Is fuel from a hurricane-affected gas station safe?

A hurricane just hit. Is that fuel sold at the local gas station still safe to use? So we talked with a trusted friend in the fuel business.

First, those vents that you see at every gas station? The openings sit well above ground level and feature check valves.

And the tanks themselves? Even though most of those tanks sit …

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Thanks for the write-up.  Figured there was a way to keep moisture out of the tanks and general system, but never knew the specifics.

What's dissolved water?

Cool info, I've wondered that before :)

SV reX said:

What's dissolved water?

Ethanol in gas absorbs water.

10ml of ethanol and 10ml of water gives you 19ml total volume.  

I wonder how idiot-proof this stuff is. Like, can a careless or incompetent operator easily contaminate their own supply by being careless around these safety measures, or is that stuff well-separated from unqualified hands?

In reply to JG Pasterjak :

It almost seems like even if you try to mess up the fuel, there are enough widgets in place that will prevent someone from filling up their car with watery gas.

That being said, I'm sure those safety measures are only useful if they are regularly maintained.

JG Pasterjak said:

I wonder how idiot-proof this stuff is. Like, can a careless or incompetent operator easily contaminate their own supply by being careless around these safety measures, or is that stuff well-separated from unqualified hands?

Oh, I bet an idiot could find a way....

In reply to JG Pasterjak :

I worked in a gas station during the early 70s "gas crisis". I checked the tank levels so the manager knew how much fuel to order. Our tanks had provisions for locks and we locked them.

SV reX said:

What's dissolved water?

Buzz Killington here... Technically, the term is Miscible.  Dissolution indicates that the physical state of one substance changes, like sugar in water goes from a solid to being dis-solved.  Soluble items also indicate having a saturation point.  In this example, you can only dissolve X amount of sugar in water.

Items like water and ethanol don't have a saturation point and they don't change physical states when mixed, so they are referred to as miscible.  Things like Vodka or antifreeze are miscible, meaning they can exist in any concentration of water.

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

That's what I was thinking...

I can see the tanks having secure fillers and vents , 

But what about the pumps ,  if they are submerged  or damaged ? are they as secure ?

I filled up my car once years ago and it immediately started running rough and a little later barely ran. I siphoned the crappy gas out of the tank and drove slowly down a gravel road with the door open and slowly poured the gas out over the distance of about a mile per 5 gallons. I had thoughts of a static discharge blowing myself up the entire time.

I have no idea where the water came from but I have heard that to separate different batches of fuels going through the same pipeline, they use water as a separation plug and somehow remove the water later.

I told the owner of the station about his crappy gas and he got all huffy and said his fuel was perfect and accused me of lying. I never spent another dime at his establishment ever again. And then he eventually died.

On another note, I am no chemist, but I did take a year of college chemistry. I have always been under the assumption that adding alcohol to gasoline and water, the water mixes with the alcohol which then also mixes with the gasoline so that everything mixed together can flow through the engine and burn up during combustion. 

The problem with ethanol gas is since the gasoline base stock is of such poor octane quality that it can't be used without the added octane boost of the 10% ethanol mix. Does the ethanol still add the octane boost once it's mixed with equal parts water?

I need to put some non-ethanol gasoline into a mayonnaise jar, add food dyed water, and then add equal parts alcohol to see if everything mixes homogeneously together and then see if it all burns when lit on fire.

I suppose for the alcohol/water mix I could just use 90 proof vodka mixed with food dye.

In reply to VolvoHeretic :

Some related reading on the Classic Motorsports site about using alcohol–methanol, specifically–to help an engine digest fuel contaminated with water right here.

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

Items like water and ethanol don't have a saturation point and they don't change physical states when mixed, so they are referred to as miscible.  Things like Vodka or antifreeze are miscible, meaning they can exist in any concentration of water.

Let's say you decided to mix some ethanol (we'll use Vodka as an example) not with gasoline, but with cranberry juice, Cointreau (or Triple Sec) and lime juice.  What would you call that?

In reply to 1988RedT2 :

A good start to the afternoon.

David S. Wallens said:

In reply to VolvoHeretic :

Some related reading on the Classic Motorsports site about using alcohol–methanol, specifically–to help an engine digest fuel contaminated with water right here.

Sorry, the link appears to be dead.

Even with all the safeguards I've seen issues occur with diesel from the pump, and surprising it was at a high volume station. 

Luckily it was one of the GM square body pickups with dual tanks. We never ran either tank below about 1/4 before switching. After switch tanks, changing the fuel filter and draining out the water (several times), the 6.2 came back to life on the uncontaminated tank. 

The station took responsibility and paid the cost of draining the tank, replacing the contaminated fuel, and the fuel filter. 

VolvoHeretic said:

David S. Wallens said:

In reply to VolvoHeretic :

Some related reading on the Classic Motorsports site about using alcohol–methanol, specifically–to help an engine digest fuel contaminated with water right here.

Sorry, the link appears to be dead.

Operator error. I fixed the link and will place it here, too:

Water Is Great for Your Plants, Not So Much for Your Fuel System

1988RedT2 said:

Let's say you decided to mix some ethanol (we'll use Vodka as an example) not with gasoline, but with cranberry juice, Cointreau (or Triple Sec) and lime juice.  What would you call that?

A Flaming Russian 3 Way?

definitely not