Indecisive...Track, Daily, or Both?

I need some help deciding where I want to go. I've put a few track days on my 13' speed3 and it's done great on nothing but SS lines, RBF-600, a rear sway bar, and Stop-Tech SS lines. I'm pretty much hooked and am anticipating many more track days to go. With that said, this MS3 is my one and only car that I'm still making payments on. If something were to happen to it on the track I'd be screwed. I'm torn between having a nice MS3 that I drive 80% at the track to make sure I don't destroy it (not sure if that'll be possible once I'm actually rolling, but it's what I'm telling myself now), or leave the MS3 as is and build a almost full track car (something I don't have to put on a trailer).

For the track car I was thinking a Honda EG/EK hatch (very light, cheap)

Or a miata (still pretty light, RWD, bit more expensive than the honda)

Before tracking I've had a nice daily, it's nice to have, look at, and have others admire your taste, but it's also nice to have good track times. I'm torn...

Check with your insurance agent. Some insurance companies have policies that cover HPDEs (non-timed events). Others forbid it. I just switched companies and now my RX-8 is covered on track. That said, if something does happen, your rates will go up.

I now have a DD and the RX-8 is in the garage most of the time. I plan on selling it next spring and getting a more track oriented car that is "street legal" and fully paid for.

If you can afford it you should go with a separate track car. If you don't have at least 2 cars anyway, you're asking for trouble.

CGLockRacer wrote: Check with your insurance agent. Some insurance companies have policies that cover HPDEs (non-timed events). Others forbid it. I just switched companies and now my RX-8 is covered on track. That said, if something does happen, your rates will go up. I now have a DD and the RX-8 is in the garage most of the time. I plan on selling it next spring and getting a more track oriented car that is "street legal" and fully paid for.

What company?

I know Lockton Affinity offers HPDE only policies for certain events, but it still has a $5k deductible.

Also, do you have to cash to actually go regularly? Otherwise, you'll have a bunch of money tied up in a car that you never use, you're adding something else to maintain, etc.

I just parted out my track car and I'm about to build up my '06 Miata as a dual-duty car that I'll auto-X/HPDE a few times a year. I didn't like having a $13k car sit in the garage for all but 6 weekends a year at a $600-700 tab per weekend to run.

If you have the cash to go regularly and the space for it, and your group allows it. Consider a low end formula car or legends car. If you get on apex speed and local roundy round groups you can pretty quickly find a deal for a nice formula v or 600cc legends car for 4k or a formula ford or other old formula car that needs work for that money. The legends car would just need a new left front spindle made for it and some setup changes before it could go out. Any of these could be towed on a small trailer behind the MS3. And they're cheaper to fix if you ball it up, especially the legends car.

In reply to z31maniac:

Westgate Insurance Agency, but they are in Toledo, OH. You can see what companies they use and find an agent near you though.

Leafy wrote: If you have the cash to go regularly and the space for it, and your group allows it. Consider a low end formula car or legends car. If you get on apex speed and local roundy round groups you can pretty quickly find a deal for a nice formula v or 600cc legends car for 4k or a formula ford or other old formula car that needs work for that money. The legends car would just need a new left front spindle made for it and some setup changes before it could go out. Any of these could be towed on a small trailer behind the MS3. And they're cheaper to fix if you ball it up, especially the legends car.

I never really considered that, any insight as to where I might be able to find them for sale?

Don't know if the group will allow formula v cars since they're open top, but I know they are okay with legends cars since I've seen a few run with us. I never really looked into them since I just assumed they were really expensive.

dooodstevenn wrote:

Leafy wrote: If you have the cash to go regularly and the space for it, and your group allows it. Consider a low end formula car or legends car. If you get on apex speed and local roundy round groups you can pretty quickly find a deal for a nice formula v or 600cc legends car for 4k or a formula ford or other old formula car that needs work for that money. The legends car would just need a new left front spindle made for it and some setup changes before it could go out. Any of these could be towed on a small trailer behind the MS3. And they're cheaper to fix if you ball it up, especially the legends car.

I never really considered that, any insight as to where I might be able to find them for sale? Don't know if the group will allow formula v cars since they're open top, but I know they are okay with legends cars since I've seen a few run with us. I never really looked into them since I just assumed they were really expensive.

apex speed forums, scca forums, nasa forums, insert your local circle track here (for legends).

