Mazdaspeed3? Denied!

This makes me very sad!

http://jalopnik.com/mazda-is-too-mature-now-to-build-you-a-mazdaspeed3-1769736991

They say a ms3 is childish but another iteration of the rotary powered rx isnt? Some pencil necked nerd must have taken over mazda and left us with an empty shell of what it used to be

I was really looking forward to the 'speed version of this car. It had so much potential.

http://www.autoblog.com/2016/04/07/new-mazdaspeed3-mazdaspeed6-delayed/

Mazda is one of the smaller auto companies out there and in order to stay alive, they have to focus on what sells. Their bread and butter products like the 6 and CX-5 are necessary for them to keep putting out a niche product like the MX-5; the development costs of something like a new MS3 probably outweigh the potential sales volume, especially when you consider that the segment has really heated up since the MS3 was around (FoST, FiST, GTI, Cooper S, upcoming Civic Si turbo, Veloster turbo, Forte SX turbo, WRX to some extent, and so on).

IF the new rotary sports car is a real thing, and I'm not holding my breath on that, chances are good that it will be a rather high-priced halo car intended for the hardcore devotees as opposed to a FR-S/BRZ-like offering. It will get people who have fond memories of past RX-cars into the showroom to buy MX-5 RFs, CX-4s and the like, which is where their money is really made.

Really sad to see that as well. I love the MS3. Never had one but have always thought about it. I feel like there would be no better time than now to have one especially with the competition out now. People are buying hot hatches and small turbo cars. Honda is missing out too with the delayed release of the Si.

In reply to pointofdeparture:

I agree. I'm having a hard time getting as worked up about it as many jalopnik commentators did. The MX5 can't be generating a ton of revenue for Mazda so they have to devote a lot of resources to what does sell in large volumes to stay afloat.

The more people that buy CX5s, CX9s, and 6s the more money Mazda has to develop enthusiast cars which are traditionally low volume despite what the vocal internet minority seems to think.

How many RSs do you think Ford will sell in the US? I'm betting under 75k in the next 5 years. The market just isn't large enough.

I live bat-E36 M3 crazy cars as much as anyone else but they simply don't sell the volume needed to keep the lights on in a non luxury/status symbol setting.

iadr wrote: Mazda is trying to get away from warranty costs, & from their reputation for being "fragile"... a MS3 would be a bad move.

That doesn't match with the idea of making more Wankels. :)

codrus wrote:

iadr wrote: Mazda is trying to get away from warranty costs, & from their reputation for being "fragile"... a MS3 would be a bad move.

That doesn't match with the idea of making more Wankels. :)

Millions (with an S) of 12As and nonturbo 13Bs that went 200k+ would disagree with you. Heck even the original 13B Turbo could be expected to get 150k if you didn't screw around with it.

Remember, rotaries are enjoyed because they are highly durable compared to piston engines in a hard use environment. What they don't like is being toodled around town all the time as some college girl's car that they had to get because OMG IT WAS IN X-MEN.

Disclaimer: 100% of non hardcore rotorhead RX-8 owners I have encountered have been college age non-enthusiasts (who also happened to be girls) who liked the way the car looked. Selling rotaries to non-enthusiasts gets butts in seats but it also is selling the cars to exactly the wrong kind of people.

I get that it's a tough time for Mazda in terms of sales and that they are nearly the smallest car maker selling cars in the US. I understand exactly why they did it, but I'm still really bummed.

It's bigger than just Mazdaspeed and Mazda. To me Mazda was, and maybe still is, the last car company making cars for enthusiasts like myself. BMW used to be scratch that itch, but they ditched that 15 years ago now. Who else is even close? I can't afford a flippin' Porsche, and nothing Honda makes anymore excites me. The Fiesta and Focus ST are the closest, so I guess Ford.

I have driven the new Mazda 3 and I like it as a driver's car. The hot version would have been really cool. I'm generally concerned about the direction car companies are going and I like to hitch my wagon to the idea of Mazda being different. How many other car companies made their best cars LIGHTER than the previous generation? Maybe I just like to drink the kool-aid, but there's not much else out there in the way of new cars that excites me.

Isn't this where we come in?

CyberEric wrote: I get that it's a tough time for Mazda in terms of sales and that they are nearly the smallest car maker selling cars in the US. I understand exactly why they did it, but I'm still really bummed. It's bigger than just Mazdaspeed and Mazda. To me Mazda was, and maybe still is, the last car company making cars for enthusiasts like myself. BMW used to be scratch that itch, but they ditched that 15 years ago now. Who else is even close? I can't afford a flippin' Porsche, and nothing Honda makes anymore excites me. The Fiesta and Focus ST are the closest, so I guess Ford. I have driven the new Mazda 3 and I like it as a driver's car. The hot version would have been really cool. I'm generally concerned about the direction car companies are going and I like to hitch my wagon to the idea of Mazda being different. How many other car companies made their best cars LIGHTER than the previous generation? Maybe I just like to drink the kool-aid, but there's not much else out there in the way of new cars that excites me.

I drank the Kool-aid a long time ago (which is why I have a blown up turbo in my MS3 and a engineless RX-3 wagon sitting in my garage) and I'm sure the Mazdaspeed models will make their return eventually though. Currently they're having trouble getting traction in the US despite being named the most reliable manufacturer over a 5 year period and having 100% of their models recommended by Consumer Reports. Hopefully it's just a matter of time.

