How young is too young?

A 12 year old boy was killed driving a budget oval car recently:

http://www.autoweek.com/article/20120524/MOTORSPORTS/120529900?utm_source=DailyDrive20120524&utm_medium=enewsletter&utm_term=article2&utm_content=20120524-Embracing_the_sport_that_kills&utm_campaign=awdailydrive

Sad, but...
Isn't common that if you want to be the next Tony Stewart or Danica that you have to win a championship before typical driving age?

Wish this thread was about what I thought it was going to be.

Prayers for the family, they're going to need 'em.

JohnInKansas wrote: Wish this thread was about what I thought it was going to be.

Yes, I too opened this thread expecting the answer to be, half your age plus 7 years.

That hits far too close to home. Steven Cole Smith did a wonderful job with that article. Prayers on the way for the family.

Margie

jrw1621 wrote: Yes, I too opened this thread expecting the answer to be, half your age plus 7 years.

That would have been posted in Off Topic.

Agree the article was well done.

Has the nature of his injuries been released - i.e., would he have likely survived with a head and neck restraint?

I tend towards thinking you don't need to be driving a car until you have a drivers license. I don't have a problem with carts and the like at a younger age.

I don't think he was too young. I think it was a horrible set of circumstances that allowed that to happen. Personally if there was a racing series that allowed my kid to do it and he was that age? Game on. Think of how young the Finnish are when they start allowing their children to rally.....

Did not read the link, no need to. They race kids at my track but their mentored the whole time over the radios. Many of the kids cars are also run in the lady's classes by sisters and mothers.
Bottom line is if the kid wants to do it and keeps his grades up and helps etc I'm all for it. It when you get the bratty snot nosed "I'm entitled" kids that piss me off. It's no different then a kid playing hockey or football when the right set of circumstances comes about people get hurt.

I'll pray for the family

I'm sorry to hear of this.

I also agree with 44dwarf; it's no different than a kid getting injured or killed playing soccer, football, etc.

Racers start pretty young, always have. If you have ever watched 'On Any Sunday' (filmed in 1971), a young man age 10 had a really neat part. You may recognize the name on the back of the helmet:

IIRC by the time that was filmed he had been racing motocross for 4 years. I climbed on a minibike at age 5, ran my first MX race at age 12. 29 is an old dude in MX, in 1998 Yamaha made headlines when their grizzled veteran John Dowd won the 125 Supercross West championship at the ripe old age of 33. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dowd_(motocross)

Horse riders/racers start young, too. The girl in this article is 10, they mention another girl who was killed at age 12 when her horse stepped on her head. http://www.tampabay.com/news/humaninterest/article1009735.ece

Many many kids do these things and come through with scratches, bumps and maybe a broken bone or two, but IMHO it beats the crap out of them sitting in front of a video game controller cramming Cheetos in their mouths for hours. And then dying of diabetes.

"Like all of the others in his class, Tyler’s car had a roll cage, window net, belts and a steel-bar-reinforced front bumper. He was wearing a firesuit and a closed-face helmet."

Okay.. the car had a cage, but how well was it built? How safe was the car?

Was he wearing a HANS? probably not

There is a spectrum of of danger in activities, and I figure auto racing is more dangerous (fatalities) than soccer or football. A lot of parents don't let their kids play football because of the danger (and I imagine recent events are only going to increase those numbers). A lot of parents choose a similar but less dangerous alternative. Maybe youth carting is safer than auto racing. I am not sure, but I would fully research it before I let my kid take part in it.

We don't know much about this particular incident. The details could reveal this to be a blameless tragedy or incredibly stupid parenting, but most likely the truth is somewhere in the middle.

mndsm wrote: I don't think he was too young. I think it was a horrible set of circumstances that allowed that to happen. Personally if there was a racing series that allowed my kid to do it and he was that age? Game on. Think of how young the Finnish are when they start allowing their children to rally.....

Good point. Remember that thread where we were all so stoked about Rovenpera's (8yr old) son driving? Smith's article is brilliant (and to me, true)..but it damn sure hurts worse when it's a kid. Thoughts and hopes for the family. I know it sounds like a cliche, but it's not.

We lost a national level kart racer at our track a couple of years back. She was 9. Of course, there was the typical hue and cry about how kids shouldn't be doing anything remotely hazardous. But if you look into it, kart racing is really safe. There are probably more kids hurt riding to the track in their parents car than on the track.

And what's the end result of a kid racing at an early age? Improved car control and no "red mist" when they're a teenager on the street. In other words, far greater odds at the highest-risk period of their lives. I call that a win.

