Claff
Claff HalfDork
1/4/22 11:41 p.m.

Back in 2014, I had my driveway expanded with 4" thick concrete, including a fairly wide pad next to my one-car garage. Initially the pad was supposed to be for a place to keep my trailer when it's not in use, but I've been winding up using my trailer way more often than I thought so it doesn't make sense to move stuff around to badly back the trailer in just to take it back out for the following weekend. The trailer lives on the side of the street behind the truck.

We have an autocross club that uses the local minor league ballpark, and contract with that club to keep its equipment van since we live closest to the site, have the space, and have two drivers so we can get the van there while also getting our car there.

But said autocross club hasn't hosted an event in two years, and an informal poll of the powers that be in that club shows only tepid interest in putting something on down the road (the local site has unresolved issues with nearby neighborhoods and won't schedule anything until those are dealt with, whenever that might happen). In light of this, there's the possibility that the club may fold, and if that happens, the van goes away.

This would leave me with a decent-size concrete pad next to the garage that isn't great for parking cars (whatever winds up there will get blocked in by whatever's in the main driveway). At some point I got the thought that maybe it could be used for a two-post lift.

I don't remember the PSI of the concrete used, but last I looked, it meets the specifications I found somewhere online for being able to have a lift on it. I'll have to dig up the paperwork from the concrete contractor to be sure.

The biggest question mark is about how weather-proof these lifts are. I've seen outside lifts on car-building reality shows, but they're usually in southern California. We're not there, we're just south of Washington DC where we get rain and snow and cold. I don't know if they make lifts that can shrug stuff like that off or if they're all designed to just be used inside or in very dry environments.

As an aside, I wonder if I really need a two-post lift. While my garage isn't big enough to work on stuff inside it (it *might* if I clean it out like I've been meaning to, but even empty it's kinda tight), I have a Quickjack and do a lot of my own work in the driveway just outside the garage door. I don't need the lift, but I think it would come in handy at times, assuming it doesn't get all rusty from being outside.

I'm curious how the members of a forum that makes/enables a lot of dumb ideas think about what could be just another dumb idea.

aircooled
aircooled MegaDork
1/4/22 11:56 p.m.

Probably not useful based on you comments, but I know someone who has a two post lift he bought from a shop that had it outside for many years.  He also bought another, new one, and but that one outside.  He of course is in SoCal.

I don't think there were any obvious areas of concern or issues with either lift.  They tend to be sealed in all the important places anyway. You will clearly want to make sure to lube what should be lubed regularly.  Both lifts are two post, cross under (open at top) style.

itsarebuild
itsarebuild GRM+ Memberand Dork
1/5/22 12:46 a.m.

If you are worried about weather why not put a couple posts down outside the drive area and extend the roof.

rslifkin
rslifkin UberDork
1/5/22 7:43 a.m.
itsarebuild said:

If you are worried about weather why not put a couple posts down outside the drive area and extend the roof.

I was thinking the same.  The roof is oriented correctly for easy expansion over that pad (with or without walls to just expand the garage). 

dculberson
dculberson MegaDork
1/5/22 8:24 a.m.

You would probably need a permit to extend the roof and it would be a bit pricey. But handy! One option is a portable mid rise lift where you could unbolt the lift columns and roll them inside when unused.

I've seen outdoor lifts in Ohio and we get plenty of crud but I'm not sure how long they lasted. It was at a ... budget ... auto shop. 
 

Another roof option might be one of those solar sails. They're not perfect but they look neat and one could be put up in a weekend. 
 

j_tso
j_tso HalfDork
1/5/22 9:05 a.m.

Perhaps some big accordion bellows that fit over the posts may work?

JThw8
JThw8 UltimaDork
1/5/22 9:07 a.m.

Ive worked at shops which had full time outdoor lifts.  Keep them cleaned and lubed and it shouldnt be an issue.

Ian F (Forum Supporter)
Ian F (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/5/22 9:20 a.m.

I've seen a number of 2-post lifts installed outside here in the Mid-Atlantic (occasional) snow-belt. 

Opti
Opti Dork
1/5/22 9:31 a.m.

I see them all the time in North Texas at mom and pop shops. We get plenty of rain. My guess would be keep them clean and lubed, and maybe get the manufacturers take on them being outdoors.

wvumtnbkr
wvumtnbkr GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
1/5/22 9:41 a.m.

Why not one of those portable 2 post lifts?  Max Jax I think it's called.  Just need some anchors outside and can put some anchors inside and you can move the lift where you need it.

 

He'll, you could probably just leave the hydraulic system IN the garage and run your lines through the wall.

