, open the bleeder screws before pushing the pistons in. this allows the skanky old fluid to go out the bleeder instead of being pushed upstream into the ABS valve. put it all back together, then fill the reservoir and leave each bleeder open until you see clean fluid coming out.

dang ... after all the race pad changes I've done and all the bleeding of systems I've done ... I had never thought of that ... Angry YOU ARE A GENIUS ... ( or else I'm a whole lot dumber than I thought ... )

If you happen to have access to a mityvac (lol) you should go ahead and flush all the old fluid out. it makes a noticeable difference sometimes. all it is is an extended bleed, really. just suck all the old fluid out, fill the res with new, turn the bottle upside down in the res, and bleed like normal, LR, RR, RF, LF
I've decided to do a brake flush on my car every 30k, along with the coolant flush. by that time my brake fluid is looking a little dirty, and the coolant flush is part of the factory service plan.

wbjones wrote: dang ... after all the race pad changes I've done and all the bleeding of systems I've done ... I had never thought of that ... Angry YOU ARE A GENIUS ... ( or else I'm a whole lot dumber than I thought ... )

Yeah, that's standard practice, but your pretty dang smart anyways WB.
I push the fluid through the bleeder for a few reasons:
If the bleeders are cracked once per brake job, there's never an issue of broken bleeders, or ones that won't flow fluid because they've never been opened.
Then there's the issue of pushing crap into the ABS pump.
I also don't like fluid spilling out of the master cylinder. Then you have major clean up and possible fluid drips for a few days. I love customers coming back to me for more work, hate them coming back to me because I didn't do something right.
On that note, to anyone reading this, NEVER add brake fluid to the system unless you opened the system. If it's low it's a wear indicator or a leak indicator.

Thanks for all of the info!!

@Angry... I will do that next time, but honestly it scares me. When I was in my 20's I totaled a '67 impala I was working on restoring. This was a day or two after rebuilding all of the wheel cylinders and new friction material all around. Apparently I got air in the line, and I lost brakes for about 5 seconds and then everything locked up. Right as I needed to do an emergency stop.

On the way out to do the back brakes now.

I'll check back in later.

Thanks again!!

Hey. Got pads on all corners done, and it looks like the RR caliper is dragging slightly. Just enough to wear the pad funny, and make a slight noise when the tire is turned by hand. That's on the list to replace later.

I drove the car for a few miles yesterday and last night. The brakes are def getting back to what I'm used to( meaning pedal feel ). Still slightly soft, but better. My wife drives the car today and got really scared when the pedal went down maybe 2in lower than it used to. As the day went it, the car felt better for her, but my goal now is to try and bleed the LF caliper. Two questions:

1) Never having done this sucessfully, is there a good how to or tips page I can look at when I get home?

2) Does unopened brake fluid expire? I have a couple small bottles laying around that Id like to use if I can, assuming its the right kind.

Thanks again. Will

Not sure if there is a how to page (I'm sure there is, but I've not looked for one). Basically, start at the wheel cylinder/caliper farthest away and work toward the master cylinder (RR, LR, RF, LF). Bleed each one untill you don't see any air bubbles for about 5 presses in a row. Make sure you have a nice tight seal on the bleeder valve.
The best way (other than a pressure bleeder) is "two man". I have all windows down (for good communicaiton) and (discuss this before you start so it's clear) have a partner pump the pedal 3-5 times after you yell "pump it." After they pump it the 5th time, they hold firm pressure and yell "holding". Then you crack the line with a hose going into a jar. This is why you want to discuss the procedure before you start. My wife freaked out when the pedal fell from under her foot when the bleeder was opened. She jumped off the pedal and it sucked in 10X more air than it had before we started. Anyway, do that on each wheel until you see no air bubbles, minimum of three times. Keep that master cylinder full too!
As far as brake fluid, it does have a shelf life. I don't know how long unopened fluid lasts but I don't take chances. I buy fluid for every job I do. The fluid absorbs moisture so, "wet" fluid will rust your internals. It's not worth it when you can replace every drop of fluid in the system for $10 or less.

The good Dr. missed a few steps after the crack the bleeder step... Here's a very thorough write up from Stoptech:

How to bleed brakes

New brake fluid only should be used, for standard street use I like the Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 stuff. Cheap and readily available.

Brake fluid (and clutch fluid!) should be changed every 2 years within a complete flush of the system. It absorbs water, which will accumulate at the low points in your system, which if they happen to be metal brake lines will then begin to corrode and rust. That water is also what boils when you "boil" your brakes. It's an easy hour or so job if you're going slowly and allows a good inspection of the brake system as well as the suspension at the same time. Also good quality time with one of the kids for me.

Thanks for the info and words of encouragement. Between work and my son getting sick I havent been able to do them, but I'll report back when I do. I'm not sure if I'll be able to get help, though. I'll look into the one-man methods. Thanks again....

W-

AngryCorvair wrote: cheap maintenance/insurance: buy a big bottle of brake fluid when you get new pads. then, when you replace pads, open the bleeder screws before pushing the pistons in. this allows the skanky old fluid to go out the bleeder instead of being pushed upstream into the ABS valve. put it all back together, then fill the reservoir and leave each bleeder open until you see clean fluid coming out.

See, you do learn something every day. Thanks