I don't care if the kid in Smith's article could have been saved by a HANS (can you get them that small?) or a magical fairy sitting on the steering column. That's not the point. We all try to make our race cars as safe as we can. But should he be kept out of a race car until he's older? Nope. No more than he should be kept off a bicycle.

Smith did a good job on the article for sure. If I had kids, you can bet they'd be on the track if that's what interested them.

Hmm, how many kids die playing stick & ball sports? Especially at the High School level.

A shame, but nothing to indict motorsport.

friedgreencorrado wrote:

mndsm wrote: I don't think he was too young. I think it was a horrible set of circumstances that allowed that to happen. Personally if there was a racing series that allowed my kid to do it and he was that age? Game on. Think of how young the Finnish are when they start allowing their children to rally.....

Good point. Remember that thread where we were all so stoked about Rovenpera's (8yr old) son driving? Smith's article is brilliant (and to me, true)..but it damn sure hurts worse when it's a kid. Thoughts and hopes for the family. I know it sounds like a cliche, but it's not.

And that kid could DRIVE.

In reply to Keith:

That team lost Rich Vito, too. It can't have been easy to be Doug Welch then - it can't be easy for him now. Neither incident was Shockwave's fault in any way.

My kids race and started racing at a young age it scared the hell out of me at times but it was whut they wanted to do as someone else said way better than sitting in a dark basement with a joy stick in there hands. I have grand children now and if they want to persue racing i will be there for them, life without some risk would be pretty boring

"what if" it and play armchair quarterback all you want.

The writer summed it up perfectly: Because I reconciled a long time ago that the only sport I care about can be so cruel, so unfair. I decline to apologize or justify. You get it or you don’t. I prefer the company of those who do.

I feel for everyone involved and I can't imagine what it would be like to lose a kid to the sport but it is what it is.

Very sad. People, including kids, die do all sorts of activities. I think often times we all forget that just about anything can kill you. A bad hit in football, line drive to the head in baseball, or a car crash in racing. And I'm ok with that. It's a pretty safe time to do just about any sport you want. People don't die as a matter of course any more.

It's very sad, and I'm sorry it happened. If there's something we can learn from this and improve upon I hope we do.

I don't have a problem with carts and the like at a younger age.

I dont really get that.. In what world is a cart safer than a car? I mean, he wrecked at less than 50, let's say, and there are plenty of carts that can wreck at less than 50, and id venture they're less safe while doing so. I did some electric cart racing at a K1 a few weeks ago. There was nothing in front of my face (windshield, A pillars, part of a roll cage, etc). Which means any given thing (like another cart that SOMEHOW gets airborne) can ram me right in the throat/head. Sort of like how Ayrton Senna died. Maybe carts are generally safer because they go slower, but make a car go that speed and it's going to be safer.

They race kids at my track but their mentored the whole time over the radios.

I dont see how that would help, either. E36 M3 goes wrong a lot faster than talking speed.

I've decided you people are nuts. Kids 12 and under don't die from injuries sustained in football or soccer. They just don't. I am sure someone can pull out some bizarre situation where a small child with a congenital heart defect or something died, but that doesn't count. I am talking about blunt force trauma, snapped necks, that kind of thing.

I have two kids, 12 and 8, and there is no way in the fiery pits of hell that I would let them race a car. They don't have the decision making skills. No kids that age do. Some of them have the talent and the reflexes, but pre-pubescent children aren't capable of making life or death calculations in a split second. They can't even really comprehend the gravity of the situation either. So the parents are responsible for weighing the risks. If your kid dies due to an injury suffered racing a car, you are a complete and total failure as a parent.

I fall in to the camp where I think it's pretty sad - but if he had drowned in the pool, got hit by a car on his bike or eaten the wrong kind of nut he could be just as dead. My kids were riding bikes in the street at 4 and 5. They were driving karts at 6 and racing them by 8 or 9. Never a scratch. My youngest lost a finger playing in the house under the supervision of a babysitter. E36 M3 happens.

People can and do die. From all kinds of things.

Condolences to his family.

Otto Maddox wrote: I've decided you people are nuts. Kids 12 and under don't die from injuries sustained in football or soccer. They just don't. I am sure someone can pull out some bizarre situation where a small child with a congenital heart defect or something died, but that doesn't count. I am talking about blunt force trauma, snapped necks, that kind of thing.

A cousin of a very good friend died at 12 from hitting the ice in a hockey hit.