Leafy wrote:

dooodstevenn wrote:

Leafy wrote: If you have the cash to go regularly and the space for it, and your group allows it. Consider a low end formula car or legends car. If you get on apex speed and local roundy round groups you can pretty quickly find a deal for a nice formula v or 600cc legends car for 4k or a formula ford or other old formula car that needs work for that money. The legends car would just need a new left front spindle made for it and some setup changes before it could go out. Any of these could be towed on a small trailer behind the MS3. And they're cheaper to fix if you ball it up, especially the legends car.

I never really considered that, any insight as to where I might be able to find them for sale? Don't know if the group will allow formula v cars since they're open top, but I know they are okay with legends cars since I've seen a few run with us. I never really looked into them since I just assumed they were really expensive.

apex speed forums, scca forums, nasa forums, insert your local circle track here (for legends).

Thanks, I looked around and the car + trailer + extra wheels/tires might be a bit too heavy to tow in the MS3. Technically there is no tow capacity what so ever in North America, but the same car in europe has a 1,000 lb capacity. The car and everything I'm estimating will be about 1300 lbs.

dooodstevenn wrote:

Leafy wrote:

dooodstevenn wrote:

Leafy wrote: If you have the cash to go regularly and the space for it, and your group allows it. Consider a low end formula car or legends car. If you get on apex speed and local roundy round groups you can pretty quickly find a deal for a nice formula v or 600cc legends car for 4k or a formula ford or other old formula car that needs work for that money. The legends car would just need a new left front spindle made for it and some setup changes before it could go out. Any of these could be towed on a small trailer behind the MS3. And they're cheaper to fix if you ball it up, especially the legends car.

I never really considered that, any insight as to where I might be able to find them for sale? Don't know if the group will allow formula v cars since they're open top, but I know they are okay with legends cars since I've seen a few run with us. I never really looked into them since I just assumed they were really expensive.

apex speed forums, scca forums, nasa forums, insert your local circle track here (for legends).

Thanks, I looked around and the car + trailer + extra wheels/tires might be a bit too heavy to tow in the MS3. Technically there is no tow capacity what so ever in North America, but the same car in europe has a 1,000 lb capacity. The car and everything I'm estimating will be about 1300 lbs.

I'm surprised its that low.

How about a street legal legends car? I haven't looked into it that much, but being in california I have my doubts.

Ignoring all the other somewhat bizarre suggestions...

As an HPDE instructor, I'd suggest you get the Miata and keep your daily car for street use. It's too easy for bad things to happen on a track and insurance in most cases won't cover you (and may, in fact, drop you completely). You can pick up Miatae so cheaply these days it's almost foolish not to go this route.

I've had two students with Miatas this year; one was a beginner, though did come from motorcycles. Both my guys were shockingly quick. Some was talent, but a lot of it was the car. It just is so easy to drive and gives such confidence that the driver is able to progress quickly without having to fight an unwilling car. Just make sure you have a roll bar of the proper specification.

I'd go with the Miata over the Honda because it's simply more fun and not wrong wheel drive.

ddavidv wrote: Ignoring all the other somewhat bizarre suggestions... As an HPDE instructor, I'd suggest you get the Miata and keep your daily car for street use. It's too easy for bad things to happen on a track and insurance in most cases won't cover you (and may, in fact, drop you completely). You can pick up Miatae so cheaply these days it's almost foolish not to go this route. I've had two students with Miatas this year; one was a beginner, though did come from motorcycles. Both my guys were shockingly quick. Some was talent, but a lot of it was the car. It just is so easy to drive and gives such confidence that the driver is able to progress quickly without having to fight an unwilling car. Just make sure you have a roll bar of the proper specification. I'd go with the Miata over the Honda because it's simply more fun and not wrong wheel drive.

Yeah, everyone runs miatas in california and it kind of jacks up the price a bit, but they're still really affordable. I looked into a legends car and 150 hp in a 1100 lb car sounds like a ton of fun, but I don't have a truck or tailer to tow the thing which makes it really impractical. On the other hand, it seems like I can have a NB with some tasteful and functional mods for about 5 grand, so it's definitely up there on my list.

I still dont understand how low the tow rating on the mazdaspeed is. I would tow a legends car on a snowmobile trailer without even giving it a 2nd thought.

Leafy wrote: I still dont understand how low the tow rating on the mazdaspeed is. I would tow a legends car on a snowmobile trailer without even giving it a 2nd thought.

There isn't even a tow rating in North America. The 1000 lb figure I found was what people were towing in Europe. I have access to a van and f150 both with tow packages that will be fine, but I can't guarantee access to them when I have an event since they are family members' cars.