Hybrid Turbo

Vigo wrote: As for pumping losses, it is pretty much impossible to improve efficiency by using more throttle to minimize pumping losses unless you also have full fuel and ignition control so you can minimize the power the engine creates during a given situation by running it super lean. If you DO have that control, then it is possible.

• Or can change the rpm to meet power requirements (CVT)
• Or you close the valves on the power stroke (psuedo-Atkinson)

Vigo wrote: As for pumping losses, it is pretty much impossible to improve efficiency by using more throttle to minimize pumping losses unless you also have full fuel and ignition control so you can minimize the power the engine creates during a given situation by running it super lean. If you DO have that control, then it is possible.

Uh, yea? There's control over the throttle, cams, spark, fuel, wastegate, bypass valve. There's control over everything.

You don't need to run it lean to reduce pumping losses, just set the cams so that you use them correctly. With cam control, you can trim the overlap so that you get EGR- which reduces pumping losses when done right, as well as changing the borderline, and even changes the kind of combusion one gets (lots of ideas to lower the peak temp so that there's more pressure relative to temperature, thus lowering the losses to heat). It's also pretty easy to set the cams so that they are almost a miller cycle, where the expansion ratio is bigger than the compression ratio.

In other words, there's still ways to find efficiency out of the otto cycle engines.

ProDarwin wrote:

Conquest351 wrote: Didn't they do this in WW2 on a big ass bomber and use the exhaust to turn accessory drives for generators & air compressors? Exhaust Gas Recovery System. They used it to turn little turbines and power APUs or something.

There was also a system that took mechanical power directly off the turbo and drove the crankshaft: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbo-compound_engine

That's what I was thinking of....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_R-3350_Duplex-Cyclone

Or can change the rpm to meet power requirements (CVT) Or you close the valves on the power stroke (psuedo-Atkinson)

Uh, yea? There's control over the throttle, cams, spark, fuel, wastegate, bypass valve. There's control over everything.

Well excuse me. I was talking in terms of grassroots diy stuff you can do on a limited budget, not what is technically possible for ballers. Just work out individual infinitely variable valve actuation and you're ALL SET, right? Heck, then you can put some MORE valves into your intake and exhaust and turn the engine into an air pump to charge up an accumulator tank under decel and feed that back to the engine to get moving again after a stop! It's all being done right now! Nothing pie in the sky about any of it..

But it's almost totally irrelevant to a DIY'er, especially since most of them still seem to get most of their jollies talking about they cant recoup the cost of any efficiency improvements for 38000 years and therefore will continue driving their 17mpg POS forever.

Shoulda known not to bring pragmatism into a thread about f1 related technology.