Specifically, none turbo models.
Where's Stefan
Specifically, none turbo models.
Where's Stefan
They're slow. 95-110hp in the US.
CIS, fuel and electrical issues abound.
reversed MK1 Golf front and Super Beetle rear suspension. Audi bolt pattern. Manual adjusting drums and solid rotors.
Engine internal parts are getting harder to source. Many haven't run long enough to really damage them. Keep the valves adjusted and the top end oiled, you'll be fine.
Ditch CIS for EFI and gain about 12hp. Add boost to the low compression motor and 220hp is possible before the clutch slips.
Audi I5 swaps are a thing as are 1.8T (not as easy).
924S and 944 are evolutions of the 924, so many parts swap over. They are pretty pure drivers cars and well balanced. Hatchback is convenient, rear seats are useless.
Whatcha need to know?
Paging Dean
I had one back in the late 90s - early 00s. Impressively solid body structure. Nice interior. Big sunroof.
The engine is not fast, but is fairly torquey. Timing belt and water pump change takes about an hour (try that on a 944). Valve adjustment is super simple as well. Clutch and driveline, not so much.
Overall a nice little car if you dont expect too much from it.
In reply to Stefan (Forum Supporter) :
This particular one has been microsquirt already and the top end redone. New valve guides, seals valve job, headgasket, timing belt, water pump, manifold gaskets etc. Was all done by a GMR'er. I'm 99% sure I'm going to buy it.
I really want to know how can I best get rid of the drum brake setup and upgrade the brakes/suspension?
Are any 944/951 and 928/968 parts swappable
Can 951 suspension swap over too?
Also, eventually I'll want more power. Turbo the 2.0 or Audi 5 cyl swap (I love that noise).
I know you can swap to 5 lug suspension and brakes from 924S or 944
I had a real 79 924S, abandoned project, in the early 2000s. It was a great track car, you were either 100% gas or brakes all the time.
Yes you can do the 5 bolt upgrade, still uses the stamped steel front a arms though. Plan on boxing them if you track the car. Not sure what the options are, mine came with 951 brakes and it stopped so hard on the track I had bruises on my shoulders from the harness. Look at 924.org for more info.
The motors are related to an audi truck but tilted over. They don't rev and cost a fortune to upgrade. Higher compression and adapting a 924 turbo head were the hot tricks long ago. Now I think a 20V audi motor would be the best choice. I toyed with installing a 50 HP nitrous shot on the stock motor, but to get any cred in the local PCA events you needed 400HP back then.
In reply to yupididit :
Find an early 944 (83-85) or an early 951 (86 only) or a 924S to get the early offset brake parts from. Mostly bolts right in. There's a change in 79 to the brake line routing that requires a slightly different master cylinder or rerouting the lines.
Use late offset 944 wheels and you'll not need flares or anything.
My 79 924 has 944 aluminum trailing arms, 924S rear hubs and early 944 front uprights. I rerouted the brake lines to match the later cars to make it easier to swap brake parts, etc. Bolted on with no issue.
Installing a 924S or 944 transaxle is also a bolt in affair to gain more power handling and/or better gearing. The transaxle mounting changed, but the 924 uses a mechanical speedo, so you can use the early mounts if you ditch the speedometer drive. The torque tube shaft is different, but will swap over with a clutch disc change to match the splines.
In reply to yupididit :
An audi 5 cyl swap never crossed my mind. But now that it has, damn I really want to find a cheap 924.
I vote W8 swap just for the extra complexity, absurdity, and cylinder count.
Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) said:I vote W8 swap just for the extra complexity, absurdity, and cylinder count.
I barely know what a w8 is let alone seen one lol
In reply to 79rex :
Some guys got VW 07k swaps running recently.
Requires custom oil pan, custom intake manifold, custom exhaust manifold, billet valve cover, bellhousing and mounts of course
In reply to Stefan (Forum Supporter) :
I sourced some 944 spindles, hubs, and brake parts. After I buy the car and sort it some then I'll pick up the necessary things to go 5 lug.
Nothing much to tell you on the standard 924 that Stefan and these other guys haven't already said. I'll just say that my 924S, now sorted out and mostly stock, is by far my favorite car to drive (and I have several good drivers...)
I still kinda want an early 4spd, 2-spoke wheel car in a cool 70s color combo with a nice interior. With a DCOE manifold. 
Another case of "i like this model of car but don't really like the one i ended up with" and then i never end up getting the one i want. How many times has this happened so far? lol
In reply to Vigo :
Every time
You said normally aspirated so I didn't post a GTS. Oh wait, yes I did!
Vigo said:I still kinda want an early 4spd, 2-spoke wheel car in a cool 70s color combo with a nice interior. With a DCOE manifold.
Another case of "i like this model of car but don't really like the one i ended up with" and then i never end up getting the one i want. How many times has this happened so far? lol
In my experience the webers are a waste. Did a cam, had the header and put carbs on it. WENT SLOWER!! Left the cam in and went back to CIS, top speed on the track was over 120. YMMV but from what I learned the motor needs more compression and the heads are dead flat. So to make power you need custom pistons, as thats where the combustion chamber lives. The SCCA racers in the 70s used turbo heads, which had a combustion chamber and used who knows what pistons. Rumor had it the motors were good for around 200 HP.
