irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I was at walmart the other day picking up some mulch in my Sequoia. In front of me was a guy picking up 15 bags of mulch in his late model AUDI A6 (half the bags went into is presumably very nice back seat). In front of him was someone trying to get 6 bags into the trunk of a Jetta (I think they originally wanted 8).
These people are weirdos. I'll pick up 2 or 3 bags of mulch if needed in the back of my car. More than that? The mulch place with come by with a dump bed and drop whatever I need in my driveway for such a small fee I would never bother with bags/going to hardware store/getting my car filthy/etc.
The same goes for wood. I just ordered 7 sheets of wood for my CNC router. If I had a truck I could have picked them up. But for $35 extra, it came right to me, along with a guy to help unload it exactly where I needed it. I never left my house.
The solution for suburbanites is professional services. Much easier and cheaper than truck ownership.
Yes, I recognize there are times when professional services don't cover the gap.
GCrites80s said:
Tom Suddard said:
To be fair, aren't modern trucks so tall because they're full of good stuff? I've parked my Super Duty next to an old truck before, and I really like the durable (and HUGE) overdrive trans, V10, big gas tank that's not in the cab with me, spare tire that's not in the bed, beefy frame that carries a house in the bed, 10k lb. towing capacity, and big enough differential to do it all for 500,000 miles at 80mph without exploding. All those things take up space. And that's before you get into the crumple zones that modern vehicles incorporate, too.
You're trailering cars all the time (I assume) due to your occupation, though. All that stuff is very useful for that. Someone wanting a little truck isn't looking to do that. I don't pull enough cars to justify owning a big truck. I'd actually consider getting rid of my 1st Gen Colorado for a 2nd gen Ranger to have something that's smaller, more fun and easier on gas. Old Rangers are so fun.
Oh yeah, while I'll defend how big modern trucks are, I won't defend the way most of them are used. Mine is parked unless it's towing or hauling, and I'll use my hatchback to pick up the occasional bag or two of mulch because that's not worth breaking the truck out. I have no idea why you'd buy a 3/4 ton or bigger truck and use it as a car, that just seems miserable.
A Ridgeline would be a better vehicle for 75% of F-150 owners. But modern F-150s are also pretty nice....
All this talk about high bedrails makes me wonder why Americans rarely do flatbeds. Popular all over the world except here. You get a lot larger bed footprint, reach-in from 3-sides, and it's easy to do tooolboxes under:
Back to the Santa Cruz. My main gripe with the Ridgeline is how wide it is. The Hundog will fit parking places and narrow trails better.
Oh, and Tommy: The new Chevy 2500 HD looks like caricature of an overstuffed truck. Is there any reason besides penis measuring to have a hood so high? 
ProDarwin said:
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I was at walmart the other day picking up some mulch in my Sequoia. In front of me was a guy picking up 15 bags of mulch in his late model AUDI A6 (half the bags went into is presumably very nice back seat). In front of him was someone trying to get 6 bags into the trunk of a Jetta (I think they originally wanted 8).
These people are weirdos. I'll pick up 2 or 3 bags of mulch if needed in the back of my car. More than that? The mulch place with come by with a dump bed and drop whatever I need in my driveway for such a small fee I would never bother with bags/going to hardware store/getting my car filthy/etc.
The same goes for wood. I just ordered 7 sheets of wood for my CNC router. If I had a truck I could have picked them up. But for $35 extra, it came right to me, along with a guy to help unload it exactly where I needed it. I never left my house.
The solution for suburbanites is professional services. Much easier and cheaper than truck ownership.
Yes, I recognize there are times when professional services don't cover the gap.
Not mentioned: the third vehicle there was a Honda Odyssey. I lost count, but I'm almost certain they put 50 bags of mulch inside that thing.....and it was a 60-something lady driving it (the wally world employees loaded it for her).
Incidentally, I got 8 bags in my Sequoia, which all fit behind the third row :)
I have no need for a pickup. The Sequoia can fit 8x4 plywood inside it entirely with the seats out (which they often are), plus I do have a pickup bed trailer (used for rally support, but also for bulk material pickup).
I pay enough to live in the burbs (thank the SWMBO for that, I hate it here). I don't have extra cash to have people deliver stuff to me, lol. Whatever I need to haul, no matter how large, I'll figure out a way to get myself (flashback to the early 2000s of me carrying a full-size sleeper sofa on the Thule rack on top of my Maxima)...
