Mazda Dealers Put The Crack Pipe Down

After seeing some beat E30s, I've finally decided that my original love, the Miata, is the way to go. Unfortunately, Canada has a ridiculous Miata bubble. Rotten, rust-laden, beat up 1st gens go for $3500 and up, and some super clean 1st gens are going for 7k. Obviously this is madness, however the Black Book (our version of KBB) shows that some early second-gen values are fairly low (sub-$5000).

I found an (admittedly beat up) 1999 with the Nardi package, a ripped driver's seat and 112,500 miles on the clock (180,000km). The Black Book value is between $3200 on the low end and $4600 on the high end. This car is definitely on the low end. So why does the dealer want $11,995 for this thing? It's bloody recession and this car has been sitting since February.

What would you guys do? I really want to go in there with $4000 in an envelope and tell the sales manager I've been watching this car and he can take it or leave it. Thoughts?

Head south young man...

definatly time to come to the us and bring a car north..

have you tried other provinces?

dkreindler wrote: What would you guys do? I really want to go in there with $4000 in an envelope and tell the sales manager I've been watching this car and he can take it or leave it. Thoughts?

Why not try it?

Because he'll still be paying $4k for a crap can.

That $4k down here in the San Francisco Bay Area will get him a cherry 1st gen Miata and he can make a vacation out of the trip to pick it up.

^ Go south. I've long ago given up search local classified ads for a cheap Miata. On the plus side, think of the appreciation of the vehicle as it crosses the border....

One thing to remember on a car that is imported. A/C, whether working or not, gets you an extra fee at the border. If the last boder official that I asked is to be believed, if the car had A/C as a factory or part added option, even if all of the parts are removed, it's a fee. Not sure how they would know, didn't ask.

still has to be cheaper than paying several grand over what the car is worth

Ive heard of a lot of people who go to a dealer and give them a lowball offer that only a dealer who REEAALLY needs a sale would take. Leave the sales guy a card with your name and number and the deal you want and tell him the offer stands. it may take a few months, but that sales guy will eventually have a real bad month, and remember your offer and call you up to make ths sale. Sometimes a crappy sale is better than no sale at all.

I would go to the States but it's an extra hassle that I don't need-travel costs, driving the car back, the prospect of the car being a E36 M3pile and I've taken a trip for nothing. This car needs some touch-up paint on the bumper and a new seat. I can live with the bumper and I'm just going to throw a racing bucket in anyways. If I was buying a Porsche and wanted to save $25,000 then yeah I'd go to the states, but I really can't afford a week off school/work to drive back from Cali or Texas.

I was curious if anyone has pulled off a steal like this. A friend of mine once got a 2nd gen RX7 vert listed at 12k for 6k with brand new tires; it had less than 60,000 miles to boot.

The dealer will still make profit, just not the astronomical return like he would have at 12grand. For reference, here's the car

Edit: Edmunds TMV for a similar car in Rochester NY (2 hours away) is $3694 at dealer retail, trade-in value is $2285.

FWIW....buying a used car from a dealer for that make of car will always be difficult. You can get a better buy from a Chevy dealer selling a Ford, or a Ford dealer selling a Dodge....well, you get the idea.

That said, 2 of the biggest factors in a car's sale price (and sometimes/but in this case, perhaps not) are what someone/anyone will pay to own it and what it's worth. Is demand high in your area? Are Miatas sitting on every corner? But the "killer" aspect in this deal....it's spring heading into summer, prime roadster/convertible weather...this salesperson/dealership knows demand SHOULD be about to rise. You were in a stronger bargaining position 3 months ago.

Miatas have always been expensive in Canada. Interesting stat - in 1990, Canada bought more Miatas per capita than the US. By 1997, the situation had reversed dramatically. But even then, they're on the high side. Prices will jump about 20% in the spring - and this dealer could simply be out of line.