In reply to porschenut :
The trick I believe was VW flattop pistons from an aircooled motor along with the turbo heads.
You had to slot the header and I take flanges to get them to line up on the turbo head, but otherwise the turbo head looked exactly the same.
It didn't flow much better than the NA head, it just provided an easier conduit to making more compression.
The D-prod cars were at about 13:1 CR and were hand grenades with the pins pulled, they had to be rebuilt after each race weekend.
In reply to yupididit :
951 suspension in the rear is the same as the 924 and will bolt in. The differences are in the offset they used, the sway bar/dampers/torsion bars, axle lengths and 5-lug versus 4-lug. The trailing arms are the same between the regular 924/944, the Brembos use the same pattern as the single piston calipers in the rear.
They'll swap over, but you have to be aware of the offset so 924S (aluminum trailing arms) or 86 turbo hubs (steel) are needed along with their matching rotors.
The front is a bit more tricky as the 951 changed the strut mounting spacing and only 1986 uprights will work for offset and they need to be drilled on the driver's side to add the speedometer drive cable. The pieces are getting more rare though.
There are folks in the V8 944 swap world that use Lexus LS430 calipers in the front with some special adapters. There's also a Volvo 2-piston caliper that bolts on. Neither say "Porsche" on them but they fit non-turbo uprights so that opens up options a bit.
The 924 is a great car to start in terms of handling and learning how to drive it fast using momentum. My car, which I have tracked for 7 years has been reliable and fun. When you watch what the folks in England can do with these cars it is a simple cam swap and some weight removal. I think that they are getting close to 170 hp out of the cars. Then you look at the D-Prod cars, as was indicated above, and they were close to 200 reliable power. What you are starting with is a light (2500lb) car that will be able to be modified fairly easily to run with some more powerful machinery.
I like them but that is me.
In reply to Mike924 :
The UK cars are 125hp due to higher compression and slightly different ignition timing.
The d-prod cars were highly stressed and while they often lasted the weekend, the motor was done and rebuilt/replaced afterward.
The LeMans cars made upwards of 400hp and were pretty reliable, but the mods needed for the cooling system was quite extensive (external mechanical water pump, reverse flow, etc.).
In reply to Stefan (Forum Supporter) :
So if I grab these off an 83 944 I'll still need trailing arms?
Yep. Those front uprights should work nicely.
The steel trailing arm 4-wheel disc parts bolt on to the arm, you can just nab those if you have the ability to break the nut loose (or they are already broken loose), its a good time to replace/repack the bearings.
Otherwise its probably easier to nab the trailing arms. If the torsion tube is setup for a sway bar, it would be worth grabbing that since many 924 weren't equipped with swaybars in the rear. Luckily the entire torsion bar/trailing arm assembly drops out as a unit.
Stolen from 924.org:
The 4-wheel vented disc brakes that came standard on the 944 were first offered on the 924 as an option, known by the option code M471. This means that they are a bolt-on upgrade for 924’s that were delivered with the original brake system of solid front rotors, drums in the rear. Distinguishing the two is easy without crawling under the car, as the disc/drum setup has 4-bolt wheels, whereas the disc/disc setup has 5-lug wheels.
So, converting to the 5-lug setup is really just a matter of unbolting the old components and bolting on the new ones. The hardest part is making sure you have the right parts.
First on the list is all the parts that should be replaced anyway, as they wear out and are likely already gone on the incoming parts. The wheel bearings, brake pads, brake hoses should be replaced. The brake discs should at least be turned, or replaced if too thin.
Parts that will need to be obtained from a donor car – either a 5-lug 924 or a 944 – are the brake master cylinder and booster, front discs, calipers, hubs, and spindles, and rear calipers, discs, hubs, and brake backing plates. Additionally, the hard lines that bolt up to the rear calipers should be obtained, though they can be bent from new line if necessary. For street cars, all parking brake hardware including both parking brake cables must be obtained also.
The front spindle/steering knuckle is different, and must be replaced as a unit with the hub and caliper, but the strut and the A-arm is the same, except for early 924’s (77 and earlier) which use a smaller balljoint. However, the later balljoint with the larger shaft can be swapped in without replacing the A-arm, as the balljoints are replaceable.
In the rear, less work is necessary. The backing plate which supports the caliper bolts on in place of the backing plate of the old drum brakes. The new hub which supports the disc slides on in place of the drum. However, it is adviseable, while the assembly is apart, to repack or replace the rear wheel bearings as mentioned above.
Finally, care should be exercised in the selection of the brake master cylinder. The 924 brake circuit has an X-split (diagonal corners of the car connected on the same circuits), whereas the 944 has a TT-split (front and rear on different circuits). If a 944 M/C is used, the brake lines will need to be re-routed to have the proper proportioning of the brakes front-to-rear.
And on the subject of suspension:
http://924.org/techsection/10suspension.htm
http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/susp-15.htm
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