Car buying is interesting because it's probably the second or third most expensive item the average person buys over their lifetime. If you got burned by a particular marquee 40 years ago I highly doubt that you'd be willing to give them another shot especially if the Consumer Reports crowd has ingrained into you how reliable specific brands are over that same time period (cough Toyota and Honda cough). Young hip 20 somethings rarely buy new cars due to a lot of factors but college debt is pretty much in the lead on that front so it's virtually impossible to capture young buyers with new cars (see Scion for a gleaming example of that.) All that adds up to a glacial pace for growth in the sector.

According to the article Jalopnik cited, it appears that the next Mazdaspeed models are more postponed than canceled. It appears they are currently focused on a fourth generation Mazda 3, and then plan to make a Mazdaspeed version of that, skipping a Mazdaspeed version of the current generation.

CyberEric wrote: I get that it's a tough time for Mazda in terms of sales and that they are nearly the smallest car maker selling cars in the US. I understand exactly why they did it, but I'm still really bummed. It's bigger than just Mazdaspeed and Mazda. To me Mazda was, and maybe still is, the last car company making cars for enthusiasts like myself. BMW used to be scratch that itch, but they ditched that 15 years ago now. Who else is even close? I can't afford a flippin' Porsche, and nothing Honda makes anymore excites me. The Fiesta and Focus ST are the closest, so I guess Ford. I have driven the new Mazda 3 and I like it as a driver's car. The hot version would have been really cool. I'm generally concerned about the direction car companies are going and I like to hitch my wagon to the idea of Mazda being different. How many other car companies made their best cars LIGHTER than the previous generation? Maybe I just like to drink the kool-aid, but there's not much else out there in the way of new cars that excites me.

I've always thought of Mazda as the working mans BMW car company, they make vehicles that just feel "right"

In reply to Storz:

ditto

In reply to Knurled:

I think it's cute that you think teenage girls saw X-Men

Storz wrote: I've always thought of Mazda as the working mans BMW car company, they make vehicles that just feel "right"

I never really thought about that, but I have a CX-5 and a 330i sitting in my garage right now. There is a LOT in the CX-5 suspension that seems 'inspired' by BMW.

The front control arm bushings could almost interchange. Oddly enough, I think they're about shot on our 75K CX-5, so sounds about right.

The0retical wrote: Currently they're having trouble getting traction in the US despite being named the most reliable manufacturer over a 5 year period and having 100% of their models recommended by Consumer Reports. Hopefully it's just a matter of time.

I had the impression (un-scientific) that they were doing well lately; I know I'm pre-disposed to notice them, but the current-generation 3 and 6 seem to litter the ground around here.

It's really too bad. They have the right drivetrain now (the new Skyactiv Turbo 2.5 in the CX-9) and a willing chassis in the 2014+ 3 and 6. I'm sure it will fit fine in both cars, although I don't know what transmission would go behind it. It's not like they would have to develop an all new engine, chassis, etc. Who knows if there will even be a demand for a new Mazdaspeed car by 2022 or whenever they decide to roll out a new chassis.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if you see that turbo engine in the current 6 as a "V6 replacement". Honda and Toyota still offer a V6 in the Accord and Camry, and Ford and Chevy offer a turbo 4 in their midsizers.

At least other car companies are stepping in with decent offerings, like the Ford ST twins and the upcoming turbo Hondas, while Mazda sits there acting all "mature".

This makes me very sad because I love my 08 Speed3 but it will need to be replaced eventually. I worry that my favorite brand, Mazda, is no longer building cars for enthusiasts. In 2007 you could go to your Mazda dealer and choose between a Speed6, a Speed3, an RX8, or an MX5. Now the only sporty car left in their lineup is the MX5. Sure the new 3 and 6 are nice to drive, but they're not sports cars on the level of the previous Mazdaspeed products.

Eh, I can't get worked up about this. It's still a tarted up econobox and having owned a Focus ST I can say there are alternatives that work just as well or better.

As an enthusiast I'm glad they are putting out the MX-5 and thinking about another rotary. RWD > any FWD product.

I think it's funny that they think they are "more upscale" now.

That isn't what anyone else thinks. Not even Kia owners.

Huckleberry wrote: I think it's funny that they think they are "more upscale" now. That isn't what anyone else thinks. Not even Kia owners.

No kidding! Isn't that what the Infinity brand is for???

I read a few weeks ago that the new 3 isn't selling well enough to justify the ms3. Based solely on the number of them I see driving around (very few), it could be true. I think it's probably true for the 6 even more.

slowride wrote: I read a few weeks ago that the new 3 isn't selling well enough to justify the ms3. Based solely on the number of them I see driving around (very few), it could be true. I think it's probably true for the 6 even more.

If true, I can't imagine this being a case of "the 3 isn't Up-Scale enough". I tend to suspect it is easliy a case of inefective marketing. In my mind, the 3 ought to be selling as easily as the Focus. IF Mazda would advertise it aggressively enough. I can't remeber the last time I saw a good Mazda3 add in any media form.

In reply to WildScotsRacing:

If more advertising equaled more sales, the Chrysler 200 would have been the best-selling car in the country. Unfortunately there's no correlation.

There is a nationwide trend away from compact and midsize cars towards crossovers, which is why Mazda is betting heavily on that market (among many others, most notably Fiat/Chrysler and Nissan). Americans collectively will not buy hatchback cars, but bizarrely we seem to absolutely love them with a mild lift and bigger tires at if you call it a crossover.

The Mazda 3 and 6 consistently get top marks for having some of the nicest interiors under $30k, so they're onto something with their attempts to move upscale considering they had some of the most maligned interiors in the biz a mere five years ago.