Will
Will UberDork
1/5/22 10:53 a.m.

Biggest concern for me would be rust on the hydraulic rams eating the seals.

mdshaw
mdshaw HalfDork
1/5/22 11:43 a.m.

When we put ours in, it required 6" concrete under the posts. Fortunately whoever built the shop poured 6".  You can cut out a 4' square where the posts will be & pour 6" or deeper.

Toyman!
Toyman! GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/5/22 12:49 p.m.

I have my MaxJax mounted outside. If I'm not using it, it usually gets unbolted and stored inside, but it has sat outside for months during an engine swap without issues. 

20180909_113846_HDR.jpg

If you do this on 4" concrete, keep a close eye on the concrete. Mine failed. https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/keep-an-eye-on-the-concrete-under-your-lift/179634/page1/

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 1:39 p.m.

In reply to Claff :

Take a look at Toyman's link above. There is a good amount of technical info in that about outdoor lift installation. 
 

I install about 50 lifts a year. Bottom line?  It's unlikely your slab is sufficient, but it's not hard to pour new pads. 
 

I love the idea of an outdoor lift, but I'd be careful in cold regions. Water can get in the anchor holes and freeze, causing failure. 
 

If it was me?  I'd do it on 6" steel reinforced pads, but then inspect regularly, including bouncing hard on the car bumpers before each use with the car elevated about a foot. 
 

 

AWSX1686 (Forum Supporter)
AWSX1686 (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
1/5/22 3:11 p.m.

Max Jax may be a good compromise to get lift capability and be able to get it out of the weather. Plus they are cheaper than a full 2 post. Downside is ~4' lift height vs ~6'

That said I know plenty of people install lifts outside. 

 

One other option is a 4 post lift outside, the concrete thickness requirement seems much less on those, and the cost is about the same as a normal 2 post. 

RevRico
RevRico GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
1/5/22 3:26 p.m.

So if one was to want to install a maxjax outside in the snow belt, what precautions should be taken when pouring the new 6" fiber and steel reinforced slab?

Would it even be worth the effort where it regularly stays below freezing in the winter? 

 

Just thinking that my concrete driveway is pretty cracked and uneven already, so if it were to be replaced one day, an outdoor lift could be a nice accessory

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 3:27 p.m.

In reply to AWSX1686 (Forum Supporter) :

I don't think Max Jax solves any problem a 2 post lift has. 
 

The manufacturer says they shouldn't be installed outside (though I don't know why), and their anchors are subject to the same (or worse) potential failure from freezing. 
 

I agree about the 4 post. They don't even have to be anchored at all. 

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 3:31 p.m.

In reply to RevRico :

4'x4' pad 6" thick 3500# with 1/2" rebar 12" o.c. would work fine. 
 

Id also give consideration to keeping water out of the anchor holes. Rubber plugs would work. 

Or put gravel under the pads, and drill the anchor holes all the way through so they can drain  

 

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 3:38 p.m.

...even better than rubber plugs would be short bolts with rubber washers threaded into the anchors. 
 

They'd also keep the threads clean. 

Toyman!
Toyman! GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/5/22 3:54 p.m.
SV reX said:

...even better than rubber plugs would be short bolts with rubber washers threaded into the anchors. 
 

They'd also keep the threads clean. 

This is what I did. It did a pretty good job of keeping the threads clean and the holes dry. We also don't have freezing weather to cause cracking. 

 

 

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 4:10 p.m.

If I was doing an outdoor lift, I'd do a real 2 post (not a Max Jax).

I'd install them with epoxy stainless anchor bolts, not threaded anchors. No holes to be concerned about in the slab. No freezing. No slab failure. 
 

I'd keep the controls and pumps covered, cables well oiled, etc.

But I'm a Yankee living in the South, and I don't think I would ever live in a snow region again. So, there's that. cheeky

SV reX
SV reX MegaDork
1/5/22 5:52 p.m.

One of my primary reasons for wanting an outdoor lift would be so I can put on a rain poncho and pressure wash the entire bottom of the car before doing any work. 
 

Max Jax would be almost useless for this. 

Toyman!
Toyman! GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/6/22 2:00 p.m.
SV reX said:

One of my primary reasons for wanting an outdoor lift would be so I can put on a rain poncho and pressure wash the entire bottom of the car before doing any work. 
 

Max Jax would be almost useless for this. 

As someone who does a lot of work on off-road vehicles and always puts them up in the air to clean the crap and mud from underneath before working on them, the MaxJack works very well at this. Not as good as a full-height lift, but I don't want a lift in my driveway as a permanent decoration so...

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