LT1 F-body?

SWMBO is looking for a "fun" car to park in the (my) garage and tool around in on nice days. Watching me wrestle with my DSM and Subaru, and some friends "tuner" type cars has turned her off of them. She's really only looking for something that she can putz around in that is "fast" and doesn't really care about any other sporting virtues. Plus she's not really interested in learning how to or operating three pedals, so automatic only. Her price is limited to under $4k. The only car I could really think of that fits the criteria is a 4th gen 4-body.

Yesterday, a small used car dealer outside of our neighborhood parked a purple '94 T-top Trans Am out front. I talked her into checking it out since she had a short day at work, and she loved it. However, the car was a bit too rough around the edges for the price they wanted and she wasn't particularly fond of the people there. That being said, a local Craigslist search turned up dozens of running/driving 4th gen LT1/A4 cars in various conditions with reasonable miles, and a lone LS1/A4 car all in the $3-4K range.

I've gotten my hands dirty with 4th gen f-bodies before, but my experience is mostly limited to low mileage LS1 cars. I'm not really all that familiar with the LT1, or what to look for on 4th gen cars that have been around the block a few times.

Yes, I understand the issues with Opti-spark, and I know that changing plugs and/or installing headers takes a weekend to do. The car will most likely roll around with bolt ons (I/H/E) and maybe a tune and probably won't see launches or anything like that, therefore I'm not worried about the 4L60E and 10bolt taking a dump.

Just looking for some advice on what to look out for if we go to look at some of these cheap cars in the near future. Also, would this be something that she could get in and cruise around and then park without needing tons of attention? All of my buddies that had LS1 cars could take them out, beat the piss out of them, park it and then repeat the next weekend. The hood only ever needed to be opened for oil changes. My DSM is also pretty territorial over my tools... -_-

Thanks guys.

If your getting an A4, make sure you get a GU5 car. Its an RPO code and its located in the glove box. Its the designation for 3.23 gears, as opgposed to 2.73. Makes a big difference.

Try and find one with a clean interior. Dash pads all break and gm parts direct bumped there price to like 400 bucks for a new one. Seats are all torn and if theyre not they're about to. Sucks because the foam is discontinued IIRC, and no one really recovers them with factory style covers so not many reasonable priced alternatives out there. hawks third gen has covers for about 500 dont know about foam though. Door panels break and seperate. Make sure windows seal well, they are frameless and a whore to readjust and get right.

But really there is nothing specific about the LT1 Fbody that needs special attention besides the stuff that needs to be checked on every car. All the high mileage suspensions will be E36 M3 and miserable to drive, noisy and bangy and rough. Put some new bushing and ball joints in (like 200 bucks for everything Moog on rock auto) and the drive pretty well. Good tires and shocks make all the difference how the drive. (bilsteins are the cheapest good option at about 400, all around). Look for bent pads under the front fenders, there is a pad that says DO NOT LIFT, and everyone lift from there and it pops the fenders out. Normally you can straighten them though, not a big deal msot of the time.

LT1, look for chaffing on the opti harness that runs up from the opti to the pass side of the intake, cause many misdiagnosed optis (replacement is like 30 bucks). Its an SBC, so look for oil leaks, common spot is back of the intake, kinda a pain in the ass to do. Check the silencer on the intake elbow and the bellows for tears, let you know if they've been driving around sucking up dust and dirt.

Obviously, check for rust if thats a thing where you live, and check for E36 M3ty mods. An auto/lt1 is the perfect cheap car for dumbass high school kids to hoon and ruin. I wouldnt hesitate to buy a modded one if everything looked okay, headers and a lack of emission stuff makes service way easier.

Buy a 96-97 for the vented opti and OBDII, emissions is way easier, turn all the monitors off for the E36 M3 you remove and it should pass an OBDII inspection.

I see a lot of LT1 cars with blown head gaskets, WP is a common failure and if you get them hot its not hard to kill a HG. So take a block tester or take it to a shop that will block test it for you. HG dont die for no reason but they will if you overheat it.

LT1 plugs and wires is a WHORE. Plugs not so bad with headers, and the SLP socket, not fun but doable. Wires is a whole different story. they are routed behind and under EVERYTHING. Pretty much everything on the front of the motor has to come off to do the pass side wires

This is an impala, the most spacious engine bay an LT1 was installed in and look you can see about 3 inches of 4 plug wires. Kinda gives you an idea on the wires, and if they were recently done make sure they werent E36 M3 parts house wires, they have a tendency to arc everywhere. I believe 7 or 7.5mm is the largest you can fit in the stock looms and the bigger wires are good to have.

shbox.com is a great technical reference for 4th gen fbodies.