Kreb (Forum Supporter) said:
All this talk about high bedrails makes me wonder why Americans rarely do flatbeds. Popular all over the world except here. You get a lot larger bed footprint, reach-in from 3-sides, and it's easy to do tooolboxes under:
Back to the Santa Cruz. My main gripe with the Ridgeline is how wide it is. The Hundog will fit parking places and narrow trails better.
Oh, and Tommy: The new Chevy 2500 HD looks like caricature of an overstuffed truck. Is there any reason besides penis measuring to have a hood so high?
I walked by one of those in my work parking lot today and thought the same thing. I'm 6 feet tall and that hood must have been about shoulder-height....made me think about how the hell you can see past that to maneuver near anything.
Related note: my white-collar (and military) office building parking lot is probably a good 40% huge pickups, and I'm pretty confident everyone in the building lives in the burbs, and hardly any of them tow anything or haul bulk stuff. My coworker with the F350 dually admitted as much to me, but he does use it twice a year to pull a 5th wheel RV. And commutes in it the rest of the year.
Yeah, the tall hoods are mostly for appearance. But also a small dose of pedestrian impact regulations and a LARGE dose of cooling capacity. A huge part of that 30k lbs. tow rating on modern trucks is the giant radiator, trans cooler, and intercooler, which all need space. Same reason modern cars all have giant grilles. Engines aren't getting that much more thermally efficient, but power outputs keep increasing.
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I pay enough to live in the burbs (thank the SWMBO for that, I hate it here). I don't have extra cash to have people deliver stuff to me, lol. Whatever I need to haul, no matter how large, I'll figure out a way to get myself (flashback to the early 2000s of me carrying a full-size sleeper sofa on the Thule rack on top of my Maxima)...
I get mulch once or twice a year. I get wood maybe a couple times a year. If you added up all the things I have delivered, it would be under $200/yr in delivery fees, and way, way, way less than the cost of owning a truck over a less capable car. If you are doing it every weekend, a truck certainly makes sense. Or if you do other things with your truck like... tow a rally car.
An odyssey will fit a 4x8 inside with the seats out. I did that exactly once and decided it was absolutely not worth the trouble. Useful in an emergency though.
ProDarwin said:
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I pay enough to live in the burbs (thank the SWMBO for that, I hate it here). I don't have extra cash to have people deliver stuff to me, lol. Whatever I need to haul, no matter how large, I'll figure out a way to get myself (flashback to the early 2000s of me carrying a full-size sleeper sofa on the Thule rack on top of my Maxima)...
I get mulch once or twice a year. I get wood maybe a couple times a year. If you added up all the things I have delivered, it would be under $200/yr in delivery fees, and way, way, way less than the cost of owning a truck over a less capable car. If you are doing it every weekend, a truck certainly makes sense. Or if you do other things with your truck like... tow a rally car.
An odyssey will fit a 4x8 inside with the seats out. I did that exactly once and decided it was absolutely not worth the trouble. Useful in an emergency though.
I guess thats the upside of the new hyundai trucklet: it has the bed to haul occasion al mulch, but has the comfort and small size of a CUV for everyday commuting.
We use a truck for volume, not weight. We're transporting surf/paddle boards and/or foam most often. My dad just bought an F150 because the ranger crew cab doesn't come with a long bed. He doesn't need the capacity of the F150 but they won't make a ranger with a useful length bed.
Give me this Hyundai or a Ridgeline or... competitor with a useable length(7' or bigger) bed please.
Trent
PowerDork
4/2/21 9:10 a.m.
Tom Suddard said:
Yeah, the tall hoods are mostly for appearance. But also a small dose of pedestrian impact regulations
Does not compute. The tall hood lines are directly responsible for the recent substantial increase in pedestrian deaths. The increased size and popularity of trucks and SUVs is the main cause of the 68% increase in pedestrian fatalities in the last decade according to the NHTSA and IIHS.
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
ProDarwin said:
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I pay enough to live in the burbs (thank the SWMBO for that, I hate it here). I don't have extra cash to have people deliver stuff to me, lol. Whatever I need to haul, no matter how large, I'll figure out a way to get myself (flashback to the early 2000s of me carrying a full-size sleeper sofa on the Thule rack on top of my Maxima)...
