I thought only Mustang drivers did this:

I hardly ever use my horn. what good does it do ?

Vent your frustration , yes. The other driver couldn't care less even if he did hear it over his loud music.

A beep to warn a pedestrian or bicyclist is good.

However, last Sunday, I had just entered a traffic circle when an SUV, from the right, simply drove into the circle in front of me. So I leaned on the horn to say, "hey, you are not supposed to do that".

There was no danger as I saw him/her coming.

Just frustration as to what could have been.

iceracer wrote: "Hard on the brakes" Shouldn't we have seen some smoke or heard some tire squeal ? Or would the ABS prevent that ?

From the distance that vid was shot I doubt you see anything unless he locked up which is unlikely given ABS.

On the horn thing. I use my horn more than ever these days. It's used several times a week to indicate to the car ahead of me that the light has been green for a second or so now so they should strongly consider looking up from the screen of their phone and consider moving forward.

iceracer wrote: "Hard on the brakes" Shouldn't we have seen some smoke or heard some tire squeal ? Or would the ABS prevent that ?

You won't see smoke and squeal without full lock, and most modern abs can prevent this.

I'd guess it was a case of the Morgan driver overestimating how quickly his car can accelerate. Between how open they are and being low to the ground, many LBC's can "feel" a lot faster than they are.

I drive a lot and honk the horn several times weekly while taking proper evasive maneuvers. It has helped me avoid many accidents. I do not understand the problem.

I don't even understand how honking avoids accidents.

Both hands on the wheel and quick decisive control avoids accidents.

These guys are both idiots. The driver pulled out when he should not have.

The accident happened 100 feet down the road. Most cars can almost stop completely from 60 MPh in 100 to 130 feet.

Both idiots.

Horns have one important feature y'all are missing. They are pretty much the only feedback mechanism for drivers. You do something stupid, someone honks, you know what you did was stupid. No one honks, you go on thinking it was fine.

It is a proven traffic fact that areas that have more honking have better drivers (less crashes and injuries per vehicle mile). One theory is that the more frequent feedback makes people better.

wvumtnbkr wrote: I don't even understand how honking avoids accidents.

It can in some cases where the other driver can do something to help avoid the accident (like moving back into the lane they're leaving). But only if the horn is used early enough in the sequence of events and the other person reacts to it.

Looked like the driver in the blue was standing on the brakes, laying on the horn and probably a case of target fixation instead of looking for an escape route. I forget where but read something about abs not having a huge impact on accident avoidance (see what I did there)?

In reply to Robbie:

I'm not trying to be argumentative. I just don't believe honking is a positive thing. For a period of about ten years I was driving a lot, doing usually from 200-500 miles a day six or seven days a week. I never once found a situation where I felt honking the horn was the correct course of action. So many times I can't even begin to count I've been pulled out in front of, tried to merge into my Lane, cut off, brake checked and any thing else that you can think of. And my first instinct is always to avoid a collision. I could never even consider making noise as an appropriate response to a quickly developing situation. I just don't get it.

Because it le's the other driver know that they're about to crash into another moving object and they can drive away from that moving object they're about to crash in to. The horn is not a substitute for proper collision avoidance techniques, but a tool that can be used as an alert which I believe is its intended person.

Might this be simply a matter of geography? For instance, where traffic is light or relatively light, it might be easy enough to get out of the way, but where traffic is dense, all drivers are at the mercy of one another from time to time.

last time I had to use the horn to avoid a crash, I had somebody in a Hummer try to back into me. Honking did nothing as she kept backing up, it was only by throwing the car into reverse (while still slightly moving forwards) and hitting the gas did I avoid it. If I had stopped, she still would have hit me

Seems we have nothing but 4-way stops around here. I use my horn rather judiciously when other drivers disregard the rules of the road. When I come to a full stop and am about to cross the intersection and someone from the left or right rolls up, slows down and rolls through in front of me, they're getting my horn and my bumper two feet from their car.

If it makes just one person realize they screwed up I've done my job. I'm sure it's a character fault on my part but I cannot let people do things like that without protesting. If it's all for naught then that's on me.

My SE-R doesn't have a functioning horn. Dmv only checks emissions. The SE has a ratty exhaust which I use to alert traffic light brain farters and scare arrogant jaywalkers at all of 15mph. Sadly that will change with a new system soon to get it through emissions.

oldtin wrote: I forget where but read something about abs not having a huge impact on accident avoidance (see what I did there)?

Of course it doesn't because everyone forgets why ABS is installed in the first place. It allows steering control, while standing on the brakes, to AVOID the accident, if one doesn't panic, which I'm sure is happening here. Yep, I saw what you did there and I'm reinforcing it :-)

wvumtnbkr wrote: I don't even understand how honking avoids accidents. Both hands on the wheel and quick decisive control avoids accidents. These guys are both idiots. The driver pulled out when he should not have. The accident happened 100 feet down the road. Most cars can almost stop completely from 60 MPh in 100 to 130 feet. Both idiots.

Yes, on a prepared surface in controlled conditions when the driver knows exactly where to start braking.

You are completely discounting reaction time int he real world. At 60 mph you are traveling what, ~90ft per second?

So if by the time you recognize you need to brake and start braking, you've already used up at least 150ft. So even if the car could stop in 130 ft, the reaction time makes it nearly 300 ft.

In reply to wvumtnbkr:

I've watched it again. The car that hit him was hard on the brakes as he comes into shot and you can hear the horn before that. This is 100% the Morgans fault. Zero legal, ethical, moral or any other blame to the Peugeot that hit him.

I have a hard time blaming the rear-ending Peugeot.

It's like me poking you in the eye and blaming you for not blinking fast enough.

Closing speed looked very fast.

Considering the Morgan was hard on the gas and the other driver was hard on the brakes. Looked like more than a 20 mph hit.

No blame, just an observation.

There is a reason England is mostly roundabouts. A regular intersection seems to be a high risk proposition for your average English driver. I've even seen articles in their papers about how many senior citizens are getting killed because they haven't replaced all their intersections with roundabouts yet. Things seem better in Scotland because if you don't pay attention every second, you'll come around a blind curve and kill something. I don't know about Ireland.

The sun was in both drivers eyes. Oh wait. It was England? Never mind.

After, having to make a couple quick stops from speed the other day and how quick it happened. I believe the driver was not "Hard" on the brakes. Yes he had his foot on the brake pedal, the stop lights were on. He was hard on the horn hoping the Morgan would get out of the way. Just one more opinion taken from a short video.

In reply to Nick (Bo) Comstock:

I agree there is very little time during the avoidance manuever and I don't advise using the horn then (unless you are doing everything you can and still have time and brain capacity left over).

The horn is quite effective right after the issue is avoided though. As in, "I just had to spill my coffee because of you, e36 m3-head."

OK, we all agree that the Morgan was at fault.

What is debatable is ,did the other driver do the "proper" collision avoidance procedure.

Many opinions perceived from a short video.

iceracer wrote: Many opinions perceived from a short video.

That what we do best! Like it's our job!

Easiest way to avoid that scene is the Morgan driver needs to never do that again.

I think it was possible to have avoided that crash but it's possible that might be a high standard to hold your average driver to.

I'm sure many of you autocrossers would've fared much better. I even think many of us car guys could've avoided it.

Too bad elevated driving skills are so seemingly rare considering the consequences of collisions.