If you find a ttop car make sure the key works in all tops, a lot of people loose tops, get another and then you dont have a key for it.

Doing the passenger side wires sucks when the subframe and engine are on the ground and the car is six feet up.

Headers... some headers suck and some REALLY REALLY suck. I had to install a set of the kind that REALLY REALLY suck. I think the main difference is OBD-II (two close coupled cats) or OBD-I (one cat under the floor like a 3rd-gen). I ended up making tools, clearancing the passenger side header for room against the body rail and the heater box, heating and smushing all eight header tubes for bolt (not wrench, BOLT) clearance. And I had to trim the block so the driver's side header could fit. And I don't see how you can do some of the spark plugs with the catalysts in place.

The OBD-I style headers you can remove/install with sockets, no funny shaped/ground-on box and open wrenches. Spark plugs tricky but in some cases better than OE.

95 and older are an option if your area doesn't test OBDI. They don't around here, so no smog test for us.

Not sure if this is a factor, but big power and not very good handling/brakes are a pretty good combination for getting inexperienced drivers hurt.

Best part of an LT1 Camaro is that the parts you need to drop a 5.3l truck motor in are easy to find.

This does not seem like a great endorsement for LT1 Camaros and Firebirds...

DaewooOfDeath wrote: Not sure if this is a factor, but big power and not very good handling/brakes are a pretty good combination for getting inexperienced drivers hurt.

Watching these cars rack up tons of autocross trophies over the years seems to go against that.

Woody wrote: This does not seem like a great endorsement for LT1 Camaros and Firebirds...

As cheap as the LS1 cars are getting, it's pretty hard for me to justify or recommend an LT1 car.

Gearheadotaku wrote:

DaewooOfDeath wrote: Not sure if this is a factor, but big power and not very good handling/brakes are a pretty good combination for getting inexperienced drivers hurt.

Watching these cars rack up tons of autocross trophies over the years seems to go against that.

Are these cars stock when they rack up trophies?

I've driven these stock and I was unimpressed with the handling and brakes. They are also pretty bad in rates of traffic deaths. I'm sure most of that has to do with the demographic, but the sort of person who wants a "fast" car for putzing and has no interest in anything but accelleration, per the OP, seems like the sort of person who would get hurt in a Camaro.

Will wrote:

Woody wrote: This does not seem like a great endorsement for LT1 Camaros and Firebirds...

As cheap as the LS1 cars are getting, it's pretty hard for me to justify or recommend an LT1 car.

Where are the LS cars getting cheap? I would like to find somewhere that the market is a little softer than around here for these.

DaewooOfDeath wrote: They are also pretty bad in rates of traffic deaths.

That because F-bodies are toolbag magnets.

Why not a Corvette?

Knurled wrote:

DaewooOfDeath wrote: They are also pretty bad in rates of traffic deaths.

That because F-bodies are toolbag magnets.

Was talking to SWMBO about a four seat convertible for cruising around on weekend drives and was running through the available options. Top two on my list were a fourth gen trans am convertible and an XK8.

She is not a car person at all and her response to the F-body was that they are for 18 yo douchebags to sit on the side of the road and do burnouts. I was deeply disappointed because that's what I really want.

She rejected the Jag as well because she finds them hideous. We eventually settled on a 3 series convertible but I know I would be happier with the F-body.

They are great cars. Durable, big aftermarket and huge value, but you need to know what your getting into when you buy one.

I want another one after owning one for 8 years. I would dd a clean bolt on car and if I was gonna make a cheap butthurt mobile I'd grab an a4 put a huge stall, a used cc306, bolts ons, 3.73s, and spray and go run 10s for cheap, while making all the h&c ls1s cry.

Just because I have the piccies here on my computer at work.

Here's the right side plug wires in their natural habitat.

With the accessories on top of them:

And this is the engine bay view.

Let me tell ya what we had to do to make the alternator clear the tall valve covers on the new heads...

An LT1 is on the shortlist of potential V8 candidates for my RX-7, mainly for aesthetic reasons, but dang is that distributor design stupid. Could be worse, though, it could be in the back of the engine like the SBC, but come on! GM already had the tech to do coil packs. GM already was doing coil packs on the Northstar, and if Ford could figure out how to double up a pair of 4-cylinder units then GM could do something similar. Sure you would need some new, V8 specific hardware, but the Opti-Spark is already not only weird and V8 specific but it's different tech altogether. They basically put a Nissan distributor under the water pump.