I get mulch once or twice a year. I get wood maybe a couple times a year. If you added up all the things I have delivered, it would be under $200/yr in delivery fees, and way, way, way less than the cost of owning a truck over a less capable car. If you are doing it every weekend, a truck certainly makes sense. Or if you do other things with your truck like... tow a rally car.
An odyssey will fit a 4x8 inside with the seats out. I did that exactly once and decided it was absolutely not worth the trouble. Useful in an emergency though.
I guess thats the upside of the new hyundai trucklet: it has the bed to haul occasion al mulch, but has the comfort and small size of a CUV for everyday commuting.
Yeah, I can see the value here. Seems great for the weekday commuter/errands machine, occasionally picking up stuff at hardware stores, and transporting active equipment (would 2 bikes fit in the back with the tailgate down? That would be great), without all the misery that comes with a full size truck.
I totally get the desire for this type of vehicle, I was just pointing out earlier that putting 50 bags of mulch in any vehicle is pretty silly.
wae
UberDork
4/2/21 9:33 a.m.
ProDarwin said:
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
ProDarwin said:
irish44j (Forum Supporter) said:
I pay enough to live in the burbs (thank the SWMBO for that, I hate it here). I don't have extra cash to have people deliver stuff to me, lol. Whatever I need to haul, no matter how large, I'll figure out a way to get myself (flashback to the early 2000s of me carrying a full-size sleeper sofa on the Thule rack on top of my Maxima)...
I get mulch once or twice a year. I get wood maybe a couple times a year. If you added up all the things I have delivered, it would be under $200/yr in delivery fees, and way, way, way less than the cost of owning a truck over a less capable car. If you are doing it every weekend, a truck certainly makes sense. Or if you do other things with your truck like... tow a rally car.
An odyssey will fit a 4x8 inside with the seats out. I did that exactly once and decided it was absolutely not worth the trouble. Useful in an emergency though.
I guess thats the upside of the new hyundai trucklet: it has the bed to haul occasion al mulch, but has the comfort and small size of a CUV for everyday commuting.
Yeah, I can see the value here. Seems great for the weekday commuter/errands machine, occasionally picking up stuff at hardware stores, and transporting active equipment (would 2 bikes fit in the back with the tailgate down? That would be great), without all the misery that comes with a full size truck.
I totally get the desire for this type of vehicle, I was just pointing out earlier that putting 50 bags of mulch in any vehicle is pretty silly.
Truth. If you're buying that much, get a full skid and have them put it on the trailer. Then take back what you don't use. Now you only have to lift each bag exactly once!
I would have a tucklet to replace two of my existing vehicles if I could afford the price of admission. (used redigline are still spendy here) I have an old full size gmc van, that I use for truck duty and really nothing else (12mpg does not make a good commuter) I also have a hand me down 1st gen CRV for use as winter snow car and "larger car" duty. One of these trucks would serve both purposes very well and still be able to tow the occasional car.
wae
UberDork
4/2/21 9:51 a.m.
Oh, I would add that I would much prefer to have a Ridgeline or maybe even the Hyundai over the Excursion for most of what I do truckstuff with. The Ex is nice for being able to carry 7 people and with a family of 5 that was needed occasionally back when we were allowed to do.... Things. Most of my towing is close to or under the 5k line - the trailer is probably about 2k and the Neon is just a hair over 2k as well plus tires and stuff.
The main reason I stayed away from the Ridgeline in the past though was that I just can't get comfortable with the idea of towing with a Honda transmission. In my brain I know that is irrational thinking but after the disaster that was the 99-03 Oddity transmission my heart just can't trust them.
I love the way these look, though, and it really is just trucky enough while having much better manners on the road and at the pump.
I switched from mulch to lava rocks. Haven't had to get mulch in 5+ years. Solution to mulch problem solved. Time to move on from that conundrum.
wae said:
The main reason I stayed away from the Ridgeline in the past though was that I just can't get comfortable with the idea of towing with a Honda transmission. In my brain I know that is irrational thinking but after the disaster that was the 99-03 Oddity transmission my heart just can't trust them.
The Ridgeline Tranny isn't the same as the Odyssey. A friend used his 2008 to pull a camper all over the country without a lick of trouble.
