Learn Me: Fun Autos - Possible or Blasphemous?

Also - found a few late-2000s S6s with less than 100k miles. Probably tortuous when they break, but hey, you're getting them marked down 80% from new after only 8 years. I think that they have quite classy styling.

V10 - you know you want it

fireball123 wrote:

sesto elemento wrote: Alternatively, you could build a very fast is3 for 16k. Including purchase of the vehicle, you could do a swift racing technology stage 3 turbo kit with a new from toyota mkiv turbo supra bottom end, full exhaust. That will get you in the mid 600s for wheel horsepower. heim jointed everything from figs, turbo supra brakes, some volks. Kw v3 coils. Etc.

I never thought of the turbo kit

The thing is, if youre boosting it on a budget, the auto is cheaper anyway. The w55 manual trans doesn't handle big power that well so if you want big numbers you have to swap in the v160 (mkiv turbo supra six speed), or an r154 (mkiii turbo five speed). I've got a spare 85k mi 5sp auto that would be a great donor for a build if you want it, $500.

I liked the IS300 I drove, I thought it handled well, but I drove it for a short distance.

The new Mazda 3 has the best automatic trans I've ever driven. It might be hard to get one for $16k though.

I haven't driven many auto cars, especially newer, but the BRZ has a good one.

I voted with my wallet for a fun, agile, cruiser with an auto. '01 740i M Sport:

Find one with good records owned by an enthusiast and you'll be good. Mine had 150k on it when I bought it (for $7500) and it's needed absolutely nothing but an oil change in the year since then.

The '99-01 short wheelbase Sports were quicker than other 7 series due to the better final drive ratio, high stall converter and steptronic trans. They were also lower and had much better suspension with the 18" wheels and are very agile cars, growing smaller around you the harder you push, unlike a lot of bigger cars.

Parts are fairly cheap, it's easy to DIY on if you need to, but with proper maintenance on the part of a PO, you shouldn't need much at all.

I found that a 350Z (HR) was quite enjoyable with an automatic.

The new Lexus is200 coming out is supposed to have an iniitutive shift tranny for the track.

Chris_V wrote: I voted with my wallet for a fun, agile, cruiser with an auto. '01 740i M Sport: Find one with good records owned by an enthusiast and you'll be good. Mine had 150k on it when I bought it (for $7500) and it's needed absolutely nothing but an oil change in the year since then. The '99-01 short wheelbase Sports were quicker than other 7 series due to the better final drive ratio, high stall converter and steptronic trans. They were also lower and had much better suspension with the 18" wheels and are very agile cars, growing smaller around you the harder you push, unlike a lot of bigger cars. Parts are fairly cheap, it's easy to DIY on if you need to, but with proper maintenance on the part of a PO, you shouldn't need much at all.

Personally i wouldn't want something as big as the 740 I think the 3series would be better, Its lighter and cheaper, so u can have extra $$$ for turbo suspension etc.

how about an m3

fireball123 wrote:

Chris_V wrote: I voted with my wallet for a fun, agile, cruiser with an auto. '01 740i M Sport: Find one with good records owned by an enthusiast and you'll be good. Mine had 150k on it when I bought it (for $7500) and it's needed absolutely nothing but an oil change in the year since then. The '99-01 short wheelbase Sports were quicker than other 7 series due to the better final drive ratio, high stall converter and steptronic trans. They were also lower and had much better suspension with the 18" wheels and are very agile cars, growing smaller around you the harder you push, unlike a lot of bigger cars. Parts are fairly cheap, it's easy to DIY on if you need to, but with proper maintenance on the part of a PO, you shouldn't need much at all.

Personally i wouldn't want something as big as the 740 I think the 3series would be better, Its lighter and cheaper, so u can have extra $$$ for turbo suspension etc.

Pretty sure my 7 series was the fastest BMW at the challenge last year (autox and drag), beating an e46, e36 m3, and a supercharged e30, and maybe one more.

Mine was a generation earlier than Chris, but I have come to the opinion that BMW puts their best engineers on the flagship 7s. They can make those big dogs move.

I would own a 7 again for a rwd v8 (or 12) auto sports sedan tourer.

Surprised John hasn't been in here yet to say Q45...

The 2006 Mazda3 I had with the auto didn't suck and was pretty fun to drive. I understand the newer Mazda6 and Mazda3 automatics are even better.

fireball123 wrote: Personally i wouldn't want something as big as the 740 I think the 3series would be better, Its lighter and cheaper, so u can have extra $$$ for turbo suspension etc.

Actually an equivalent 3 series (like the 330i ZHP) is more expensive than the 7 Sport (and an M3 doubly so) and surprisingly not that much more agile (the M3 is, but for the money, it better be). My son has a 330i ZHP and it's not quite as fast and seems on par agility wise. And if you're looking for an automatic car, I'd definitely take the 7 over an automatic 3.

Robbie wrote:

fireball123 wrote:

Chris_V wrote: I voted with my wallet for a fun, agile, cruiser with an auto. '01 740i M Sport: Find one with good records owned by an enthusiast and you'll be good. Mine had 150k on it when I bought it (for $7500) and it's needed absolutely nothing but an oil change in the year since then. The '99-01 short wheelbase Sports were quicker than other 7 series due to the better final drive ratio, high stall converter and steptronic trans. They were also lower and had much better suspension with the 18" wheels and are very agile cars, growing smaller around you the harder you push, unlike a lot of bigger cars. Parts are fairly cheap, it's easy to DIY on if you need to, but with proper maintenance on the part of a PO, you shouldn't need much at all.