Anyway, if a 265 finds its way into my RX-7, you best believe it will be running on an LS1 computer. A company sells everything you need to do it for $1000 or so, but I know I can piece things together for less.

The optispark woes are way over exaggerated by the internets. Many are misdiagnosed, and generally they are pretty reliable. They arent all that hard to do, and most people who have to keep putting optis on are messing stuff up like cracking rotors and then have them explode at redline, not sealing them or misdiagnosing them. I used a crappy reman one and spun it to 7K everyday, never gave me a problem. Did screw up two installs before that by leaving a vent tube in the frame rail allowing it to suck up water and cracking a rotor and not noticing it.

You can by fabricated tall valve cover for an LT1 with the alternator notch and speedinc makes a low mount setup if you loose the a/c.

DaewooOfDeath wrote:

Gearheadotaku wrote:

DaewooOfDeath wrote: Not sure if this is a factor, but big power and not very good handling/brakes are a pretty good combination for getting inexperienced drivers hurt.

Watching these cars rack up tons of autocross trophies over the years seems to go against that.

Are these cars stock when they rack up trophies? I've driven these stock and I was unimpressed with the handling and brakes. They are also pretty bad in rates of traffic deaths. I'm sure most of that has to do with the demographic, but the sort of person who wants a "fast" car for putzing and has no interest in anything but accelleration, per the OP, seems like the sort of person who would get hurt in a Camaro.

Bad drivers and dumb-dumbs will hurt themselves in anything. They were the car to have in SCCA F-stock and ESP for a long time. Good drivers can still compete, but newer, more powerful cars have emerged.

Opti-Spark are like Gremlins. You do not get them wet.

Learned that lesson the "fun" way. But yes, they generally aren't troublesome. They are certainly more reliable than the distributor cap setup Chevy made for the Vortec 4.3/5.0/5.7 engines, that's for sure!

Knurled wrote: Just because I have the piccies here on my computer at work. Here's the right side plug wires in their natural habitat. With the accessories on top of them: And this is the engine bay view. Let me tell ya what we had to do to make the alternator clear the tall valve covers on the new heads... An LT1 is on the shortlist of potential V8 candidates for my RX-7, mainly for aesthetic reasons, but dang is that distributor design stupid. Could be worse, though, it could be in the back of the engine like the SBC, but come on! GM already had the tech to do coil packs. GM already was doing coil packs on the Northstar, and if Ford could figure out how to double up a pair of 4-cylinder units then GM could do something similar. Sure you would need some new, V8 specific hardware, but the Opti-Spark is already not only weird and V8 specific but it's different tech altogether. They basically put a Nissan distributor under the water pump. Anyway, if a 265 finds its way into my RX-7, you best believe it will be running on an LS1 computer. A company sells everything you need to do it for $1000 or so, but I know I can piece things together for less.

you can do a distributorless ignition in them using all GM parts- they adapted the Northstar setup to the LT1 for some marine applications... all you need to do it is google the part numbers and take out a second mortgage on your house..

but the stock setup is fine, as long as you swap in a Caprice distributor that uses engine vacuum to keep air flowing thru it to keep the corrosion from starting.. also, swap on Caprice iron heads because they are better than the F body/Corvette aluminum ones, and you will actually make money on the swap because some idiot will give you more for your old heads than you will pay for your new ones..

gearheadb wrote:

Will wrote:

Woody wrote: This does not seem like a great endorsement for LT1 Camaros and Firebirds...

As cheap as the LS1 cars are getting, it's pretty hard for me to justify or recommend an LT1 car.

Where are the LS cars getting cheap? I would like to find somewhere that the market is a little softer than around here for these.

I tracked an ebay auction for a clone of my car located in Illinois--99 Z28, manual, Navy Blue Metallic, grey cloth interior. 100k+ miles, though. Anyway, my car wasn't running at the time, and I thought about buying this car if it went cheap enough. It ended up going for right around $5k, and the only reason I didn't bite was I was afraid I wouldn't care about getting my car running if I bought another one.

I've also seen LS1 cars on CL in the Southeast go for similar pricing. Before I bought my car, I even test drove a slightly ratty, very orange LS1 Z28 that the seller was asking $5k for.

In reply to novaderrik:

The fbody and vette distributor cap are also vented but only on 95 or 96 and later cars. That's not a caprice only thing.

The iron heads are stated to flow a little more in stock form, but no one ports them, the are considerably heavier, and don't they have press in studs? Horrible swap idea, leave the aluminum heads.