In reply to spacecadet :
Yeah the IS300 is looking really appealing, especially from a value standpoint. I'm not sure how competitive it would be, but I like it from a daily driving perspective. I think I'm going to ignore the MazdaSpeed 3 and the RSX Type S simply from a reliability standpoint. I watched the video of the Fiesta ST rolling over which has kinda dissuaded me. The G35 is slow unless its on a bigger course, right?
Keep an eye on insurance
around here is300 have astronomical insurance and are mostly salvaged titles
Buy my Mini Cooper S 6 speed?
2007 50k on body 5000 on rebuilt motor
If you intend to use this car as a DD first, you will have to run it in Street. Modifying a car is the best way to make it uncomfortable and unreliable. I've done it too many times. It's great fun when your car is a toy, but it makes the DD suck at being a DD.
With that said, I would avoid the Lexus and Infiniti because they both suck at autocross in stock form. Too heavy and mushy.
The RSX is not a 4 seater in any shape or form.
With a good swaybar, the MS3 could be fun. They have a bad reputation for reliability, but I think that's mostly from kids that up the boost. Keep it stock, and they seem to suffer much less problems.
The FIST or FOST could also be good choices. I personally don't like their lack of LSD, but the FIST is still really fun. It can (will?) go up on two wheels though.
And since you didn't mention fuel consumption, I'll suggest the nicest RX-8 R3 you can find. Trashing them regularly keeps the rotary reliable. Locally, all the guys that autoX their RX-8 still have their original engines. Some with close to 120k miles on them.
pinchvalve said:
A Fiesta ST at 75,000+ miles is $10k and will dominate HS.
Bam.
10 years ago it was hard to find a quality, manual trans Lexus IS300. How hard is it now?
John Welsh said:10 years ago it was hard to find a quality, manual trans Lexus IS300. How hard is it now?
depends, are you ok with salvage title and blown engine?
fanfoy said:
With that said, I would avoid the Lexus and Infiniti because they both suck at autocross in stock form. Too heavy and mushy.
The RSX is not a 4 seater in any shape or form.
With a good swaybar, the MS3 could be fun. They have a bad reputation for reliability, but I think that's mostly from kids that up the boost. Keep it stock, and they seem to suffer much less problems.
The FIST or FOST could also be good choices. I personally don't like their lack of LSD, but the FIST is still really fun. It can (will?) go up on two wheels though.
The problem with a MS3 as I said before is the abysmal tire wear, I'm not kidding when I say they destroy tires. I've owned one, and aside from the fact that the motor design is now almost 15 year old tech. A Focus ST does everything a MS3 does, BETTER, except being on track, and the MS3 isn't that good at that as it is. The focus is a comfortable street car, 20%-ish better fuel economy over a MS3, focus ST can be run on 87 if fuel prices go through the roof where the MS3 can only run on 91+. The focus is also far more competitive for Autox, even in stock form it's better than a prepped MS3.
My focus has all the upsides of my MS3, with non of the downsides. my MS3 would struggle to get 25 on the freeway, my focus will get nearly 30 going 70+ and the focus does better than the MS3 in mixed driving, i usually averaged 20-21 in the speed 3 with mostly highway and the focus is getting 25+ in same conditions. The MS3 needed constant oil changes, 3500 miles was what everyone who ran them recommended, I can go 5k-7500 in the Focus and I'm still under what the Ford says I have to do. I worked for Mazda for 3 years and I love the brand, I will still push someone who mentions a MS3 to a ST everyday of the week. I purchased a used 2013 Speed3 instead of getting a 2014/15 Focus ST. I don't 100% regret the decision, but I kinda wish I had bought the Focus ST back then, it would have changed all the cars I bought.
my buddy here in DFW DD's his IS300 in STX form. It will be harder to find a nicer one, but not impossible.
I think i'm campaigning harder for a Focus ST than any of your other options. I've had mine 12 months, it has 36k miles. I love the thing.
Based on all the responses, the IS300 definitely seems to be my best bet. I like the Fiesta, but it's a bit out of my price range and it seems riskier in autocross. The G35 is my next contender, so I'll look into that too.
I really think you need to be looking at E46 330's. For $10k you can buy the nicest one around and still have money left over. They're not classed super competitively, but they're legitimately fun to drive which outweighs competitiveness for me. In fact, I think they're an LSD away from perfection.