Personally i wouldn't want something as big as the 740 I think the 3series would be better, Its lighter and cheaper, so u can have extra $$$ for turbo suspension etc.

Pretty sure my 7 series was the fastest BMW at the challenge last year (autox and drag), beating an e46, e36 m3, and a supercharged e30, and maybe one more. Mine was a generation earlier than Chris, but I have come to the opinion that BMW puts their best engineers on the flagship 7s. They can make those big dogs *move*. I would own a 7 again for a rwd v8 (or 12) auto sports sedan tourer. Surprised John hasn't been in here yet to say Q45...

Whats the curb weight on the 7series

SWB E38 should be in the 4000 - 4200 lb range, I think.

rslifkin wrote: SWB E38 should be in the 4000 - 4200 lb range, I think.

Agree. thats right where my LWB e32 v12 was.

My LWB 740iL was 4200. The SWB Sports don't drive like they are 4000 lbs, though. The 330i ZHP comes in at about 3450 curb weight.

Can't believe that no one has mentioned G35, 350Z, 370Z. My 370 was a 6 speed, but I drove an automatic once, and I'm not sure the car is not better in automatic form. They are faster with the auto for sure, and it suits the engine well. The 2009s are drifting into your price range.

rslifkin wrote: SWB E38 should be in the 4000 - 4200 lb range, I think.

Thats too heavy for me I'm still one with the 3 series

Robbie wrote:

fireball123 wrote:

Chris_V wrote: I voted with my wallet for a fun, agile, cruiser with an auto. '01 740i M Sport: Find one with good records owned by an enthusiast and you'll be good. Mine had 150k on it when I bought it (for $7500) and it's needed absolutely nothing but an oil change in the year since then. The '99-01 short wheelbase Sports were quicker than other 7 series due to the better final drive ratio, high stall converter and steptronic trans. They were also lower and had much better suspension with the 18" wheels and are very agile cars, growing smaller around you the harder you push, unlike a lot of bigger cars. Parts are fairly cheap, it's easy to DIY on if you need to, but with proper maintenance on the part of a PO, you shouldn't need much at all.

Personally i wouldn't want something as big as the 740 I think the 3series would be better, Its lighter and cheaper, so u can have extra $$$ for turbo suspension etc.

Pretty sure my 7 series was the fastest BMW at the challenge last year (autox and drag), beating an e46, e36 m3, and a supercharged e30, and maybe one more. Mine was a generation earlier than Chris, but I have come to the opinion that BMW puts their best engineers on the flagship 7s. They can make those big dogs *move*. I would own a 7 again for a rwd v8 (or 12) auto sports sedan tourer. Surprised John hasn't been in here yet to say Q45...

You say the 7 series is faster but for 16k you could get a nice 3 series and do a 5.0 swap

fireball123 wrote: You say the 7 series is faster but for 16k you could get a nice 3 series and do a 5.0 swap

An E38 7 series is usually well under $16k, even for a pretty clean one. Plus, why would I want to put a heavy cast iron lump under the hood? There's no way a 5.0 isn't significantly heavier than the stock BMW I6 in an E36/E46, so there goes some of the handling...

According to this, a 302 takes about 40 lbs off an m52. It's also much shorter so the weight would be farther back.

http://www.gomog.com/allmorgan/engineweights2.html

fireball123 wrote:

rslifkin wrote: SWB E38 should be in the 4000 - 4200 lb range, I think.

Thats too heavy for me I'm still one with the 3 series

Don't let that number fool you. As Chris_V said, the dynamics of the SWB E38 is rock solid. My 97 lacks all the goodies of a Sport and still stops, turns, and goes WAY better than the weight suggests. The non-Steptronic auto is absolutely a dream as well; it knocks out creamy shifts like you wouldn't believe.

Mrs. Zero wanted me to convert it to a six speed manual . . . After putting her first 200 miles on it . . . She wanted to keep the auto.

DaewooOfDeath wrote: According to this, a 302 takes about 40 lbs off an m52. It's also much shorter so the weight would be farther back. http://www.gomog.com/allmorgan/engineweights2.html

That chart has a weird discrepancy, so I'm gonna say it's wrong weight-wise. It says M52, but also "3.3, 3.5 big six". Those big sixes were M30s, which might be closer to that weight. The small sixes are lighter (and the M52 and newer are aluminum block). Based on a little quick research, it looks like the aluminum block M52s are in the 360 - 400 lbs range depending on which variant.

fireball123 wrote: You say the 7 series is faster but for 16k you could get a nice 3 series and do a 5.0 swap

I also had an e36 and I did do that swap. At the end of the day, the 3 series was probably faster than my 7. But I also bet I spent easily 5k and probably more like 8k on the 3 series, while I bought and built the 7 for under $2000.

They are just different cars for different purposes. If you are asking for a fun car with a good automatic trans (like this thread), then the 7 series is definitely my vote over the 3. If you are looking for what platform is the starting point for the best autox car, then 3 series might be a better answer.

I track an E92 M3 often, and I also own a regular E90 sedan, which I haven't tracked, but I know the chassis setup very well, and I can guarantee it's a great track chassis. It will be a little heavier that what you're used to with the 944, and you will have to get used to about 25% less turn-in capability, until you learn how to make it oversteer on command. Which is e36-M3-eating grins and giggles.

E90 BMW with the 6 cyl. turbo motor. Put an oil cooler on it, and get it tuned; it will be fast enough. The auto is great around town, and can be hand-shifted for track work. It's not a super-fast gear change but it is plenty fast enough. I have autocrossed one once and the gearbox can keep up with the inputs.

When you get your light track car, the E90 will be a great DD.