Going back to the idea that massive snouts are safer on pedestrians... I don't buy it. If you get whacked by a 5-foot tall grille, you're just a bug, whereas a lower grille stands a chance of deflecting your body so that you don't get the entire force of the impact at once. The thought that you need a lot of acreage for radiator makes some sense, but otherwise, I see no good reason to have enough room in the engine bay for a roots supercharger plus tunnel-ram intake. Besides the macho thing, that is. And god help the short person who never gets seen by the driver.
I'm not an expert on when pedestrian regulations stop mattering much (I know big stuff like a truck avoids some regulations) but yes, taller hoods are safer for pedestrians. They create more crumple between the person and the hard parts underneath, so the pedestrian doesn't whack the engine without decelerating some first. That's one reason modern cars are all so huge.
AaronT
Reader
4/2/21 11:43 a.m.
The ridgeline or Santa Cruz are likely candidates for replacing MrsAaronT's crosstour. She likes to sit higher and we have some hobbies/aspirations that require small towing capacity and/or dirt road clearances.
Tom Suddard said:
I'm not an expert on when pedestrian regulations stop mattering much (I know big stuff like a truck avoids some regulations) but yes, taller hoods are safer for pedestrians. They create more crumple between the person and the hard parts underneath, so the pedestrian doesn't whack the engine without decelerating some first. That's one reason modern cars are all so huge.
I'm pretty sure that point is around the bottom of the bumper on the GM truck pictured above.
karplus2 said:
Keith Tanner said:
I swear everyone on the GRM forum is into slammed minitrucks with the bed side comments.
I like high bed sides. Lets me put stuff in the bed. My first-gen Tundra had lower bed sides, I could only stack tires one level deep with the cover on. Now I can stack them two levels deep.
My dad has an 02 Ranger 2wd xl that only had AC and a sliding rear window as options. He has had it since new and has been looking to replace it for a few years now. He can't find anything he likes because the load height is so much higher on everything now. He is super excited about the possibility of a Maverick/SantaCruz. He really likes being able to reach over the bed-sides to reach what he wants to retrieve/load. We let him borrow our 2019 Ridgeline but he said that even that was too high for him.
I've had trucks of various sizes in my driveway for daily use for about 30 yrs now,hate how high the new trucks are in general.
But it was drilled into me that there's a tailgate for a reason,its how its loaded/unloaded and nothing goes over the sides of the truck.
And you can see the reason why when you look at the unscarred sides of my trucks despite being used as a truck every day. ;)
Tom Suddard said:
I'm not an expert on when pedestrian regulations stop mattering much (I know big stuff like a truck avoids some regulations) but yes, taller hoods are safer for pedestrians. They create more crumple between the person and the hard parts underneath, so the pedestrian doesn't whack the engine without decelerating some first. That's one reason modern cars are all so huge.
I'd rather get hit by a ND miata at 10 mph vs a new silverado. ND Miata will likely afford me the opportunity to land on the hood with some damage to my legs/hips. Big truck would probably smack me in the head, throw me to the ground, where I hit my noggin again on some hard asphalt/concreto
Tom Suddard said:
I'm not an expert on when pedestrian regulations stop mattering much (I know big stuff like a truck avoids some regulations) but yes, taller hoods are safer for pedestrians. They create more crumple between the person and the hard parts underneath, so the pedestrian doesn't whack the engine without decelerating some first. That's one reason modern cars are all so huge.
If that applied here, wouldn't the NHTSA be instructing Honda Civics to have 5' high hoods?
Kreb (Forum Supporter) said:
Tom Suddard said:
I'm not an expert on when pedestrian regulations stop mattering much (I know big stuff like a truck avoids some regulations) but yes, taller hoods are safer for pedestrians. They create more crumple between the person and the hard parts underneath, so the pedestrian doesn't whack the engine without decelerating some first. That's one reason modern cars are all so huge.
If that applied here, wouldn't the NHTSA be instructing Honda Civics to have 5' high hoods?
In this case, taller is relative to the stuff under the hood, not taller from the ground.
In reply to rslifkin :
If you'll track back the thread, the motor is nowhere near that high, so the only reasons we can think of are needed radiator/oil cooler volume and style.
But I'm dead guilty of hijacking. Sorry y'all.