I assume spacecadet is talking about Miles' IS300. I co-drove with him and that car is a gem, but I don't think it's representative of the platform so much as his tuning and driving ability. I think the Focus ST is a pretty special car, but FWD is a deal breaker for me.
white_fly said:I really think you need to be looking at E46 330's. For $10k you can buy the nicest one around and still have money left over. They're not classed super competitively, but they're legitimately fun to drive which outweighs competitiveness for me. In fact, I think they're an LSD away from perfection.
I wouldn't discount the E90 330i either. They're a lot more car for the money.
In reply to captdownshift :
$10k gets you 180k miles at best for an xrunner. $10k gets you a regular cab short bed 2wd 4cyl manual 2013 or older Tacoma with 50-80k miles. Also xrunners are like 3800lbs.
Might have been looking for one for rallycross recently...
If you look for an E46, find one that has already had the rear subframe mount area repaired.
^I would do that over the IS300 any day.
white_fly said:I really think you need to be looking at E46 330's. For $10k you can buy the nicest one around and still have money left over. They're not classed super competitively, but they're legitimately fun to drive which outweighs competitiveness for me. In fact, I think they're an LSD away from perfection.
I assume spacecadet is talking about Miles' IS300. I co-drove with him and that car is a gem, but I don't think it's representative of the platform so much as his tuning and driving ability. I think the Focus ST is a pretty special car, but FWD is a deal breaker for me.
The E46 is a competent platform and if you're willing to deal with the maintenance then it is an acceptable option.
I was talking about Miles's IS300.
In reply to MrChaos :
Of course in 8 years you'd still be able to sell the x-runner for $8k
Also how much GTI does $10k get these days?
captdownshift said:Also how much GTI does $10k get these days?
not enough to be close to competitive in any class and at that point the maintenance headache isn't worth it.
I shouldn't be making suggestions as I know nothing of the autocross rankings, but what about a Pontiac G8? I bring this up because you mentioned the IS300.
Wild card choice: $3,500 DD appliance (Camry, Altima, Accord, whatever) and a $2,500 ES Miata.
Since Miata is always the answer, and autocrossing anything else is a compromise of some sort or another.
MOAR cars is always the right thing.
GentlemanShark said:
- Acura RSX Type S (6.0s 0.60, 14.6s 1/4)
if you're willing to consider the RSX, the 06-11 civic Si is a better overall platform IMO. factory Torsen LSD, similar weight, much better suspension geometry and a stiff unibody with modern safety features. the coupe is a "4 seater" mostly by a stretch of the definition while the sedan can truly hold passengers at the expense of wheelbase and another 100lbs of weight. as you'd expect, the aftermarket is pretty ripe with choices and a number of these are campaigned in autocross competitively.
you're welcome to check out my build thread for my 2010 Si sedan. i'm not trying to do any motorsports yet (although the ability to be competitive was a consideration when i bought it), but I wanted all of the same characteristics you were looking for around a $10k price point. so far i'm extremely pleased with it and it truly get used for everything - backroad blasts, road trips with 3 people, daily errands, and i'm hoping to start rallycrossing it next year after i find an appropriate wheel/tire combo. they're not fast in stock form, but a lot of fun to zing the motor to the stratosphere when you feel like tearing it up.
I could sell you a 2008 G35s and a race-winning TaG kart for $10,000 - bring your own trailer.
In reply to captdownshift :
Having owned the RSX-S and now having an S60R, those numbers might be a little inflated depending on ambient air temp. The sandwich intercooler design is pretty poor for lowering IAT.
I miss my RSX dearly...
More negatives against the S60 are that: it just doesn't have any effort when it comes to handling in stock trim, dual mass flywheel makes it feel like pushing max throttle on a boat and waiting at each shift vs. instant cable throttle and regular flywheel in the RSX, and once an S60R breaks, you can buy extra K20 blocks and feed project addiction for what it might cost to repair. (Clutch slave cylinder ended up turning into a nightmare clutch replacement, flywheel resurfacing, etc. at ~$1750.) That's enough for a decent K20A2 long block with lower miles.
In reply to GentlemanShark :
I will say that having autocrossed and tracked a lowered RSX, lowered, for several years you may run into problems with more serious suspension alignments or aftermarket exhaust clearance.
That being said the car never let me down once, was a ton of fun to rip on, and was very capable with the right set of tires and brake pads. LSD makes all the difference in the world for serious competition, at the price of classing if you stick to SCCA rules.
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