The exception is hardtops. You can get hardtops cheaper in Canada than the US :)

If you don't want to cross into the US, look at Quebec. I remember Miatas being cheaper there for some reason. If you take a weekend trip to Montreal, you'll probably have a few cars to choose from so you can check the car out before driving home.

That said, 2 of the biggest factors in a car's sale price (and sometimes/but in this case, perhaps not) are what someone/anyone will pay to own it and what it's worth. Is demand high in your area? Are Miatas sitting on every corner? But the "killer" aspect in this deal....it's spring heading into summer, prime roadster/convertible weather...this salesperson/dealership knows demand SHOULD be about to rise. You were in a stronger bargaining position 3 months ago.

Oh I know, I didn't have the money together three months ago. Nonetheless, the 1st gens seem to command more money, and there are lots of 2nd gens out there. Even at 20% over book value its still affordable. The thing is he's asking 400% over, when newer, lower mileage cars are going cheaper.

Datsun1500 wrote:

dkreindler wrote: The thing is he's asking 400% over, when newer, lower mileage cars are going cheaper.

Then buy a different one. He has it, you don't, he has the right to ask whatever he wants for it. The dealer is not obligated to sell it to you for $4K because that is all you feel it is worth....

I never said he's obligated, I just wanted to know if its a viable strategy to get a car for cheap, considering the information at my disposal, the economic conditions and the fact that it's been in inventory close to 90 days.

I think that showing a high asking price on the used Miata is simply in the dealer's best interests. After all, while he makes more money selling a used car than a new car, he's in business to sell new cars. With a high asking price on the used Miata he can tell prospects that a new Miata is a good investment as it has good depreciation (I'm not saying that statement is true, or that all dealers are liars). Also, having a used Miata on the lot for 1/4 the price of a new one might steer buyers into the used car rather than buying the new car.

So the asking price might be artificially high. Write your cash offer on the back of your business card, hand deliver it to the sales manager and forget about it. If they call you, you win!

David

Have someone on here that is close to a car check it out for you. I've seen this done a lot when someone is trying to a buy a car that is really far away.

dkreindler wrote: What would you guys do? I really want to go in there with $4000 in an envelope and tell the sales manager I've been watching this car and he can take it or leave it. Thoughts?

Go south, seriously (I'm in Alberta and I know what you mean about Miata prices). My father recently picked up a 2002 Camaro from Cali. It was so retardedly simple getting the car across the border. Find a cheap one (15 years or older would be easiest, but you can probably bring in newer ones if RIV allows it).

I've got a black 97 I'll sell you for $5500... It's a rust free US car, but located in ontario.

I recently sold a 95 Miata to a guy who buys and resales them as a hobby. He told me that the 93's and older are very popular with the Canadians who vacation down in Florida since they are cheaper/easier to import back into Canada. He said once the 94's reach the magical 15 year age (this year I guess), he'll probably stick to buying mostly 94's and up as they will be the car of choice for importing.

Heck, I've got a nice, dry '99 that I'm trying to sell for $4500. Problem for you it's in Houston, Texas.

ww wrote: Because he'll still be paying $4k for a crap can. That $4k down here in the San Francisco Bay Area will get him a cherry 1st gen Miata and he can make a vacation out of the trip to pick it up.

He has $4k Canadian. That's just over $3200 or so US at current exchange rate.

Speaking of Houston:

http://houston.craigslist.org/cto/1107691817.html

Sounds like a road trip is in order. If he's asking $4200, my guess is you can get that down to a number that starts with 3, U.S.

Not mine, and other usual disclaimers apply.

And to think I was in Houston last month

uhhh...just wanted to own page 2

Just import a car...

RIV is $250

AC tax is $100 (if it has it)

Then you pay taxes. The car's title has to sit at the border for 72Hrs.

1 way flights out of Buffalo or Syracuse To Fla. N.C , AZ and all the good rust free states are less then $200.

It's not a hassel at all.

a Hassel is using a plasma cutter to get out suspension bolts that are rusted.

or finding someone has used mono foam to repare rockers..

Ect...